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Thread poster: Heinrich Pesch

Heinrich Pesch  Identity Verified
Finland
Local time: 09:52
Member (2003)
Finnish to German
+ ...
May 3, 2007

Again one of these:
Someone needs two documents translated, 120 pages each. They send pdfs, but promise rtf for translation.
At this moment maybe dozens of translators sit and convert these documents and analyse them. Each conversion about one hour with Abbyy.
If only oursourcers would learn either to send the originals or to analyse them first and ask a quote for the number of words minus repetitions. Is it really so difficult?

Cheers
Heinrich


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Jan Sundström  Identity Verified
Sweden
Local time: 08:52
English to Swedish
+ ...
The fate of big companies May 3, 2007

Hi Heinrich and all,

Sure, this is bound to happen over and over. I've done it countless times myself.

But it's an inherent flaw of big companies. The guy/girl who created the PDF and sits on the original is not around, so the middleman who sits on the PDF just grabs whatever is in front of him/her, and expect us to make up for it...

Perhaps the creator of the PDF is on sick leave, holiday, transfered to another department or another company alltogether, or the file was created by a consultant or ad agency that the client no longer works with. The client forgot to take backups of the original file and discarded the computer when upgrading.

All these things has happen, and they WILL happen again, trust me. Unfortunately there's very little we can do about it on the receiving end.

So just bite the bullet and keep abbying those PDF's!

/Jan


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xxxNMR
France
Local time: 08:52
French to Dutch
+ ...
It is. May 3, 2007

Direct clients really don't understand why the translator should need a Word document or the original file. For them, the PDF file is the latest one, the one that has been printed and given to the press, for instance. They make corrections directly on the XPress-file or the PDF until the hour before the shareholders' meeting! There may be hundreds of differences between the PDF and the original Word file. The only way to obtain a translation of this newest version is to extract the PDF or, if this is impossible or too complicated, to type directly the translation in Word.

Agencies have to extract in each case, because they want to know how much words there are (an cost estimation has to be sent to the client). And they know in most cases that translators want to work on Word files. But a good agency will prepare the work for the translators, especially if the translation has to be done in x languages.

If an client sents me PDF files, he cannot ask me for discounts, all words are new words! And in my estimation I state that I will send back a complete Word file. How I do that (extraction, typing directly, copying and pasting) is my problem.

[Bijgewerkt op 2007-05-03 09:25]


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Boris Sigalov
Local time: 09:52
English to Russian
I charge extra for translation of PDF files May 3, 2007

NMR wrote:

If an client sents me PDF files, he cannot ask me for discounts, all words are new words!


Usually I don't offer discounts for repetitions and translation of PDF files is a subject for special surcharges (up to 100% in case of poor PDF quality or very complex layout).


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xxxNMR
France
Local time: 08:52
French to Dutch
+ ...
I don't recreate the layout May 3, 2007

Boris Sigalov wrote:

NMR wrote:

If an client sents me PDF files, he cannot ask me for discounts, all words are new words!


Usually I don't offer discounts for repetitions and translation of PDF files is a subject for special surcharges (up to 100% in case of poor PDF quality or very complex layout).

I don't recreate layout or tables, in these cases. This would be completely useless if the client is only asking me for a translation. The printing house will be copying these paragraphs in their files.

If they want me to respect the layout of the original document, they have to send me the Quark files (or Powerpoint, Pagemaker, or whatever), and I charge a supplement. If I have to create a new layout, I charge accordingly, on an hourly basis, and after translation.


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Fernando Tognis  Identity Verified
Argentina
Local time: 03:52
Member (2006)
Spanish to English
+ ...
Same situation some months ago May 3, 2007

Hi, Heinrich.
I was in your shoes some months ago and asked for advice to colleagues in this forum.

http://www.proz.com/topic/67894

Perhaps same advice could be useful for you too.
Regards,

Fernando


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ViktoriaG  Identity Verified
Canada
Local time: 02:52
English to French
+ ...
Two points May 3, 2007

1. It takes me extra time and costly resources to work on these, so I charge extra.

2. I will not go to lengths to keep the formatting - I am paid to translate and that's my trade. If they want the DTP as well - they will just have to find somebody else.


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Heinrich Pesch  Identity Verified
Finland
Local time: 09:52
Member (2003)
Finnish to German
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
No advice needed this time May 3, 2007

As I stated in my posting, the customer has the files in rtf, but sends pdf to all agencies, which then send these to all translors for a quote. Because for a quote each translator has to extract the text and analyse it, which takes about 2 hours. So maybe 50 translators sit and spend 100 hours for quotes, but only one will get the job in the end.
I recieved these two pdfs already from three different agencies and from the endclient directly. Finally I got also the rtfs and could land a quote based on the original documents.
Lets see who gets the job.
Cheers
Heinrich


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Claudia Aguero  Identity Verified
Costa Rica
Local time: 00:52
Spanish to English
+ ...
Can it be exported to Word? May 6, 2007

In some cases PDFs can be extracted and pasted in Word. I have made it several times.

In most cases, I receive many PDFs of printed documents that secretaries scan to send them to me.

I thoses cases, my mom "hits the jackpot" and counts the words for me. Of course, when I tell her she always complains about it, but at the end, she does a very good job and even estimates the price.


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xxxNMR
France
Local time: 08:52
French to Dutch
+ ...
Two answers May 6, 2007

Viktoria Gimbe wrote:

1. It takes me extra time and costly resources to work on these, so I charge extra.

I prefer charge rather high prices for everything (hardcopy translating, PDFs, even most files). If an agency prepares the work very well, I can calculate a discount. But I don't give a double discount: one because it's an agency and the second for repetitions, for instance.

2. I will not go to lengths to keep the formatting - I am paid to translate and that's my trade. If they want the DTP as well - they will just have to find somebody else.

This is if course very personal: before working as a translator I did DTP and I kept the software. (I got my biggest direct client, 15 years ago, because I was able to deliver the translation in Word Perfect 4.2!).


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