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Do we need this? - "First validated answer" in KudoZ
Thread poster: Textklick

Textklick  Identity Verified
Local time: 04:48
German to English
+ ...
Nov 27, 2008

Quote:

"Targeted: NEW... First validated answer: Bauherren-Modell (not for points)

Special characteristics of this term posting:
- This question was asked in "first validated answer" mode, in which questions close as soon as an answer is validated with two (net) peer agrees
- This is a "not-for-points" question
The asker has directed this question specifically to ProZ.com users who:
... work in this pair (Your profile shows that you do)
... report a "working" level of expertise in the subject field (You have)
... are native speakers of English (You have reported that you are)
You meet the criteria and are invited to suggest a translation"

I would like to add the question of what effect this 'NEW' idea has upon the image of the community?

Or is it the first time that I have noticed such a question, although it is 'NEW' (exclamation mark)?

[Subject edited by staff or moderator 2008-11-27 01:04 GMT]

[Subject edited by staff or moderator 2008-11-27 01:05 GMT]


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Walter Landesman
Uruguay
Local time: 00:48
Member (2005)
English to Spanish
+ ...
Not new Nov 27, 2008

This "NEW" is quite old, actually.

The first validated answer system, not for points and so on, has been on for quite a while already, maybe more than a year.


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Nicole Schnell  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 20:48
English to German
+ ...
That's where my altruism stops Nov 27, 2008

- This is a "not-for-points" question


Translation: I will neither pay you nor even shall I be bothered to say thanks for your efforts.

- The asker has directed this question specifically to ProZ.com users who:
... work in this pair (Your profile shows that you do)
... report a "working" level of expertise in the subject field (You have)
... are native speakers of English (You have reported that you are)
You meet the criteria and are invited to suggest a translation"


Translation: Make sure that you are sufficiently qualified to serve me. BTW, make it snappy.


I simply filter / ignore this kind of questions.



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LittleBalu
Germany
Local time: 05:48
English to German
+ ...
Well, it does save time and effort ... Nov 27, 2008

... because the asker won't have to go back to close the question, award points, and say "thank you for spending your time to help me".

Incidentally, the question was closed without grading. Reason: Other.


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Steffen Walter  Identity Verified
Germany
Local time: 05:48
Member (2002)
English to German
+ ...
"First validated answer" mode is largely irrelevant... Nov 29, 2008

... at least from what I see in my language pairs, where it is used only for a tiny margin of the total number of questions. Perhaps it's time for staff to rethink and discontinue this feature?

Steffen


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Textklick  Identity Verified
Local time: 04:48
German to English
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
Irrelevant, unnecessary or both? Nov 29, 2008

LittleBalu wrote:

Saves time and effort because the asker won't have to go back to close the question, award points, and say "thank you for spending your time to help me".


Oh LB, my heart bleeds for the poor busy asker! What about my time and effort?

My reasons for raising this issue.

* The perfectly logical points made by Nicole
* The fact that this could lead to the KOG being filled with 'questionable' answers (unless, of course, 'first-validated questions are not automatically added to the KOG)
* It seems pointless and untidy

End of rant.

Steffen Walter wrote:

"First validated answer" mode is largely irrelevant,
at least from what I see in my language pairs, where it is used only for a tiny margin of the total number of questions. Perhaps it's time for staff to rethink and discontinue this feature?


Thanks Steffen.

Who would be the best member of site staff to address with this issue? Or should we let this string 'float' for a while? Whaddya think?

Best,
Chris


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Kim Metzger  Identity Verified
Mexico
Local time: 22:48
German to English
Don't you see? Nov 29, 2008

It's a "help-type" question, just like regular KudoZ. Regular professional level KudoZ is not intended for building reliable glossaries for the community or solving challenging translation problems. The idea is to permit askers to plug something into their translations as quickly as possible. We don't want to put up too many barriers to this process, like requiring context, making them check their dictionaries first, etc.

