Mobile menu

Pages in topic:   [1 2] >
对于美国公司的疑惑:reference+NDA
Thread poster: lbone

lbone  Identity Verified
China
Local time: 05:58
Member (2006)
English to Chinese
+ ...
Dec 22, 2007

发现最喜欢向人要reference的是美国公司,最喜欢要人签NDA的也是美国公司。我觉得reference就是违反NDA的,他们究竟是如何考虑这个问题的?

Direct link Reply with quote
 
Dallas Cao
China
Local time: 05:58
English to Chinese
+ ...
怎么会呢? Dec 22, 2007

lbone wrote:

发现最喜欢向人要reference的是美国公司,最喜欢要人签NDA的也是美国公司。我觉得reference就是违反NDA的,他们究竟是如何考虑这个问题的?


我的 reference 都是我事先联系,已经答应做我的 reference 的人。也就是我和我的 reference 达成了口头协议,他们答应我把他们的联系方式已私下(而不是发表到网站上)的方式交给其它人,并允许这些人跟他们联系。而 NDA 的意思是你翻译时不能泄漏所翻译的内容给其它方吧。我倒是觉得把自己已经签了 NDA 的项目列到 proz.com 上的 “项目历史”上有些违反 NDA 的嫌疑。


Direct link Reply with quote
 

wherestip  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 15:58
Chinese to English
+ ...
Reference Etiquette Dec 22, 2007

Agree with Dallas on this. Here are some guidelines on listing employment references ...


http://web.mit.edu/career/www/workshops/CV/references.html



Reference Etiquette
* Ask permission before submitting referees’ names.
* Whenever you provide reference information to an institution, advise your referees that they may be getting a request and keep them up-to-date on your professional activities.
* Tell your referees what topics they need to discuss so they can tailor their letters to the specific positions.
* If the ad requests reference letters immediately, provide enough information to your referees, and tactfully follow up to be sure the letters have been mailed in time.
* See an example of one MIT faculty member's advice about how to request letters of recommendation.
* Also see tips on how to request recommendations, by Steven Strang, Director of the Writing and Communication Center.




http://www.hcareers.com/ca/resourcecenter/tabid/373/articleid/708/default.aspx



Reference Etiquette 101

...

* Pick your references carefully. Select those most relevant to the position you’re seeking and--let’s be frank--those who are most likely to have the highest opinion of you. Begin by making a list of all possible references and gradually winnow it down to four or five who you think will be the best bets.
* Skip references that may harbor mixed feelings towards you. If you never really “clicked” with the general manager at the resort property you consider the high point of your résumé, it may be best to list that kindly shift manager who was your direct supervisor instead.
* Establish a tone of communication with your selected references that is warm and personable, humble and sincere. Initiate the process with a phone call or visit personally requesting permission to include them on your reference list. Schedule enough time for this task so that you won’t be rushed--spend some time chit-chatting and catching up, showing sincere interest in their life and accomplishments since you last spoke.
* Avoid asking references to embellish or exaggerate about your past performance. At best, this will make them uncomfortable, and nervousness and hesitation are likely to peek through during a reference interview. At worst, it could prompt them to bow out of the process altogether, not to mention inflicting damage to your relationship.
* It’s okay to make a few gentle suggestions. On the other hand, it’s perfectly reasonable--helpful, even--to give your references a few pointers. Tell them a bit about the kind of position you’re seeking and hash over a few highlights or achievements that you think might be pertinent. That Waiter of the Year award you won five years ago may have slipped your boss’ mind!
* Always say thanks. When you’re firmly ensconced in your new position, make it a point to thank each of your references for their time and effort. A handwritten thank-you note is your best bet. A gift along the line of flowers, candy, or tickets to a local sporting event is even better, especially for references with whom you have a lengthy personal history. Besides, you never know how long it will be until you need them to vouch for you again!




http://www.jobreferenceexperts.com/myth7.html


Direct link Reply with quote
 

lbone  Identity Verified
China
Local time: 05:58
Member (2006)
English to Chinese
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
多谢steve提供的信息 Dec 22, 2007

我现在的作法是对要求reference的,我一律告诉他们我不提供,我比较反感这种要求,love buy not buy。我以前曾经提供过referee名单,这些referee和我合作多年了,关系都不错,但几轮request下来,他们大多数反馈比较烦。所以我现在统一不提供reference了。我过去的客户基本都不愿意我离开,不过涨价了,只好离开了。

但NDA好象绕不过了。

发这帖主要是对这两种要求同时在一个客户群上出现感到比较迷惑。


Direct link Reply with quote
 

wherestip  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 15:58
Chinese to English
+ ...
NDAs Dec 22, 2007

lbone wrote:

