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Should accessibility to Kudoz term be limited? Thread poster: Narasimhan Raghavan
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Today I searched the Kudoz glossary for "Einmeldung/einmelden". There is only one unedited Kudoz question and that too is of limited access. Apparently I do not form the part of the team having access to it. Hence I posed a new question vide http://www.proz.com/kudoz/788578
As I have noted therein, I have opted to pose this question to get confirmation for my idea of its meaning and to rende... See more Today I searched the Kudoz glossary for "Einmeldung/einmelden". There is only one unedited Kudoz question and that too is of limited access. Apparently I do not form the part of the team having access to it. Hence I posed a new question vide http://www.proz.com/kudoz/788578
As I have noted therein, I have opted to pose this question to get confirmation for my idea of its meaning and to render this term universally available after my colleagues have proposed the answer.
I am curious to know the logic behind this idea of limited access to meanings of terms. It seems so unfriendly. And it is childish. One can always put up the question once again in the general pool and get it accessible to all. Or is there a universal copyright on the term? We are translators and getting help with terms is a standard Kudoz practice. Apparently this idea of limited access goes against that spirit.
Regards,
N.Raghavan ▲ Collapse
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Heinrich Pesch 
Finland
Local time: 00:13
Member (2003)
Finnish to German
+ ...
| Not accessible to platinum members either | Aug 18, 2004 |
I tried the same term. Access restricted.
But I have never before found any answer when searching through the Kudoz - search glossaries - function. I wonder do they exist at all.
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I was wondering an tried the same. Here is the message that is displayed.
This term is visible only to certain teams or individuals.
You do not appear to be among them.
I have no idea where and why this message is generated, but somebody will explain it I am shure.
By the way, this "proof" does still not convince me that "einmelden" is an existing German word.
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| Teams and Kudoz | Aug 18, 2004 |
Kudoz.net allows proz members who are also members of a team to ask their terminology questions ONLY to members of their own team. These kudoz questions (which carry no points) are thus only accessible to these team members.
I've used this function in the past - especially if I've been working on confidential projects in a proz team.
Hope that answers your question!
Alison
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| When two principles confront each other, which has to give way? | Aug 18, 2004 |
A term is a term is a term. Nothing more nothing less. Of course teamwork is important. But what is the point of keeping the term secret? It cannot be maintained that way. A case in point is "einmelden", for which I have posed a general query and the answer is going to come to the public domain. I am reminded of an old lady who carefully locked her car, with the car-roof open. It was an open car with folding top.
This term seems by the way to be a literal translation of the English... See more A term is a term is a term. Nothing more nothing less. Of course teamwork is important. But what is the point of keeping the term secret? It cannot be maintained that way. A case in point is "einmelden", for which I have posed a general query and the answer is going to come to the public domain. I am reminded of an old lady who carefully locked her car, with the car-roof open. It was an open car with folding top.
This term seems by the way to be a literal translation of the English term "reporting in". I may be wrong too. I wouldn't mind as knowledge is the gainer in the whole thing.
Regards,
N.Raghavan ▲ Collapse
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| why not create a separate teams only glossary? | Aug 18, 2004 |
I also received this frustrating message when searching for a term in the glossaries. In the heat of desperation it comes across as 'for us to know and for you to find out' message. Since this has nothing at all to do with the glossary entries open to all, why not remove team-only entries and form a separate team-only glossary.
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| Leaving things as they are is the best motto under the circumstances | Aug 18, 2004 |
If a separate team-only glossary is made, we will not even know of the existence of such terms. As things stand, the remedy is clear. Pose the term again as a new question open to all. Then nothing stands in the way of making the term public knowledge. In fact, I was not frustrated. Just amused at the childishness of the arrangement. It is like locking a car with the roof open, as already mentioned by me earlier.
It is now open for such team members to come forward and themselves re... See more If a separate team-only glossary is made, we will not even know of the existence of such terms. As things stand, the remedy is clear. Pose the term again as a new question open to all. Then nothing stands in the way of making the term public knowledge. In fact, I was not frustrated. Just amused at the childishness of the arrangement. It is like locking a car with the roof open, as already mentioned by me earlier.
It is now open for such team members to come forward and themselves remove the ridiculous exclusivity. Anyhow it will be done for them by others like me.
