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Email with test translation for 100,000 word job - beware!
Thread poster: Katalin Horváth McClure

Katalin Horváth McClure  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 13:29
Member (2002)
English to Hungarian
+ ...
Mar 12, 2004

It seems that a person called Emma Mancia mass-mailed Japanese-English translators with a translation test to be completed within few hours, and the possibility of a 100,000 word project.
Please be very careful, check out the blueboard, this agency seems to be a non-payer.
Here is the link:
http://www.proz.com/?sp=agency_list&agency_id=969&start_number=1430

I know this posting here may be against the rules, but they did not post the job on the job board (I can guess why), instead, they (she) mass-emailed it.

Make your decisions wisely
Katalin


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Anne Seerup
Ireland
Local time: 18:29
English to Danish
+ ...
Could be a scam Mar 12, 2004

These large mass-mailed job posting are often a bit dodgy. I have something to say about this one so I think I will do a posting at Blue board as I believe we cannot mention agencies by name in the forum. (I wish we could though).




[Edited at 2004-03-12 12:21]

[Edited at 2004-03-12 12:22]


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Katalin Horváth McClure  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 13:29
Member (2002)
English to Hungarian
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
They are banned from ProZ.com Mar 12, 2004

I just got a message from ProZ.com support staff, saying: "Emma Mancia and Inter-Translations are banned from participating at ProZ.com."
They will block her email address (well, the one she used this time) to prevent her from sending profile emails.

I hope this is enough warning for everybody.


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Kaori Myatt  Identity Verified
France
Local time: 19:29
Member (2004)
English to Japanese
+ ...
Thanks Mar 13, 2004

Katalin Horvath McClure wrote:

I just got a message from ProZ.com support staff, saying: "Emma Mancia and Inter-Translations are banned from participating at ProZ.com."
They will block her email address (well, the one she used this time) to prevent her from sending profile emails.

I hope this is enough warning for everybody.


Thanks Katalin.


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Minoru Kuwahara
Japan
Local time: 02:29
English to Japanese
+ ...
Thank you for the information. Mar 17, 2004

Kaori Myatt wrote:

Katalin Horvath McClure wrote:

I just got a message from ProZ.com support staff, saying: "Emma Mancia and Inter-Translations are banned from participating at ProZ.com."
They will block her email address (well, the one she used this time) to prevent her from sending profile emails.

I hope this is enough warning for everybody.


Thanks Katalin.


Thanks from me, too. Your advice certainly counts.-

-MK


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Ralf Lemster  Identity Verified
Germany
Local time: 19:29
English to German
+ ...
Please refrain from discussing agency names Mar 17, 2004

Hi all,
Katalin was right in assuming that discussing a job poster is against the forum rules. The reason for this rule is the potential for mud-slinging and libelous postings (from both sides actually - note that we would also object to an outsourcer discussing a particular translator).

The BlueBoard has been created specifically for the purpose of exchanging such information, and the entry in this case is clear enough, I believe.

Thanks for your understanding.

Best regards,
Ralf Lemster
Jobs Area Coordinator


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Katalin Horváth McClure  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 13:29
Member (2002)
English to Hungarian
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
I understand, but... Mar 17, 2004

Ralf Lemster wrote:

Hi all,
Katalin was right in assuming that discussing a job poster is against the forum rules. The reason for this rule is the potential for mud-slinging and libelous postings (from both sides actually - note that we would also object to an outsourcer discussing a particular translator).

The BlueBoard has been created specifically for the purpose of exchanging such information, and the entry in this case is clear enough, I believe.

Thanks for your understanding.

Best regards,
Ralf Lemster
Jobs Area Coordinator


Just for clarification.
When I posted my first message here, at the same time I contacted the support staff at ProZ.com, describing the situation. I also stated that I posted a warning on the Japanese forum, and asked for the best course of action.
I got a reply from Jason, and was told that this agency is banned from any activity on ProZ, and was asked the sender's email address in order to block it from sending profile messages. (I was not asked to edit or remove my warning from here.) I provided the email address with the full message header, which showed, that in fact, the message was NOT sent through my profile. They got hold of email addresses somehow, and directly mass-mailed their message.