我现在的作法是对要求reference的,我一律告诉他们我不提供,我比较反感这种要求,love buy not buy。我以前曾经提供过referee名单,这些referee和我合作多年了,关系都不错,但几轮request下来,他们大多数反馈比较烦。所以我现在统一不提供reference了。我过去的客户基本都不愿意我离开,不过涨价了,只好离开了。

但NDA好象绕不过了。

发这帖主要是对这两种要求同时在一个客户群上出现感到比较迷惑。


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Non-disclosure_agreement



Non-disclosure agreement

A non-disclosure agreement (NDA) (often known outside of the United States as a confidentiality agreement; occasionally called a confidential disclosure agreement or CDA, or secrecy agreement), is a legal contract between at least two parties that outlines confidential materials or knowledge the parties wish to share with one another for certain purposes, but wish to restrict from generalized use. In other words, it is a contract through which the parties agree not to disclose information covered by the agreement. An NDA creates a confidential relationship between the parties to protect any type of trade secret. As such, an NDA can protect non-public business information.

NDAs are commonly signed when two companies or individuals are considering doing business together and need to understand the processes used in one another's businesses solely for the purpose of evaluating the potential business relationship. NDAs can be "mutual", meaning both parties are restricted in their use of the materials provided, or they can only restrict a single party.

It is also possible for an employee to sign an NDA or NDA-like agreement with a company at the time of hiring, in fact some employment agreements will include a clause restricting "confidential information" in general. Likewise, NDAs are used in the IT field and given directly prior to taking a certification exam.

In rare cases, the contract may state that the existence of the NDA itself cannot be disclosed.





You're welcome, lbone.

NDAs are not all created equal as you must know. It depends on what the contract stipulates. Like the above Wikipedia page says, it's only in rare cases that the existence of an NDA itself cannot be disclosed. Also like Dallas mentioned, it usually is the content that is confidential, not that you are employed by a certain company or in this case doing a job for that company.

If I were uncomfortable with a particular clause, I would contact the company and ask for a reason why the clause needs to be there. A good company should have a reasonable answer.



[Edited at 2007-12-22 17:54]


Direct link Reply with quote
 
ysun  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 15:58
English to Chinese
+ ...
并不是什么都需要保密的 Dec 23, 2007

wherestip wrote:

NDAs are not all created equal as you must know. It depends on what the contract stipulates. Like the above Wikipedia page says, it's only in rare cases that the existence of an NDA itself cannot be disclosed. Also like Dallas mentioned, it usually is the content that is confidential, not that you are employed by a certain company or in this case doing a job for that company.

If I were uncomfortable with a particular clause, I would contact the company and ask for a reason why the clause needs to be there. A good company should have a reasonable answer.


同意Steve以上所说。另外,许多Non-Disclosure Agreement里面还有类似于下列的条款:

Notwithstanding the foregoing, the term "Confidential Information" specifically excludes (A) information that is now in public domain or subsequently enters the public domain by publication or otherwise through no action or fault of the other party; (B) information that is known to either party without restriction, prior to receipt from the other party under this Agreement, from its own independent sources a evidenced by such party's written records, and which was not acquired, directly or indirectly, from the other party: (C) information that either party receives from any third party reasonably known by such receiving party to have a legal right to transmit such information, and not under any obligation to keep such information confidential; and (D) information independently developed by either party's employees provided that either party can show that those same employees or agents had no access to the Confidential Information received hereunder.

所以,如果你替某些用户翻译已经公开发表的专利、学术论文、书籍、网站等,就不必承担什么保密义务,因为那些东西已经在 “public domain”之中。

至于NDA与reference,根本是毫不相干的两码事。


Direct link Reply with quote
 

orientalhorizon  Identity Verified
Local time: 05:58
English to Chinese
+ ...
reference与NDA Dec 23, 2007

美国是一个人员流动性极强的社会,有人称之为“汽车民族”,有点儿象过去的“马背上的民族”,此处无草上马就走。同时美国又是一商业化很完善的社会。在这种情况下,人们之间要打交道,就得有信誉,未曾相识,信誉哪里来?那就得找人证明一下了,这也就是reference的作用了,找个工作,有好的reference胜千言万语;而要签NDA,那就是让你明白,让你干活,是基于相互之间的信任,很多东西属于商业机密或秘密,如果泄露了,就会给公司造成损失,所以你要保密,否则造成损失,拿你是问。当然需要保守的只是真正意义上的秘密,已经公开或人所尽知者不在其列。

[Edited at 2007-12-23 11:52]


Direct link Reply with quote
 

lbone  Identity Verified
China
Local time: 05:58
Member (2006)
English to Chinese
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
感谢 Dec 24, 2007

