Is the use of Kudoz addictive ? ;-)
Thread poster: Pablo Bouvier

Pablo Bouvier  Identity Verified
Local time: 22:48
German to Spanish
+ ...
Apr 9, 2008

I suspect some of us has clear symptoms of compulsive gambling.
There are two types of pathologies by KudoZ:

- compulsive asking &
- compulsive answering

Maybe, I am able to understand compulsive answerers because prestige is at the top on Maslow's motivation pyramide. But I am still not able to understand wich kind of gratification may achieve a compulsive asker.

¿Any idea of clinical treatments for these pathological behaviours?


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Luisa Ramos, CT  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 16:48
Member (2004)
English to Spanish
Doctor's orders Apr 9, 2008

How about prescribing some "do not accept jobs outside your area/s of expertise"?

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Dinap
Croatia
Local time: 22:48
Member
English to Croatian
+ ...
Welcome to the club Apr 9, 2008

Pablo Bouvier wrote:

I suspect some of us has clear symptoms of compulsive gambling.
There are two types of pathologies by KudoZ:

- compulsive asking &
- compulsive answering

Maybe, I am able to understand compulsive answerers because prestige is at the top on Maslow's motivation pyramide. But I am still not able to understand wich kind of gratification may achieve a compulsive asker.

¿Any idea of clinical treatments for these pathological behaviours?



Sometimes I feel like I am in a school and fighting to be teachers pet:-))


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Oltjona Muçaj  Identity Verified
Italy
Local time: 22:48
Member (2008)
Italian to Albanian
+ ...
I perfectly agree! Apr 9, 2008

Luisa Ramos wrote:

How about prescribing some "do not accept jobs outside your area/s of expertise"?


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Satto (Roberto)  Identity Verified
Colombia
Local time: 15:48
Member (2007)
Spanish to English
+ ...
Agree with Luisa Apr 9, 2008

Yup, that is probably a good answer.

On the other hand I like to answer Kudoz questions, I learn and can give back. Although I'm not compulsive about it!

What I don't understand is compulsive answerers, people that know EVERYTHING. people that simply can't agree on a previous answer or the best of them all..."The Leeches". These are the people that wait on good answers, change the thing a little and post a slightly different answer, just to try to pick up easy points on someone else's input. These are the worst!

For compulsive askers, my best approach is not answering. These people are just taking advantage of the system and can only overlook their questions. In my pair there is one in particular that I ignore completely.


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Cagdas Karatas  Identity Verified
Turkey
Local time: 23:48
English to Turkish
Prestige is important as you said Apr 9, 2008

I agree that the use of KudoZ is addictive but such addiction is not for nothing. It helps us to attain a certain status (a knowledgeable person) on this site, and KudoZ points move you up on the freelancers listing. KudoZ is an indispensable part of ProZ, yet one should limit the amount of time he/she spends on KudoZ.

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Roxanna Delgado  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 16:48
Member (2006)
English to Spanish
+ ...
Wish I could write that prescription. Apr 9, 2008

Luisa Ramos wrote:

How about prescribing some "do not accept jobs outside your area/s of expertise"?


Being a doctor myself, I couldn't agree more with those orders.


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Charlie Bavington  Identity Verified
Local time: 21:48
French to English
Not only, but also Apr 9, 2008

Luisa Ramos wrote:

How about prescribing some "do not accept jobs outside your area/s of expertise"?


Regular booster injections of "awareness of what your fields of expertise actually ARE".

In my pair there is a regular asker who has clearly decided to target a particular segment (which is fair enough, in a way, since French companies are particularly active in the field, and specialisation is a good thing) and then learn on the job by asking a lot of questions.


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Steven Capsuto  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 16:48
Spanish to English
+ ...
Compulsive answering... Apr 9, 2008

But I can stop any time I want. Honest...

[Edited at 2008-04-09 13:32]


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Stéphanie Soudais  Identity Verified
France
Local time: 22:48
Member (2006)
English to French
compulsive askers Apr 9, 2008

I think compulsive askers only bring discredit upon themselves. Some of them keep asking questions that can be answered with one bilingual dictionary and/or a synonym dictionary, or with a bit of imagination only. But they simply don't make the effort to think or to search the net, etc. I do not consider these people professional translators.

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writeaway  Identity Verified

Local time: 22:48
Partial member (2003)
French to English
+ ...
a few tips for warning signs of Kudozitis Apr 9, 2008

Asker kudozitis: Warning signs

- you peruse every new doc you are offered to see how many Kudoz questions you will have to ask
- you only turn down jobs when the deadline won't allow you time to ask all the questions you will have to ask
- you accept any and all jobs that do allow you enough time to post all your Kudoz questions
- you start accepting jobs between languages you don't really know well and fields you don't really work in because you know Kudoz will be there to get your through them
- you accept tight deadlines because you know that by asking Kudoz questions, you won't have to waste your own valuable time looking up terms in a dictionary

Answerer kudozitis: Warning signs

- you turn on your computer and the first thing you do is start looking for Kudoz questions to answer.
- you answer 24/7 so askers will start to trust you just because you are omnipresent in the pair
- you aren't at all sure about the answer but you give it a big 5 confidence level so no one will suspect you really don't know
- things are very quiet in your usual pairs, so you start touring the site to find things you can guess at in languages and/or fields you don't work in at all. Kudoz points must be earned at all cost
- you aren't sure of an answer so you wait until others answer and then you compose your own answer by using what others have already said, making sure to add and/or change a word or two.