This means, that when somebody got this message, it did not look like it was coming from ProZ. This is a very sneaky way of approaching us, I think. More than that, when somebody receives such message, he/she may not be inclined to proactively go to the Blue Board and search for the agency - it is pretty easy when a job is posted on ProZ, but can be cumbersome when doing a simple search, more so when you don't know the agency's country, and especially with this agency that has 4 (four!!!) separate entries in the Blue Board.
Anyway, as I said, I pointed out to ProZ staff that I posted my warning when I did it, and nobody said anything against it. If you want, as a moderator, I believe you have the rights to remove it.

I would like to add a request though - when an agency is banned from ProZ, woul dit be possible to add a note to the Blue Board entry to clearly say that? The agency knows when they are banned, it is a fact, so I see no reason not to do it.
It would be a very clear message, and we need that, I think.
Thank you
Katalin


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Minoru Kuwahara
Japan
Local time: 02:29
English to Japanese
+ ...
Yes, but... Mar 18, 2004

Situation seems to be a little complicated. I appreciate Katalin-san swiftly makes the point of clarifying this sender's identification, while I reassumed it's sure that disclosing the names of the person and agency does not waive the treatment of information on the ProZ policy.

There still remains one thing, however, which is the absolute usefulness of this sort of information about agencies for us, translators, who would be potential receivers of these cumbersome emails. I say so knowing we receive these queries from unknown senders on a daily basis, whether or not s/he might be an individual or an agency. Hence I think the focus of this issue lies in the analysis of how it could be really crucial for us and the need of certain remedy to protect the privacy of those who would forward 'mass-mails' or any other 'first-contacts' in whatever ways they find our contact information and wherever.

Agency Blue Board is certainly quite a helpful implementation and I find we owe a lot to it to make decisions for "Go!" or not, while I guess Katalin-san revealed one vulnerable case in which all of us would be exposed to potential deceptions.

I once had two cases of being trapped by apparently similar sollciations a few years ago before Agency Blue Board came to effect as a database of scored agencies. So I definitely hope the value of this sort of information presented here would not be dismissed. Nature of information is "The earlier it's revealed, the better our services are guraded", which is all true to save on behalf of translators. On the other hand, how come the way of protecting people's privacy should be compromised and consequently disregarded? Contradictioin, but I see room for development on this issue. Considering the above, my stance is neutral here.

Minoru Kuwahara


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gianfranco  Identity Verified
Brazil
Local time: 14:29
Member (2001)
English to Italian
+ ...
Banned agencies are shown on the Blue Board Mar 23, 2004

Katalin Horvath McClure wrote:
...
I would like to add a request though - when an agency is banned from ProZ, would it be possible to add a note to the Blue Board entry to clearly say that?

The agency knows when they are banned, it is a fact, so I see no reason not to do it.

It would be a very clear message, and we need that, I think.
Thank you
Katalin


Dear Katalin and all,

We do it. Outsourcers (agencies or individuals) banned from using the ProZ.com Jobs Area are indicated on their Blue Board record.

Clearly ProZ.com cannot stop any of them from collecting translator's email addresses, from any possible source, online directory, associations web-sites or personal web-sites, and write to them directly.

Gianfranco



[Edited at 2004-03-25 11:08]


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Katalin Horváth McClure  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 13:29
Member (2002)
English to Hungarian
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
This agency was not marked Mar 23, 2004

Gianfranco Manca wrote:

Dear Katalin and all,

We do it. Outsourcers (agencies or individuals) banned from using the ProZ.com Jobs Area are clearly indicated on their Blue Board record.


Please check out the Jobs Forum for the same topic.
Apparently, this agency "slipped through the cracks", the ban was not indicated until I called attention to it.
Since I haven't dealt with any agency that was banned from ProZ except this one, and this one was not marked, I did not know what the system was.
Of course, ProZ cannot stop agencies from directly emailing translators using addresses they harvest from wherever. That is clear to everyone, I think.
Katalin


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