Andy Watkinson Spain Local time: 22:30 Catalan to English + ...
Even more puzzled
Jan 29
Elwftheriosis wrote - "- Total free days in the last 9 years: six (6) - including weekends."
Andy W. wrote:
Bit sad, really......
Eleftheriosis wtote:
"More than thrt. It's pathetic.
But that's a state in which other translators are
as well
a) Nobody expects the Spanish Inquistion - come on...
b) Mal de muchos, consuelo de tontos.
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Nicole Schnell United States Local time: 13:30 Member English to German + ...
How do you know, Eleftherios?
Jan 29
Eleftherios Kritikakis wrote:
...2 days for a household. Clients lost during that time are never regained.
You wrote that you only took six days off during the past six years.
Clients want their best translators to be fresh and rested, not burnt out and exhausted. "Sleep is important," say my PMs. Also: When I go on vacation, I send them photos of the hotel rooms that I booked, and they write back: "Cool!!! I envy you. See you Monday in two weeks! Have fun!". The same goes for dentist appointments. It also makes a good impression because it indicates that 1.) you take care of yourself (extremely important!), 2.) you can afford it (even more important!)
Give it a try. Being a translator can be a lot of fun.
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Eleftherios Kritikakis United States Local time: 15:30 Member (2003) Greek to English + ...
Market size
Jan 29
Nicole Schnell wrote:
Eleftherios Kritikakis wrote:
...2 days for a household. Clients lost during that time are never regained. [/quote]
You wrote that you only took six days off during the past six years.
Clients want their best translators to be fresh and rested, not burnt out and exhausted.
You know, it's also the size of the market. Greek is a tiny market (compared to German). The vast majority of jobs are concentrated in only a few agencies that are burnt out themselves
Give it a try. Being a translator can be a lot of fun.
All jobs can be fun, depending on where you are and how you do it. When I was in the financial industry in Greece for AIG, it was fun as well, due to the local "fun-loving" culture. I could be productive, and have my adventures as well. However, in my days in the financial/legal industry in the U.S., it was something like an army with white shirts, mostly due to regulations - ah yes, and due to that I wanted to go to the top - credentials-wise and I made it with my ChFC studies.
I have had good times in the financial industry as well..
... but you can't ignore the fact that lately the entire translation industry is becoming an assembly line.
Even creativity is thrown out the window, in non-critical free-style text projects, by quality manager who are scared to death to divert from the source even to the level of a comma.
In one case where I was an editor, the agency told me to "correct the inconsistencies" that the translator made, and I told them that I agreed more with the translator, since in such a text, it added more flavor and made it interesting to read (it was a marketing-based story without "key words"). Following the instructions of the agency, I turned it into something boring, and I noted that in my delivery email.
Thank God for a few reasonable (actual human) clients (and two of them are actually large companies), and also thank God for my direct clients, faithful and good payers.
But in small markets, things are not stable (most times, it's either 100 or zero - there is not enough market size to provide cushion, it's like having a grocery store, among 10 other grocery stores, in a small village). It's either die from overworking or get hungry - the small market factor. Unpredictable and unsafe in all aspects.
You know what's actually funny in a sense? Client sends a 14K project for the weekend, and wishes you "have a nice weekend" (!). Then Monday morning he replies to your delivery email "thanks - how was your weekend?".
And the additions, the amendments, the post-DTP triple checks, the this the that... look at a day that was empty at 9:00am to become a panic zone with more than 40-50 emails by 11am. At the end you' re also doing the DTP reviewer for some of them without realizing it. So when is there time to finally translate? Ah, yes, after 7pm. I'll take a brake for lunch at 9.30 pm. (that's not a typo) - Goodnight (and good luck) - I'm going back to work as we speak, thank for the long breaks
PS. By the way, anyone knows a reliable part time secretary in the NW Chicago suburbs... my pending invoices exceeded 400 again (I'm not kidding) and I currently work losing money.
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inkweaver Germany Local time: 22:30 English to German + ...
Just wondering...
Jan 29
If I suffered so much as a translator that I would see myself forced to post long rants I would certainly consider a change of career.
If I saw myself forced to work years on end with only six days off I would think that something might be wrong with my time management. Perhaps I would come to the conclusion that I should just concentrate on my work instead of spending too much time on complaining how bad things are.
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Nicole Schnell United States Local time: 13:30 Member English to German + ...
The market and more
Jan 29
Eleftherios Kritikakis wrote:
You know, it's also the size of the market. Greek is a tiny market (compared to German). The vast majority of jobs are concentrated in only a few agencies that are burnt out themselves
Then you also have less competitors.
