Should I use CAT tools for this project? / Large SP-EN project Thread poster: Edward Potter
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Edward Potter 
Spain
Local time: 17:58
Member (2003)
Spanish to English
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Hello. I have a possible large project coming up and would like to have some opinions on whether to use CAT tools for it. My WordFast analyze function shows that out of about 114,000 words there are only about 2500 repititions (2%). There are about 400 in the 75%-94% range and then about 111000 in the 0%-74% range.
There are 17 different files but are all from the same book. I never did like CAT tools that much and have not found them to be that helpful - in fact they have gotten in... See more Hello. I have a possible large project coming up and would like to have some opinions on whether to use CAT tools for it. My WordFast analyze function shows that out of about 114,000 words there are only about 2500 repititions (2%). There are about 400 in the 75%-94% range and then about 111000 in the 0%-74% range.
There are 17 different files but are all from the same book. I never did like CAT tools that much and have not found them to be that helpful - in fact they have gotten in the way many times.
Wouldn\'t it just be easier to make a glossary as we go along and consult it as need be? The subject is engineering/mathematics, specifically:
\"INVESTIGACIÓN OPERATIVA
Modelos y técnicas de optimización
PROYECTO DE INNOVACIÓN EDUCATIVA\"
Also, can anyone recommend some good Spanish-English dictionaries on the subject?
I also would be searching for a translator(s) who knows the subject well to form a team.
Edward Potter
I.L.S. ▲ Collapse
| | | | Marc P (X)
Local time: 17:58
German to English
+ ...
| Just some thoughts | Apr 25, 2003 |
>I never did like CAT tools that much and have not found them to be that helpful - in fact they have gotten in the way many times.<
I am the opposite: I prefer working in a good CAT tool, even if there is zero repetitivity and no existing memory database. What CAT tools have you used, and in what sense did they get in the way? Perhaps this is a good opportunity to try a CAT tool and either overcome your prejudices - or confirm them!
>>out of about 114,00... See more >I never did like CAT tools that much and have not found them to be that helpful - in fact they have gotten in the way many times.<
I am the opposite: I prefer working in a good CAT tool, even if there is zero repetitivity and no existing memory database. What CAT tools have you used, and in what sense did they get in the way? Perhaps this is a good opportunity to try a CAT tool and either overcome your prejudices - or confirm them!
>>out of about 114,000 words there are only about 2500 repititions (2%). There are about 400 in the 75%-94% range and then about 111000 in the 0%-74% range.
This is effectively zero repetitivity. The figure for the 0%-74% is probably virtually meaningless. The number of segments matched is more relevant than the number of words in them, by the way.
One thing to consider that you haven\'t mentioned is whether the memory you would be creating might be useful in the future. For example, if your translation is so brilliant that the book becomes a best-seller, and the author produces another edition...
Marc ▲ Collapse
| | | | Erika Pavelka (X)
Local time: 11:58
French to English
| I definitely would! | Apr 25, 2003 |
Hi Edward,
I certainly would use a CAT tool for the project you describe. You don\'t elaborate on why your CAT tool has \"gotten in the way\", but I would say that you haven\'t found the right tool yet for your needs.
I\'ve been using DejaVu for almost 4 years and I do pretty well every translation I receive in it. The biggest advantage for me is terminological consistency, even though I rarely get texts with a great deal of repetition. You add terms to ... See more Hi Edward,
I certainly would use a CAT tool for the project you describe. You don\'t elaborate on why your CAT tool has \"gotten in the way\", but I would say that you haven\'t found the right tool yet for your needs.
I\'ve been using DejaVu for almost 4 years and I do pretty well every translation I receive in it. The biggest advantage for me is terminological consistency, even though I rarely get texts with a great deal of repetition. You add terms to the database \'on the fly\', and when a term appears in a later segment, it\'s automatically replaced. Granted, you have to build up your database to really benefit from it, but it is well worth the time and effort.
I find that your method of a separate glossary would be time-consuming to create and consult (switching back and forth between windows, entering terms).
Perhaps when you have some downtime, you could explore the other CAT tools available (DV, Trados, Star Transit) and see whether any of them suit your needs.
Good luck,
Erika
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| | | | Csaba Ban
Hungary
Local time: 17:58
Member (2002)
English to Hungarian
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I agree with Erika. A fully functional demo version (30 days) of Deja Vu is freely available from www.atril.com.
