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Pronunciation of 铬 and 纤
Thread poster: Jarosław Zawadzki

Jarosław Zawadzki  Identity Verified
Poland
Local time: 18:57
Chinese to Polish
+ ...
Jul 29, 2007

Hi All

The dictionaries claim that 铬 should be pronounced "ge" as in 个, but all the Chinese people I know say "luo" as in 落.

Again 纤 in 纤维 is said to be pronounced "xian" as in 先, but I heard people working in a chemical factory saying "qian" as in 纤绳.

What's it all about?


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David Shen  Identity Verified
Local time: 06:57
English to Chinese
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Pronunciation in Chinese is a mess. Jul 29, 2007

Hi Jarosław,

Don't get caught up in this. Spend more time on their combinations with other characters and phrases instead, and people will understand what you are talking about.

"Xian" is the correct pronunciation here for 纤维, but most people tend to recognize only the easiest half of a character.


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Kevin Yang  Identity Verified
Local time: 09:57
Member (2003)
English to Chinese
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Many Chinese people mispronounce Chinese characters. Jul 29, 2007

Jarosław,

I am very impressed by your detailed observation in the Chinese pronunciation. Many Chinese people mispronounce Chinese characters. Shame on them.

Your absolutely correct. Please stick to the pronunciations introduced in dictionary. 铬 should be pronounced as "ge(4)". 纤 has two ways to pronounce. When it is in 纤维, it should be pronounced as "xian(1)"; when it is in 纤夫的爱, it should be pronounced as "Qian(4)". It should NEVER be pronounced as "Qian(1)" in 纤维.

There are more Chinese characters have been mis-pronounced daily. When you hear them being mispronounced, go forward and correct them right on the spot. That way you will make them to learn from you. Here are a few more examples:

机械 = Ji(1)Xie(4) (NOT "Ji(1)Jie(4)")

解数 = Xie(4) Shu(4) (NOT "Jie(3)Shu(4)")

臀部 = Tun(2)Bu(4) (NOT "Dian(4)Bu(4)")

P.S. Sorry, I mistyped in my previous post. Thank Yueyin for pointing it out. I meant 纤维 should be "Xian(1)Wei(2)". I reversed them in my previous post. I just corrected it.


[修改时间: 2007-07-30 00:16]


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Jarosław Zawadzki  Identity Verified
Poland
Local time: 18:57
Chinese to Polish
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TOPIC STARTER
never as xiān? Jul 29, 2007

But it NEVER should be pronounced as "Xian(1)".



Well, it is the dictionary that says 纤维 is xiānwéi, MS Pinyin IME claims it's xiānwéi as well


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Shaunna  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 12:57
English to Chinese
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Interesting... Jul 29, 2007

Hi Jaroslaw,

For 铬, maybe it has something to do with which part of China you are in? I never pronounced 铬 as "luo", and never noticed people around me pronouncing it "luo" either when I was back in China (Northern China). Of course I am in science, which may play a role too.

As for 纤, I remember myself being perplexed when I was still in school too.


Jarosław Zawadzki wrote:

Hi All

The dictionaries claim that 铬 should be pronounced "ge" as in 个, but all the Chinese people I know say "luo" as in 落.

Again 纤 in 纤维 is said to be pronounced "xian" as in 先, but I heard people working in a chemical factory saying "qian" as in 纤绳.

What's it all about?


[Edited at 2007-07-29 14:36]


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pkchan  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 12:57
Member (2006)
English to Chinese
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It's a Southern thing. Jul 29, 2007

Nobody but the Southerners.

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Shaunna  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 12:57
English to Chinese
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My guess too. Jul 29, 2007



pkchan wrote:

Nobody but the Southerners.


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Jarosław Zawadzki  Identity Verified
Poland
Local time: 18:57
Chinese to Polish
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TOPIC STARTER
i'm in guangdong Jul 29, 2007

Well i used to think that it's Cantonese influence since i'm in GD, but 鉻 is gok3 in Cantonese, or maybe they make the same mistake in Cantonese and say "log"

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ysun  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 11:57
English to Chinese
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纤手 and 纤纤之手 Jul 29, 2007

I agree with others to that 铬 should be pronounced as "ge4" only and 纤 should be pronounced as “xian1” in 纤维 but as “qian4” in 纤绳.