I just checked:
it was fun as well, due to the local "fun-loving" culture. I could be productive, and have my adventures as well.
"Fun" doesn't mean partying and laid-back communication with clients. I am too old for that. Fun means hard, yet rewarding work that I can always be proud of.
... but you can't ignore the fact that lately the entire translation industry is becoming an assembly line.
Even creativity is thrown out the window, in non-critical free-style text projects, by quality manager who are scared to death to divert from the source even to the level of a comma.
Educate your clients. You might be twice the age of the PMs that you are working with, and believe me - they are eager to learn. The same goes for streamlining all correspondence. I also had to tell several PMs that I am not interested in any "first come, first serve" games. Always works like a charm.
Client sends a 14K project for the weekend, and wishes you "have a nice weekend" (!). Then Monday morning he replies to your delivery email "thanks - how was your weekend?".
If you agree to such conditions... yikes.
PS. By the way, anyone knows a reliable part time secretary in the NW Chicago suburbs... my pending invoices exceeded 400 again (I'm not kidding) and I currently work losing money.
I can relate to that... same here. However, my largest clients often pay earlier than agreed when I ask them nicely. They know that I am a complete slob when it comes to invoice writing. But after all, they hired me for translating, not for demonstrating outstanding bookkeeping skills.
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Oksana Zoria Ukraine Local time: 23:30 Member (2011) English to Russian + ...
That's it, I've got it now!
Jan 29
Eleftherios, sorry to say that, but you are a workaholic. I've seen too much of them in this industry to know the symptoms. I was a workaholic myself some time ago (which caused problems in the family, led to a divorce and almost to a nervous breakdown). Then I realized, that no matter how much money I make, all is spent in due course. No matter how many jobs I take or refuse to take, there still are tons of jobs there for me. We live in information age, and information multiples in geometric progression. Look at the number of web-sites now and 10 years ago. Look at the number of papers, internal memos and all other documents produced by companies and banks. Look at the huge amount of EU standards, which should be translated into all European languages. Red tape does not diminish, it expands.
You should try to see it: there is and there will always be a work for us there. There is and there always will be money for us there. I do not know of a freelance translator who died of starvation. But, unfortunately, I heard of the translators, who had nervous breakdown, infarction and carpal tunnel syndrome (when you cannot move your hand or part of the body). I heard of the owners of translation agencies, who sold their businesses and swore never to touch a translation job with a 20-feet pole.
It's funny to have to say it to a Greek, but be more relaxed. Try to see the bright side of the things, to have some fun. Spend more time with your friends, with books, go in for sports or to the opera, or do whatever you like. Come to Ukraine or Poland for Euro-2012 or go elsewhere, where you dreamed to go all your life. Learn another language (yes, why not? It is quite refreshing and money bringing:). Do something, for God's sake, not just translating kilos and millions of words. Who will spend your money for you?...
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Paul Carmichael Spain Local time: 22:30 Member (2011) Spanish to English + ...
TOPIC STARTER
There's no going back...
Jan 29
Eleftherios Kritikakis wrote:
Going back to our IT friend who started the thread: go back to IT
Heh. It's not so simple. I left IT 8 years ago. Eight years out of IT leaves me unemployable in that field.
For what it's worth, I didn't leave IT to translate for a living. Actually, I wouldn't return to IT really, unless I was driven to it. The kids have grown up and live in a different country, I am 50 years old with no mortgage and the wife earns a few euros teaching English to Spanish children.
I don't want to earn the megamoney that I used to earn in IT. It's not that important to me any more (it never really was). But my pension funds aren't worth a whole lot, so I'd like to be able to earn a steady income for another 10 years if possible. If I could clear 1000 euros per month, I'd be over the moon - as long as I didn't have to work too hard
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Sheila Wilson Spain Local time: 21:30 Member (2007) English + ...
Believe in your value (sorry, I know that sounds facile :-))
Jan 29
Paul Carmichael wrote:
Eight years out of IT leaves me unemployable in that field.
For what it's worth, I didn't leave IT to translate for a living. Actually, I wouldn't return to IT really, unless I was driven to it. The kids have grown up and live in a different country, I am 50 years old with no mortgage and the wife earns a few euros teaching English to Spanish children.