Regards,
N.Raghavan
writeaway wrote:
I also received this frustrating message when searching for a term in the glossaries. In the heat of desperation it comes across as 'for us to know and for you to find out' message. Since this has nothing at all to do with the glossary entries open to all, why not remove team-only entries and form a separate team-only glossary. ▲ Collapse
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| The idea was to provide for the possibility of confidentiality | Aug 18, 2004 |
On several occasions members have asked for a way to use KudoZ for collaboration exclusively among their group / company. Usually (but not always) the reason is the need to maintain confidentiality. You can imagine how some terms, for example in a patent, could indicate something a client needs kept private.
Of course, the term should not even come up in a search. I will therefore "close the roof."
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| Thanks Henry | Aug 18, 2004 |
Henry wrote:
On several occasions members have asked for a way to use KudoZ for collaboration exclusively among their group / company. Usually (but not always) the reason is the need to maintain confidentiality. You can imagine how some terms, for example in a patent, could indicate something a client needs kept private.
Of course, the term should not even come up in a search. I will therefore "close the roof."
It is definitely better to find no term at all than to find one and then discover it can't be accessed.
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even if the discussion about the terms for a confidential project should remain confidential, it would be nice that the terms themselves are added to the main general public glossary for reference of everyone.
At the end of the days, words are just words.
Cheers,
Grace.
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| How can the word | Aug 18, 2004 |
The idea behind Proz is one of cooperation among professionals and the thing with confidentiality is pushing things too far. When two ideas are in apparent contradiction, which do you think gets precedence? 'Closing the roof' is just like closing a festering wound with cloth without treating it with medicine.
You have mentioned patents. After all a patent is a public document. It gets wide circulation among peers before being admitted, so that objections if any can be lodged within ... See more The idea behind Proz is one of cooperation among professionals and the thing with confidentiality is pushing things too far. When two ideas are in apparent contradiction, which do you think gets precedence? 'Closing the roof' is just like closing a festering wound with cloth without treating it with medicine.
You have mentioned patents. After all a patent is a public document. It gets wide circulation among peers before being admitted, so that objections if any can be lodged within certain time. Even assuming the confidentiality of the contents, there is another way of doing it. Sometime back, I was translating a very sensitive document. I wanted to know the meaning of one German term. I checked in Google, where the term was defined in German. That definition from Google I put in as context. See: http://www.proz.com/kudoz/771086
I got the meaning, it went to Kudoz glossary, the client document confidentiality was not broken and everybody was satisfied. And coming to the title of this posting. How can "einmelden" be confidential?
I have one suggestion to make. The site staff and/or the moderators should have an idea about the number of such restricted terms. Let the moderator in the respective language pair see whether a given term has anything confidential about it. If not, the terms can be included in a list. This will help in getting it eventually into the general list accessible to all.
Better still, there can be a button for the team members to opt for making it public. Or atleast including it in their personal glossary. The fact that even this is not done says volumes.
Regards,
N.Raghavan
Henry wrote:
On several occasions members have asked for a way to use KudoZ for collaboration exclusively among their group / company. Usually (but not always) the reason is the need to maintain confidentiality. You can imagine how some terms, for example in a patent, could indicate something a client needs kept private.
Of course, the term should not even come up in a search. I will therefore "close the roof."
[Edited at 2004-08-19 14:34] ▲ Collapse
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two2tango
Argentina
Local time: 18:13
Member
English to Spanish
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| I have no problem with a "closed roof" exchange | Aug 19, 2004 |
I have no objection to a group using the KudoZ system to exchange private information, if it falls within ProZ business model.
If "the roof is closed" and the rest of the ProZians don't even know about this exchange, nobody gets hurt, nobody even knows about the exchange. Is using part of the channel for other extra service.
Cheers,
Enrique
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Jack Doughty
United Kingdom
Local time: 22:13
Russian to English
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In memoriam | I don't see the point of this facility | Aug 19, 2004 |
If translators are working as a group, surely they can communicate with each other directly by email, without going through the ProZ site at all?
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Magda Dziadosz
Poland
Local time: 23:13
Member (2004)
English to Polish
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| Let's not get overexcited about something which appears to be a technical bug | Aug 19, 2004 |
Teams building is a facility offered by ProZ.com and exchange between team members in a KudoZ-similar way is part of the package.
Are you requesting a public access to private correspondence between team members?
And Jack, we all CAN communicate via e-mails or phones, yet ProZ.com offers something different that this, no?
Magda
[Edited at 2004-08-19 10:07]
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