These are just a few basic warning signs of kudozitis. If a person realises they are on the verge of terminal kudozitis, they may avoid getting to that stage. Unfortunately, there is no known cure if the person suffering from kudozitis is unaware and/or refuses to acknowledge that he or she is afflicted.



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Kim Metzger  Identity Verified
Mexico
Local time: 15:48
German to English
Sacred cows Apr 9, 2008

Members have been given tools to keep compulsive answerers somewhat under control: peer comments and disagrees. The compulsive answerer who is also a point grabber and by definition doesn't care about the quality of his answers can in some cases be guided toward more responsible conduct.

But the compulsive asker is a sacred cow. We have been told repeatedly by the powers-that-be that the "rule" that asks askers to do their homework before using KudoZ is not a rule at all, but a "guideline" that may not be cited anywhere on a KudoZ page. Rule 3.7, however, is enforced with an iron fist. Countless pro translators have had their KudoZ privileges restricted for violating this Rule with a capital R.

"Rule" 2.1
KudoZ should be used for requesting terms help only after other resources have been exhausted. Resources available include the KudoZ archives (KudoZ > ProZ.com Term Search from the main menu), dictionaries, search engines, etc. If translations are found elsewhere and the decision to post a KudoZ question is made nevertheless, information found elsewhere should be included, along with an explanation of what further information is sought.

Rule 3.7
Commentary on askers or answerers, and their postings or decisions to post, is not allowed. Comments or insinuations concerning an answerer's or asker's experience or profile, his/her decision to post a certain question or answer, grade or close a question in a certain way, make a certain glossary entry, etc., are strictly prohibited (whether posted publicly, made directly to the person in question, or made to another site user).

In my opinion, it goes without saying that pro translators are rightfully offended when they see askers getting others to do their translations for them (by asking 60 questions per week, e.g.). They are especially rightfully offended when they see these askers doing translations they are clearly not qualified to do because they lack expertise in the languages and the subject matter - in other words, when they see the basic tenets of professional ethics being violated before their eyes.

I firmly believe we can find a way to guide askers in the right direction and still maintain a civil discourse. Bringing back "rule" 2.1 as a real rule would be a step in the right direction.


[Edited at 2008-04-09 14:44]


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David Russi  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 14:48
English to Spanish
+ ...
Recovered Apr 10, 2008

Steven Capsuto wrote:

But I can stop any time I want. Honest...

[Edited at 2008-04-09 13:32]


I actually did... about a year ago I calculated the amount of time it cost me post answers, and it had become absurd. I quit ProZ for almost 3 months, and while I confess to an initial one week of withdrawal, it was not bad at all, and I had much more time fro myself and my work. These days, I'll answer a question if it interests me, and I don't have to get involved in deep research., but otherwise, I'm a recovered KudoZ answerer.

Saludos,'

D

PS: I still find the glossary useful on occasion.


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moken  Identity Verified
Local time: 21:48
English to Spanish
+ ...
Let he who is without sin cast the first stone Apr 15, 2008

Hi Roberto,

Interesting, thought-provoking comments. While I agree with a lot of what you say, I think some attitudes can be seen in a slightly different light.

Satto (Roberto) wrote:

What I don't understand is compulsive answerers, people that know EVERYTHING. people that simply can't agree on a previous answer or the best of them all..."The Leeches". These are the people that wait on good answers, change the thing a little and post a slightly different answer, just to try to pick up easy points on someone else's input. These are the worst!


I have noticed that this is very much a KudoZ beginner's trait (and I would tell a lie if I denied that I had never acted this way). In think it shows a 'lack of respect' towards fellow translators and their opinions. 'Back in the day', I was embarrasingly unaware of how widely Spanish usage varies and would often laugh at some of the suggestions I read. In this respect, KudoZ has taught me soooo much!

However, I think that in most cases this 'copycat answering' wears off over time and would encourage tolerance and perhaps a little bit of friendly guidance with new users. I honestly think the proporion of 'experienced' users who act this way is not very significant.

For compulsive askers, my best approach is not answering. These people are just taking advantage of the system and can only overlook their questions. In my pair there is one in particular that I ignore completely.


I agree, 100%. However, it's hard to avoid becoming frustrated, because there will always be people tempted to answer, namely IMO:

a) newcomers

b) people with such acute kudozitis that they just can't resist the temptation

c) people who have been taking a break from KudoZ and are not familiar with this particular asker

d) those who will stop at nothing in order to notch up points

e) others (please step forward!)

As before, I think the first three situations can be handled with a little bit of patience, tolerance and guidance.

As for those in group d) and the askers themselves, well, it's not easy.

I think that the only effective way to deal with them is to file complaints with the moderators. I'm not sure that much can be done regarding 'grabbers', but I do remember two cases, a 'dual identity asker' and a 'multiple identity asker' that finally disappeared from the site. Yes, it took a lot of complaining, but perhaps that was because many of us may feel uncomfortable 'policing' the site or 'running to tell mummy'. Moderators perform a role and, although I think we should try to make life easy for them by not involving them in our somethimes childish bickering, we should also be bold enough to report cases of site abuseto them.

And one final thought, which I have posted elsewhere on similar threads:

I would strongly encourage that we all indulge in a little bit of self-criticism. Perhaps the single most effective way of improving the KudoZ experience for all is by analysing our own behaviour, asking ourselves where we go wrong and seeing what we can do about it.

Come to think of it, I'm going to make a new post of it...

Cheers,

Alvaro

[Edited at 2008-04-15 11:33]

[Edited at 2008-04-15 11:34]


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