I don't want to earn the megamoney that I used to earn in IT. It's not that important to me any more (it never really was). But my pension funds aren't worth a whole lot, so I'd like to be able to earn a steady income for another 10 years if possible. If I could clear 1000 euros per month, I'd be over the moon - as long as I didn't have to work too hard
I know exactly how you feel, Paul. My husband and I and our daughter have all done the megabucks thing and realised it's not what it's cracked up to be. I was a well-paid programmer in the UK, only becoming an EFL trainer and translator when I left the country. After a couple of years I was unemployable in IT, now I'm a complete dunce - where are those mountains of cards that I used to get back from the punch girls? Where are the foot-high piles of COBOL dumps after an overnight test run?
I may be wrong, but I see you as someone who really needs to specialise, to cater for a niche market. Maybe you should concentrate on those subjects you WANT to translate. The Spanish are mad about motor-racing in general and bikes in particular so there must be a lot of texts in those areas produced in Spanish, and they'll be interested to read anything written on the subject in English. Perhaps you should contact likely direct clients.
And above all, forget about the lower end of the market. Just ignore it. It won't go away, but you can go away from it. Insist on charging 10, 15, 20, ?? cents per word, making exceptions only if you want to. I truly believe that if you turn down some low-paid jobs today and spend that time in "agressive" marketing, you'll see a return in the long term in terms of both earnings and interest value of texts translated.
That's the theory anyway - personally, I've more than half implemented it and I'm still working on it. Quality of life has to be more important than any of the luxuries money can buy. If you have bread on the table and a warm bed to sleep in, then you're fine. Who needs this year's fashion and the latest model of microwave? Your time and your expertise are far too valuable to waste on such frippery. Just make sure you convince potential clients of their value.
Sheila
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Paul Carmichael Spain Local time: 22:30 Member (2011) Spanish to English + ...
TOPIC STARTER
Times, they are a changin'
Jan 29
Sheila Wilson wrote:
I know exactly how you feel, Paul. My husband and I and our daughter have all done the megabucks thing and realised it's not what it's cracked up to be. I was a well-paid programmer in the UK, only becoming an EFL trainer and translator when I left the country. After a couple of years I was unemployable in IT, now I'm a complete dunce - where are those mountains of cards that I used to get back from the punch girls? Where are the foot-high piles of COBOL dumps after an overnight test run?
Well, I left behind an anti-virus scanning engine written entirely in C++ and assembler. I believe they may have "ported" it to C#, whatever that might be. I'm sure it's all for the best, but I'm well out of it.
I may be wrong, but I see you as someone who really needs to specialise, to cater for a niche market. Maybe you should concentrate on those subjects you WANT to translate. The Spanish are mad about motor-racing in general and bikes in particular so there must be a lot of texts in those areas produced in Spanish, and they'll be interested to read anything written on the subject in English. Perhaps you should contact likely direct clients.
Heh. I see you know a little of me. One of the benefits of earning loadsamoney was it financed what was my passion - blatting around racetracks on motorcycles. But there were never enough free days.
-thinks- That would be nice. A monthly translation into Spanish of an article from the English language motorcyle press...
And above all, forget about the lower end of the market. Just ignore it. It won't go away, but you can go away from it. Insist on charging 10, 15, 20, ?? cents per word, making exceptions only if you want to. I truly believe that if you turn down some low-paid jobs today and spend that time in "agressive" marketing, you'll see a return in the long term in terms of both earnings and interest value of texts translated.
Hmm. "Aggressive" isn't me in any sense of the word. But I fully intend ignoring those ads that come from proz. Question now is, do I continue paying a sub, when I can post here for free?
Thanks for your interest, Sheila. And yes, I think you know where I'm coming from
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Sheila Wilson Spain Local time: 21:30 Member (2007) English + ...
Takes one to know one
Jan 29
[quote]Paul Carmichael wrote:
Heh. I see you know a little of me. One of the benefits of earning loadsamoney was it financed what was my passion - blatting around racetracks on motorcycles. But there were never enough free days.[quote]
Well, your website mentions your love of motorcycling, and one of your samples here is a piece on Carlos Checa, so... you're well on the way to selling yourself as an expert. Anyway, as a former "passenger" on a racing sidecar, I reckon I can sense fellow bikers!
Question now is, do I continue paying a sub, when I can post here for free?
Keep paying the sub! Very many paying members don't answer posts, but we don't cancel our membership. In fact, it becomes even more important in encouraging our clients to approach us. Even in our crowded pairs, having a few KudoZ points in the right subject areas can put us high in the directory listings when outsourcers search using specific criteria. They'll probably only send private job posts to those who appear on the first page or two. As a non-paying member, you'll be tens of pages down even if you have loads of KudoZ and are perfect for the job.
You also get unlimited use of the Blue Board so you can check out every outsourcer who approaches you or you might be tempted to approach.
Sheila
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, I reckon I can sense fellow bikers!
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