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Nicole Schnell  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 20:48
English to German
+ ...
I actually don't mind, if... Nov 30, 2008

- The asker is not a translator, but needs to decipher, say, a manual or tries to concoct a greeting card

- The asker is a first time-user who hasn't figured out the rules yet

- The asker is a student in desperate need of help with homework. Research is a skill that needs to be learned and practiced

However, just recently I saw exactly this kind of question posted by a Platinum member. No further comment.


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Enrique Cavalitto
Local time: 00:48
SITE STAFF
No new feature, juts another option for askers Nov 30, 2008

The "first validates answer" KudoZ have been around since the first half of 2006.

They offer askers another option when posting their questions.

FVA questions assign no points, and their answers will not show in the KOG.

Regards,
Enrique


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KSL Berlin  Identity Verified
Portugal
Local time: 04:48
Member (2003)
German to English
+ ...
I was thinking, "Why the Hell would I do this?" Nov 30, 2008

Nicole's post gave me a perspective I can agree with. I can see how persons unfamiliar with the site might not understand the mechanics of the game and want to be confronted with them. I can appreciate that. I can't think of a lot of reasons to respect an item like this from others, however, so I would probably ignore it.

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Textklick  Identity Verified
Local time: 04:48
German to English
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
KOG etc. Nov 30, 2008

Thanks for your clarification, Enrique

Enrique wrote:

The "first validates answer" KudoZ have been around since the first half of 2006.


Maybe time to remove that 'New' flag then?

FVA questions assign no points, and their answers will not show in the KOG.


That's reassuring. Maybe I haven't read the rules in sufficient detail.

I should perhaps add that this post was fuelled by the fact that the question I mentioned above would, I believe, qualify as being a PRO level question. My gut reaction was "Hey buster - that's taking it a bit far!"

Like Nicole, I don't mind providing a bit of help if someone is stuck on an easy term or if it is homework.

And (as Kim humorously alludes), I have no time at all for people who don't provide context, clearly cannot be bothered to invest in dictionaries or who post a string of six or so questions on a daily basis (although that is not the issue under discussion).

Enrique, what do you think about this in the light of Steffen's comment?

Cheers
Chris


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Nicole Schnell  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 20:48
English to German
+ ...
Yes, please remove the "NEW!" Nov 30, 2008

It sounds too much like "New and Improved" and is wayyyy too inviting to the ingenuous mind

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Enrique Cavalitto
Local time: 00:48
SITE STAFF
The "new" label must go, of course Nov 30, 2008

The fact that this feature is not much used is not, in my opinion, a ground for scrapping it.

I agree that the "new" label must go, it was an oversight, thanks for spotting this.

Regards,
Enrique


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Steffen Walter  Identity Verified
Germany
Local time: 05:48
Member (2002)
English to German
+ ...
Any statistics to support your view, Enrique? Dec 1, 2008

Enrique wrote: The fact that this feature is not much used is not, in my opinion, a ground for scrapping it.


Be that as it may, but I'd still like to see some sound KudoZ statistics showing what the share of "first validated answer" questions in the total is. On a related note, shouldn't frequency of use by members/users be one of the criteria to continuously re-assess and justify the merits of particular site features?

Steffen


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Kim Metzger  Identity Verified
Mexico
Local time: 22:48
German to English
Too many options are counterproductive Dec 1, 2008

Enrique wrote:

The fact that this feature is not much used is not, in my opinion, a ground for scrapping it.



In my experience, nine times out of ten, askers choose "first validated answer" because they have no idea what it is all about and are somehow intimidated by the "for points" option. When queried by members as to why this option was chosen instead of standard KudoZ, askers usually reply that they are new and hadn't understood all the options. Once they've read all the rules and spent some time watching what goes on, they almost invariably choose standard KudoZ for future questions.
The argument that the site just wants to provide plenty of options doesn't hold water because the more options that are provided, the more confusing KudoZ becomes for new users. It's similar to the option to restrict questions to members. Once askers realize how many good people they are excluding, they abandon the practice.



[Edited at 2008-12-01 19:15 GMT]


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