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Sarcasm from KudoZ asker?
Thread poster: Bertha S. Deffenbaugh

Bertha S. Deffenbaugh  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 05:17
English to Spanish
+ ...
Jan 23, 2002

Why should we put up with these postings?



Does the asker really think someone can answer \" cuenta de cabezas\" ? I don\'t.



http://www.proz.com/?sp=h&eid_c=13756&id=137268



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Mats Wiman  Identity Verified
Sweden
Local time: 14:17
Member (2000)
German to Swedish
+ ...

MODERATOR
Put up with? Jan 23, 2002

You don\'t have to answer!



It\'s as simple as that.



Who is hurt by this question?



MW


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two2tango  Identity Verified
Argentina
Local time: 09:17
Member
English to Spanish
+ ...
Sarcasm Jan 24, 2002

I side with Bertha. The asker seems to expect very little from us... Why does he/she bother to ask?

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Marcus Malabad  Identity Verified
Canada
Local time: 14:17
Member (2002)
German to English
+ ...
agree with Mats Jan 24, 2002

Dear Bertha,



If you don\'t care for the pro\'s tone, then you\'re not forced to answer. Someone else who\'s not offended by the alleged insult - intended or not - will answer. And several already have. I personally think that tone was simply abrupt but not offensive.



Marcus


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Sven Petersson  Identity Verified
Sweden
Local time: 14:17
English to Swedish
+ ...
Agree with Mats! Jan 24, 2002

Squashing is the electronic form of book burning.



Squashing is inherently evil and should be forbidden.



Free Speech is a Human Right!



May it one day reach ProZ!



Sven.


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Eugenia Corbo  Identity Verified
Local time: 08:17
English to Spanish
+ ...
Agree with Mats and Marcus Jan 24, 2002

Perhaps the comment between parentheses was unnecessary, but that does not make it offensive.



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VBaby
Local time: 13:17
English to French
+ ...
Let's all grow up Jan 24, 2002

I fully agree with Mats and Marcus. Let\'s all grow up and stop whingeing about supposed KudoZ abuse from the askers.

KudoZ is a two-way street: askers are free to ask, and pros are free to answer -- or not, if they feel they are being abused, taken advantage of etc.

In this particular case, far from thinking that the asker was deliberately abusive, I\'d suggest that he/she is an experienced KudoZ user (or even a member?) who has been dismayed (appalled?) many times by the sheer literalness, inadequacy and poor quality of many of the answers that some self-appointed pros hasten to post in the dim hope of garnering a few points.

This is a serious issue: the credibility of KudoZ, and by extension the whole site, is more at risk from petulant and ill-informed answerers than it is from any supposed abuse from the askers.

Let\'s say you are a non-pro and you ask the translation of \"blue (color)\" into French. If you ask Babelfish, they\'ll tell you \"bleu\" and you\'ll have your answer. If you ask ProZ, the first answerer will also tell you \"bleu\", but then there likely will be half a dozen others posting answers such as \"azur\", \"bleu clair\", \"bleu marine\", \"bleu foncé\", \"outremer\" and any other variations and then bickering among themselves via the peer-grades.

This happens all the time. I\'m thinking of two recent English to French question, one about having a sale (soldes) and another about the plain meaning of balance sheet (bilan), which both degenerated in this way.

I\'m sorry Bertha to have hijacked your forum to make my point and I want to make clear, to avoid any misunderstanding, that you and all the other previous colleagues who reacted to your post are true professionals who provide real and valuable help to askers and never engage in the kind of behaviour I\'m castigating.


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Sheila Hardie  Identity Verified
Spain
Local time: 14:17
Partial member
Catalan to English
+ ...
I agree with Mats, Marcus and Eugenia Jan 24, 2002

I wholeheartedly agree with Mats, Marcus and Eugenia. I personally did not interpret the asker\'s question as sarcastic. I agree, it could be seen as abrupt, but as with most things in life, it just depends on the way you look at it. An optimist sees the glass as half full, a pessimist sees it as half empty. In any case, as Marcus said, no-one forced you to answer the question, Bertha.



Sheila


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John Kinory
Local time: 13:17
English to Hebrew
+ ...
Very much against squashing, but ... Jan 24, 2002

why put up with askers who say, \'What does xyz mean, dammit?\'.

I can only laugh at members so desperate for points that they bother to answer such a boor.
[addsig]


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Werner George Patels, M.A., C.Tran.(ATIO)
Local time: 08:17
German to English
+ ...
No insult Jan 24, 2002

I believe it was a weak attempt at being funny.



However, I have seen people (so-called \"multilingual pros\") give similar answers - and quite frequently so! So, I find nothing wrong with this asker\'s admonition.


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Bertha S. Deffenbaugh  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 05:17
English to Spanish
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
What are you talking about, Sven? Jan 24, 2002

Nobody has squashed anything!

Relax!


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Patricia Lutteral  Identity Verified
Argentina
Local time: 09:17
English to Spanish
+ ...
I fully agree with VBaby Jan 24, 2002

For many answers, the word \"appalling\" fits perfectly.



I also think that this particular asker tried to find a soft way of keeping point-chasers away from the screen.



The EN>ES community shows many examples of answererers who lack the most superficial knowledge of the language(s) involved, let alone subtleties like specific fields of specialisation.



And again, nobody is forced to answer.



Regards,



Patricia




[addsig]


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Silvina Beatriz Codina  Identity Verified
Argentina
Local time: 09:17
Member (2002)
English to Spanish
+ ...
Unfortunately, that's not impossible Jan 24, 2002

I agree with Werner. I\'m sure most of the people who participate in this site are excellent professionals and would not dream of giving such a stupid answer, but there are also some so-called translators who are perfectly capable of doing so... These guys (and gals) are a scourge for our profession and a major drawback for the serious translators\' efforts to dignify the translation métier, which in the eyes of laymen is something that any mildly bilingual person can do.

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xxxLia Fail  Identity Verified
Spain
Local time: 14:17
Spanish to English
+ ...
Loggerheads? Jan 24, 2002

I can see why Bertha was possibly offended and yet think that Nakina\'s explanation was entirely appropriate. And the matter should be left at that.



The fact is not always do people post or answer questions as we would like them to. As a poster I often feel irritated at the ingenous, dead literal answers I sometimes get (what any mini dictionary would tell me), yet this only serves to highlight some of the really inspired answers some people consistently submit. And maybe it\'s my inadequate explanation anyway, to begin with.



As an answerer I\'m sure my answers are occasionally off the mark too, and I may have entirely missed the point altogether. But all I want to do is help.



I think any kind of personal response is out of place except in private emails, or when there is abuse of the site and its facilities in any way, in which case a polite comment is sufficient.







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Bertha S. Deffenbaugh  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 05:17
English to Spanish
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
You're right, Mats, I don't HAVE to answer... Jan 31, 2002

... but I am a member of this community as well as many other EXCELLENT professionals who would never give such a lousy answer.



I was not offended. I was very surprised indeed to see that some askers only acknowledge the poor answerers while they do not seem to accept that PROZ is, in fact, crowded with good and very good professionals. Professionals that can and must be trusted.



When I saw that question, I did not think about the poor answers some people do give.[ and I will not deny that fact]

Instead I preferred to take into consideration the many brilliant and professional answers that are given every single day by good, reliable professionals.



That simple.



Regards to all,



Bertha


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