Thierry LOTTE Spain Local time: 13:23 Member (2001) English to French + ...
Jun 29, 2004
Salve !
I am reading a french novel containing a lot of Latin quotation with their translation by the author himself.
One of the translation from latin puzzles me a little bit :
“ crede mihi experto Roberto”
Translated in french by :
“ Fiez-vous à moi qui en ai l’expérience”
More or lesss in english : “do trust in me, because I have some experience in such matters”
There is more than 25 years that I sold my “Gaffiot” (the most famous Latin-French-Latin Dic) and I am wondering why “Roberto” have a capital letter…
Roberto seems as a first name for me. Any other possible translation for “Roberto” ¿
FYG there are no characters in this novel whose first name is “Roberto”.
Another tip : the action of this novel takes place in the XVI th century in france and the dialogs are between physicians.
Anybody could be so kind to give me some clue ?
PS : this quotation runs along the 6000 pages of the novel and is always translated in the same way.
[Edited at 2004-06-29 19:13]
[Subject edited by staff or moderator 2004-06-29 23:11]
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BelkisDV United States Local time: 07:23 Spanish to English + ...
Could it be...
Jun 29, 2004
Hi Thierry,
The first and only thing that comes to mind is that it is an expression like: Como Vicente y otros veinte. In other words, "experto" rhymes with "Roberto".
Now I'm puzzled too.
Regards,
Belkis
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Geoffrey Barrow Canada Local time: 07:23 Norwegian to English
Robert Burton - Democritus Junior
Jun 29, 2004
This is a quotation from "The Anatomy of Melancholy" by Robert Burton (1577-1640), using the nom de plume "Democritus Junior".
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Geoffrey Barrow Canada Local time: 07:23 Norwegian to English
Slight correction
Jun 29, 2004
Actually, thinking about it, what you have found is actually a misquotation. I believe the actual words Burton used were
"Experto crede Roberto" (Believe Roberto who has tried it).
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BelkisDV United States Local time: 07:23 Spanish to English + ...
A proverb
Jun 29, 2004
Geoffrey Barrow wrote:
Actually, thinking about it, what you have found is actually a misquotation. I believe the actual words Burton used were
\"Experto crede Roberto\" (Believe Roberto who has tried it).
ROBERT BURTON
English writer, philosopher and humorist
(1576 - 1640)
BUY BOOK RELATED TO
ROBERT BURTON
Believe Robert who has tried it.
[Lat., Experto crede Roberto.]
- Anatomy of Melancholy, a proverb quoted by him in the introduction
[Experience : Proverbs]
Regards,
Belkis
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Thierry LOTTE Spain Local time: 13:23 Member (2001) English to French + ...
TOPIC STARTER
Not only a quotation : part of a
Jun 29, 2004
Geoffrey said :
Actually, thinking about it, what you have found is actually a misquotation. I believe the actual words Burton used were
"Experto crede Roberto" (Believe Roberto who has tried it).
Thanks Geoffrey, but this quotation is part of a dialog. Maybe I misused the word "quotation".,
I meaned than in the french text, there is a whole dialog in latin between a "Bachelor of Arts" and a "Doctor in Medicins", that`s why they are not "quoting" somebody. In such a case, why should they use "crede mihi" ?
The same expression comes back many times in the other volumes of this novel and is always translated in the same way (in French).
Furthermore, upon your information :
This is a quotation from "The Anatomy of Melancholy" by Robert Burton (1577-1640), using the nom de plume "Democritus Junior".
The "facts" take place in 1572, that is to say 5 years before the birth of Robert Burton.
Could be a mistake of Robert Merle (the author) but I strongly doubt it because this author is usually trustworth.
Unfortunately I cannot ask him directly because he died 3 months ago...
Sorry for my poor english and thank you again for your help.
[Edited at 2004-06-29 21:04]
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xxxsarahl United States Local time: 04:23 English to French + ...
mon humble avis
Jun 29, 2004
Il y a bien des lustres que j'ai transmis le gaffiot familial à la génération suivante mais voici mon interprétation pour ce qu'elle vaut :
crede mihi experto : fiez-vous à moi, l'expert.
Le Roberto rime avec experto comme dans "Tu parles Charles, no way Jose" etc.
Sarah parla
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Narasimhan Raghavan India Local time: 16:53 Member (2007) English to Tamil + ...
My modest attempt
Jun 29, 2004
Most probably it is an impersonal name like Jack in the saying "All work and no play makes Jack a dull boy" and Roberto does indeed rhyme with experto.
Now, "crede mihi experto Roberto" can perhaps mean:
"Fiez-vous à Roberto (c'est à dire à moi) qui en ai l’expérience"
Regards,
N.Raghavan
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irat56 France Local time: 13:23 English to French + ...
A la demande de Sarah!
Jun 30, 2004
Ma très humble petite pierre à vos savantes réponses:
"Roberto" est le transparent "Robert Merle" lui-même qui se mete en scène comme "Docteur d'expérience" dans sa saga qui commence dans "En nos vertes Années", l'enfance te la jeunesse de Pierre de Siorac.
Robert Merle fut Professeur (Anglais!) à la Fac de RENNES...dans mes vertes années.
Pour la traduction, je dirai que "Roberto" n'étant pas un vocatif, c'est bien le locuteur qui est concerné...et c'est pourquoi on ne trouve guère le prénom cité par la suite.
Pour éviter la confusion, j'aurais (peut-être) traduit par : "Moi, Robert, te dis d'avoir confiance en mon expérience", ou quelque chose d'approchant.
Peut-être serez-vous ici aidé?
Bon courage!
Pierre
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Thierry LOTTE Spain Local time: 13:23 Member (2001) English to French + ...
TOPIC STARTER
At least, the solutions is the following :
Jul 14, 2004
Well !
I think that, at least, the mystery has been solved.
I wrote in my question the following:
One of the translation from Latin puzzles me a little bit :
“ crede mihi experto Roberto”
Translated in French by :
“ Fiez-vous à moi qui en ai l’expérience”
More or less in English : “do trust in me, because I have some experience in such matters”
The problem was the following :
FYG there are no characters in this novel whose first name is “Roberto”.
Another tip : the action of this novel takes place in the XVI th century in France and the dialogs are between physicians.
Anybody could be so kind to give me some clue ?
I think that Robert Merle (or me think the editor) have been a little bit « weak » in this case (I feel very ashamed to pretend such a thing, but…).
In fact, the protagonist who pronounces this phrase is the reverent doctor in Medicine « Fogacer » which, later on, we learn that his first name is « Robert ».
So, everything is thus « correct » from a Latin grammatical point of view.
In the volume VI the author repeat the same expression saying : « Crede mihi experto Johano » which is translated – correctly – by : « Croyez-moi- Jean – car j’en ai l’expérience… » and as the protagonist is « Jean de Siorac » everything sounds cool…
Furthermore, in the same volume the expression : « crede mihi experto » is always translated in French by : «Fiez-vous à moi qui en ai l’expérience”.
Which sound, now, perfectly correct.
Thanks to all of you who brought me their help in this matter.
[Edited at 2004-07-14 00:49]
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