The traditional Chinese characters for “纤绳” are “縴繩” while the traditional Chinese characters for 纤维 are 纖維. There would be no doubt that 縴 should be pronounced as “qian4”. However, in simplified Chinese, both 縴 and 纖 were simplified into 纤. Probably, that’s one of the most important reasons why people got confused with the pronunciation of 纤. In simplified Chinese, 縴手 and 纖纖之手 become 纤手 and 纤纤之手. Could you expect somebody to pull “纤绳” with her 纤纤之手? (This is not discrimination whatsoever.) By the way, 纤手 means real estate broker.

Please take a look at the 纤夫 struggling on the 纤路 and pulling the 纤绳:



[Edited at 2007-07-30 00:50]


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David Shen  Identity Verified
Local time: 06:57
English to Chinese
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Theory of Relativity here Jul 30, 2007

Yueyin Sun wrote:
... In simplified Chinese, 縴手 and 纖纖之手 become 纤手 and 纤纤之手. ...


I couldn't imagine a better explanation than this one.

I am sure you wouldn't mind holding any hand that starts with a "纖" 手, but I don't know if you are willing to give a hand to a "縴"手. So now our writings are made simple, but decision making becomes complicated for anybody because you never know which kind of 纤手 is being offered. Forget about the pronunciations. Check word combinations, told ya.


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ysun  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 11:57
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David, Jul 30, 2007

Thank you very much for your kind words! Meanwhile, I certainly agree with what you said about checking word combinations.

By the way, I would be willing to give a hand to a "縴夫之手", but would be very much hesitating to give my hand to a "纖纖之手".


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Jarosław Zawadzki  Identity Verified
Poland
Local time: 18:57
Chinese to Polish
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TOPIC STARTER
thanks Jul 30, 2007

now i'm clear on that but there is still one problem left, namely: when I say 鍍鉻 as "duge" people don't understand, however everything goes fine when I use the incorrect form as say "duluo"

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Shaunna  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 12:57
English to Chinese
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Don't worry Jul 30, 2007

I bet you know the Chinese idiom 入乡随俗. Just make mistakes along with the people you speak to. It is more important to get understood than being "correct".

You can try to say "duge" when you travel to Northern China and see whether people understand. (They should.)

Jarosław Zawadzki wrote:

now i'm clear on that but there is still one problem left, namely: when I say 鍍鉻 as "duge" people don't understand, however everything goes fine when I use the incorrect form as say "duluo"


[Edited at 2007-07-30 04:17]


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ysun  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 11:57
English to Chinese
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以讹传讹 Jul 30, 2007

Jarosław Zawadzki wrote:

when I say 鍍鉻 as "duge" people don't understand, however everything goes fine when I use the incorrect form as say "duluo"


Yes, a lot of Chinese people say “鍍鉻" as "du-ge" and say “镍铬合金" as “niè-luò-he-jin”. I think you can now teach them with the correct pronunciation to make them 刮目相看.

Do you know the same character 咯 can be pronounced quite differently as luò, gē, kǎ and lo?


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wherestip  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 11:57
Chinese to English
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二位所说很有道理 Jul 30, 2007

David Shen wrote:

Yueyin Sun wrote:
... In simplified Chinese, 縴手 and 纖纖之手 become 纤手 and 纤纤之手. ...


I couldn't imagine a better explanation than this one.

I am sure you wouldn't mind holding any hand that starts with a "纖" 手, but I don't know if you are willing to give a hand to a "縴"手. So now our writings are made simple, but decision making becomes complicated for anybody because you never know which kind of 纤手 is being offered. Forget about the pronunciations. Check word combinations, told ya.



http://www.zdic.net/zd/zi/ZdicE9Zdic93ZdicAC.htm

是要看用在哪里. 若按上面这个链接, "铬" 字就有三种发音. 点击 "详细解释", 可以看到用作金属时, 发音为 ge4
(BTW, don't forget to click on the tab of 康熙字典 and see what is said about the pronunciation of 鬚髮自鉻 (luo4))

中文白字先生历来不少. 这也是 侯宝林、刘宝瑞 等著名艺人所说相声中缺不了的一个题材.

像 Kevin 说, 如果把 "臀部" 的 "臀" 念成 "殿", 就露大怯了



[Edited at 2007-07-30 14:02]


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