Actually, a brand new version (DVX) is going to be released on the 30th of April, so if you can wait with starting your project, you may be one of the first users of DVX.
Also, there may be some internal repetition within that large portion of the document that showed only less than 74% match in th... See more I agree with Erika. A fully functional demo version (30 days) of Deja Vu is freely available from www.atril.com.
Actually, a brand new version (DVX) is going to be released on the 30th of April, so if you can wait with starting your project, you may be one of the first users of DVX.
Also, there may be some internal repetition within that large portion of the document that showed only less than 74% match in the initial analysis.
As Erika pointed out, entering new terms in the glossary is VERY easy. Once you enter a term, all subsequent occurrences of the word/phrase will be automatically replaced.
As you will notice, it is also worth entering common words into the glossary, such as \"however\", \"estimate\" or \"on the other hand\". ▲ Collapse
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Edward Potter
Spain
Local time: 17:58
Member (2003)
Spanish to English
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
Thanks to all for your comments.
The only CAT tool I have used thus far has been WordFast. I do not like clicking my mouse (or hitting alt-down) after every segment. Also, the segments come up \"separate\" from the rest of the document and I find it very cumbersome to go edit something elsewhere in the document and then come back. These \"separate\" segments makes it feel that they are out of context. I like seeing everything in front of me and moving around the document... See more Thanks to all for your comments.
The only CAT tool I have used thus far has been WordFast. I do not like clicking my mouse (or hitting alt-down) after every segment. Also, the segments come up \"separate\" from the rest of the document and I find it very cumbersome to go edit something elsewhere in the document and then come back. These \"separate\" segments makes it feel that they are out of context. I like seeing everything in front of me and moving around the document with ease - something I do with Word.
I do admit that I have only used WordFast for a limited amount of work (because I don\'t like it and I do not often get repetitive work).
More discussion/comments will be appreciated.
Edward ▲ Collapse
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As the posters above have commented, Deja Vu will help you immensely by replacing words and phrases that you enter into the program\'s glossary (TermBase) each time they reappear. Other CAT tools do not have this facility; they operate on the bases of matching (exact or fuzzy) the entire segment.
Every time the text repeats a term that you have previously entered, you will see how you translated it before. This will help you to maintain consistency (when that is your goal) ... See more As the posters above have commented, Deja Vu will help you immensely by replacing words and phrases that you enter into the program\'s glossary (TermBase) each time they reappear. Other CAT tools do not have this facility; they operate on the bases of matching (exact or fuzzy) the entire segment.
Every time the text repeats a term that you have previously entered, you will see how you translated it before. This will help you to maintain consistency (when that is your goal) or to vary the translation to avoid repetition (in the cases when this is indicated).
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| | | | Ivo Lang
United Kingdom
Local time: 16:58
English to German
| Retention of formatting of original document | Apr 26, 2003 |
[I am surprised that no one has mentioned the fact that (at least in Trados, which I use myself) one of the major advantages of using one of the advanced CAT tools is their capability of retaining the original formatting. I find this feature immensely useful, especially, as you can imagine, where the original text has some tricky formatting. This has, in the past, saved me considerable time.]
On 2003-04-25 11:00, Spani wrote:
Hello. I have a possible large project coming up ... See more [I am surprised that no one has mentioned the fact that (at least in Trados, which I use myself) one of the major advantages of using one of the advanced CAT tools is their capability of retaining the original formatting. I find this feature immensely useful, especially, as you can imagine, where the original text has some tricky formatting. This has, in the past, saved me considerable time.]
On 2003-04-25 11:00, Spani wrote:
Hello. I have a possible large project coming up and would like to have some opinions on whether to use CAT tools for it. My WordFast analyze function shows that out of about 114,000 words there are only about 2500 repititions (2%). There are about 400 in the 75%-94% range and then about 111000 in the 0%-74% range.
There are 17 different files but are all from the same book. I never did like CAT tools that much and have not found them to be that helpful - in fact they have gotten in the way many times.
Wouldn\'t it just be easier to make a glossary as we go along and consult it as need be? The subject is engineering/mathematics, specifically:
\"INVESTIGACIÓN OPERATIVA
Modelos y técnicas de optimización
PROYECTO DE INNOVACIÓN EDUCATIVA\"
Also, can anyone recommend some good Spanish-English dictionaries on the subject?
I also would be searching for a translator(s) who knows the subject well to form a team.
Edward Potter
I.L.S.
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