感谢Dallas、steve、老孙和orientalhorizon的解说。

Direct link Reply with quote
 

redred  Identity Verified
China
Local time: 05:58
English to Chinese
+ ...
怎样找人reference你? Jan 5, 2008

Dallas Cao wrote:

我的 reference 都是我事先联系,已经答应做我的 reference 的人。也就是我和我的 reference 达成了口头协议,他们答应我把他们的联系方式已私下(而不是发表到网站上)的方式交给其它人,并允许这些人跟他们联系。而 NDA 的意思是你翻译时不能泄漏所翻译的内容给其它方吧。我倒是觉得把自己已经签了 NDA 的项目列到 proz.com 上的 “项目历史”上有些违反 NDA 的嫌疑。


有关系良好的合作方,怎样让他们reference你?如果是不懂英语的人呢?怎样的一个方式。


Direct link Reply with quote
 

Milton Guo  Identity Verified
China
Local time: 05:58
English to Chinese
+ ...
合作就会建立信用 Jan 29, 2008

刚开始比较困难,比较难要信任彼此,所以reference似乎是必要的,但找不到,估计问题也不大吧?主要看翻译质量和效率。。

NDA这个是应该的,我和国内的翻译公司也有签这类协议,法律形式而已,但当然也需要翻译本人的自律。。。。。(例如有时还参加海关审讯毒贩之类)


Direct link Reply with quote
 

phdvet2001  Identity Verified
Local time: 05:58
Member (2007)
English to Chinese
+ ...
新来乍到 Jan 30, 2008

新来乍到,弱弱问一句:什么是NAD?全称是?

Direct link Reply with quote
 
xxxchance
French to Chinese
+ ...
non disclosure agreement Jan 30, 2008

Renquan Yang wrote:

新来乍到,弱弱问一句:什么是NAD?全称是?


Direct link Reply with quote
 
Norman Li  Identity Verified
China
最近刚签了一份NDA Apr 9, 2009

虽然也觉得比较麻烦,但还是能理解。可能和做法律翻译有关吧,觉得法律协议的作用是“防患于未然”,想想似乎也是合理的。

Direct link Reply with quote
 

luttyzhu
Hong Kong
Local time: 05:58
English to Chinese
+ ...
两者应该是不冲突的吧... Apr 9, 2009

我感觉两者是不冲突的.

Direct link Reply with quote
 
ysun  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 15:58
English to Chinese
+ ...
ill intended Apr 10, 2009

NDA 往往会包括下列条款:

During Independent Contractor's association with XXX (the translation agency), and for a period of two (2) years thereafter, Independent Contractor will not directly or indirectly have any contact with any client of XXX for whom Independent Contractor has provided translation or other services.

这似乎可以解释为,如果那翻译社的 client 将来通过其它渠道(如其它翻译社)直接或间接地来找你,你也不得为它提供服务了。有些翻译社让你签了 NDA 之后,再给你发一小篇显示它的客户是谁的资料,然后就再也没有下文了。那就是说,你还什么都还没干呢,就先被带上了一副手铐。当然,对此并非没有对策。

有的协议还包括下列条款:

INDEMNIFICATION
Independent Contractor hereby indemnifies and holds XXX and its directors, officers, employees and agents harmless from and against any and all claims, liabilities, losses, damages, and expenses, including interest, penalties and attorneys' fees and all consequential and incidental damages which arise as a result of the breach by Independent Contractor of its obligations under this Agreement or which are attributable in any way to the operation of Independent Contractor's business. Independent Contractor also shall indemnify and hold XXX harmless in any suit initiated against XXX as a result of an inaccurate or unacceptable translation, and shall be liable for all costs, including, reasonable attorneys fees, expended by XXX in defense of such suit.

这岂不是想把人往死里整吗?


Direct link Reply with quote
 
Pages in topic:   [1 2] >


To report site rules violations or get help, contact a site moderator:


You can also contact site staff by submitting a support request »

对于美国公司的疑惑:reference+NDA

Advanced search






Quiick
Want to earn more in your spare time? Monetize your knowledge!

Do you speak one or more foreign languages? Fluency in target language + willingness & ability to help people in everyday situations could earn you $45 / hour. Download “Quiick Angel” app & become a guardian angel today

More info »
TMreserve
Wake up in the Morning and see that you have sold TMs and made Money overnight



The TM Market Place for Translators
New: Our Instant TM Download
TM owners: Upload your TMs into the online database
Customers: Analyse your text & instantly download a text-specific TM
Well over 1.2 BILLION translation units

More info »



All of ProZ.com
  • All of ProZ.com
  • Term search
  • Jobs