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Preference will be given to male applicant..
Thread poster: texjax DDS PhD

texjax DDS PhD  Identity Verified
Local time: 00:51
Member (2006)
English to Italian
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Aug 26, 2006

..but all application will be considered.

I am appalled by this phrase, which appears in a recent job posting.

I do not mean to start a new war of the sexes here, or to remind to the people of short memory of a cultural revolution that took place years ago and the results of which are by the many considered integral part of the intellectual and social foundations of the modern era.

But I wonder…What makes a male translator more suitable for this type of assignment?
Does it involve heavy lifting or such? Does the Y chromosome affect the attitude toward using skype, maybe? I just wonder…:roll:
Another small question: is it even legal to post a job offer in these terms? Or maybe the fact that they specify ‘..but all application will be considered’ makes it somewhat acceptable?
Every answer or comment will be more than welcome.
Thank you in advance and sorry for bothering and bringing you back in a time where the word suffragette was nowhere to be found in any dictionary.

Tex

PS. I do apologize for posting two forums in the same day, but this doesn’t make me laugh at all..




[Edited at 2006-08-27 01:56]


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Teresa Bento  Identity Verified
Portugal
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Exactly! Aug 26, 2006

If the person in question is looking for a freelance translator, why giving preference to a male?

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Alfredo Tutino  Identity Verified
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quite right! Aug 26, 2006

I was debating with myself: to open a forum or just ask a job moderator to step in?

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Claudia Krysztofiak  Identity Verified
Germany
Local time: 06:51
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They are easier to handle ... Aug 26, 2006

Since it is well-known that females are far more intelligent than males (proof: there is one google hit for "females are far more intelligent" and none for "males are far more intelligent")
the outsourcer just wishes to work with someone who is more easily influenced, cheated and easier to handle.

)


Well seriously: I cannot imagine a sensible reason if it is a translation job. It could make sense if it was a voice-over.

But then again, I have heard that there are people out there, who behave strangely and and do not act with common sense. Maybe this is one of those rare examples.


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Susana Galilea  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 23:51
English to Spanish
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other side of the coin... Aug 26, 2006

You might be interested in this related thread:

http://www.proz.com/topic/42112

All best,

Susana


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Ralf Lemster  Identity Verified
Germany
Local time: 06:51
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Contact a Jobs moderator... Aug 26, 2006

Alfredo Tutino wrote:

I was debating with myself: to open a forum or just ask a job moderator to step in?


Contacting a Jobs moderator (one at a time, please...) is the right thing to do - that is exactly why there's a link at the bottom of each forum posting. Posting such a requirement without giving a good reason is against the rules - in fact, in the case at hand, I had explicitly asked the poster to remove the requirement, or substantiate it. What he ended up doing was to incorporate it somewhere else, so it slipped my attention. I have removed the job, asking the poster to re-post without said limitation, or to substantiate it.

Contacting a Jobs moderator instead of posting a forum topic would have allowed us to act more quickly.

Best regards,
Ralf


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Alfredo Tutino  Identity Verified
Local time: 06:51
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You're right, Ralph... Aug 26, 2006

but suddenly having dinner became top priority...
But surely I'll remember it for next time


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texjax DDS PhD  Identity Verified
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Ralf Aug 26, 2006

Ralf, you are a great moderator. All my appreciation for you and the work you do for the community.
Happy ProZ-Birthday!

Cheers to you all,

B.



[Edited at 2006-08-26 20:03]


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Dimitri Van Vossel
Local time: 06:51
Dutch to English
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When I read it I knew it was going to stir things up... Aug 26, 2006

...and I understand the commotion.
What I don't understand is WHY any outsourcer would put an explicit offence in their job offer. I mean, they might as well sift through the job applications, only retaining the male applicants.
But indeed, this discussion is getting old. Let's all just face the fact that some people out there judge by race, by gender and by the way other people look.
I blame the parents and religion and I think those people are wrong.
I'm still going to have to cut my hair if I want to keep working where I do and get higher up, but that's just the way the world spins at the moment. Let's hope some day we can get over this crap and focus on more important things in life and let's remember we all have a job to do in this field.
On the other hand, maybe there's a perfectly acceptable reason for the preference of a male translator, which would be a pity, because I would have spent 5 mins typing this text for nothing


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texjax DDS PhD  Identity Verified
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the dream Aug 26, 2006

Maybe you are right
But indeed, this discussion is getting old. Let's all just face the fact that some people out there judge by race, by gender and by the way other people look.

and it's just the way it is...
but I will never stop dreaming of a better world, colored like a rainbow, and never ever stop fighting for the dream to become a reality.


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Jörgen Slet  Identity Verified
Estonia
Local time: 07:51
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Maybe all they want is equality :) Aug 26, 2006

As you know, there is a lot of legislative pressure in all countries to hire equal numbers of both sexes in higher-paid jobs. Surprising as it may seem, sometimes this works both ways. Since the translation industry is rather female-dominated, they might just be trying to achive an equality of sexes amongst their ranks

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texjax DDS PhD  Identity Verified
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Jorgen Aug 26, 2006

Thank you for your comment Jorgen
As you know, there is a lot of legislative pressure in all countries to hire equal numbers of both sexes in higher-paid jobs.

They say that everything is possible in love and war...but not in law.
I took the time to look at the laws in place in the country mentioned by the poster. Just a couple of passages from the official document that address the issue of the elimination of discrimination in respect of employment of the above mentioned country.
"The YY recognizes the principle of elimination of discrimination in respect of employment. Section X of the Constitution of XX guarantees to every individual protection against discrimination by reason of race, place of origin, political opinions, colour, creed or sex. By virtue of the provisions of the Constitution...an aggrieved person may seek redress of his right by applying to the Supreme Court."

and so on..(I can send you the whole document in private if you wish)

Surprising as it may seem, sometimes this works both ways. Since the translation industry is rather female-dominated, they might just be trying to achive an equality of sexes amongst their ranks


The poster was not a translation agency.

higher-paid jobs.


Unfortunately translators are not famous for high incomes..:cry:

But maybe there is another 'reasonable' explanation..I just don't happen to think of any at present..


[Edited at 2006-08-26 22:28]


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Liliana Roman-Hamilton  Identity Verified
Local time: 21:51
English to Italian
I was wondering... Aug 26, 2006

As the outsourcer was from the US, when I saw his posting I wondered if it's legal to post a similar ad, as by law in the US you cannot discriminate in regards to gender, race and religion. Is it a true and correct assumption?

And apart from this, if he was looking for a translator to do the job, what was the purpose of requesting specifically a man, rather than a woman?


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Jörgen Slet  Identity Verified
Estonia
Local time: 07:51
English to Estonian
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I am not a lawyer Aug 26, 2006

I am neither a lawyer nor knowledgeable in legal matters. But I believe that the law in my country at least recommends preferring an applicant of underrepresented sex if all other variables are equal. IIRC this particular law was drafted by an all-women team in the relevant ministry

And of course all the legislation here is mostly just implementation of EU legislation, although there are certain degrees of freedom.

[Edited at 2006-08-26 23:43]


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texjax DDS PhD  Identity Verified
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Open invitation Aug 27, 2006

I am not a lawyer myself, but just a strong believer in civil and human rights.
The outsoucer might have a legitimate reason for posting a job offer with such 'detail'. It would be nice if the gentleman in question would rephrase and explain his reasons or, even better, if he would be so kind to join us here.

[Edited at 2006-08-27 00:15]


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