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Limit of 30 KudoZ asked per month
Thread poster: LegalTransform

LegalTransform  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 01:01
Member (2002)
Spanish to English
+ ...
Oct 2, 2007

I think that there should be a limit of 30 KudoZ questions asked per month. That is more than anyone should ever need!

I think some people are not doing any research and are just posting questions, letting others do all the work. Not only can they accept jobs for which they are grossly unqualified, but they can work faster and charge less.

There are some people who have asked over 300 questions in one year!!! I would be completely embarrassed to do that!

These people would not be able to survive without using KudoZ and that is just wrong...

The benefits of receiving KudoZ points (being listed higher in the directory) do not outweigh the time spent doing someone else's work for free and possibly stealing work away from you. So, why do people continue to answer?

We should answer KudoZ to give someone the occasional helping hand on a difficult job (we all need help from time to time), but some people seem to need help on 5 or more questions EVERYDAY! Do they realize that there is something wrong with this or are these mostly new translators who never translated pre-ProZ and don't know any better?



[Edited at 2007-10-02 08:03]


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Marcelo Silveyra
United States
Local time: 22:01
Member (2007)
German to English
+ ...
I don't think there's much of a chance of this getting approved... Oct 2, 2007

but I agree wholeheartedly (and think I know a couple of askers that you might be talking about...this came up in a previous forum thread as well).

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Marie-Hélène Hayles  Identity Verified
Local time: 07:01
Italian to English
+ ...
I also agree Oct 2, 2007

But like Marcelo, I think there's very little chance of the limits being reduced further. They were implemented a couple of years ago after extensive and at times heated debate, and were thought to represent a reasonable compromise. My own feeling is they don't keep anyone happy - neither the "heavy users" who can no longer ask more than x questions a day (varies with membership status; I can no longer find the limits in the Kudoz rules), nor those who feel that the limits are still too high to stop what can be perceived as abuse of the system.

It can occasionally happen that through inexperience or lack of attention we take on a job for which we need a higher level of help from our peers, but it really shouldn't be happening every day. Perhaps a limit of x per day, 3x per week and only 5x per month might be useful in not penalising those who really need a hand on a single job while screening those who use Kudoz as their first line of enquiry rather than the last resort, as the rules clearly state it should be.

[Edited at 2007-10-02 09:14]


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James Calder  Identity Verified
Spain
Local time: 07:01
Member (2006)
Spanish to English
+ ...
Abuse Oct 2, 2007

Couldn't agree more, Tampa. There was a fellow member in our language pairs flooding out Kudoz with questions the other day, obviously working on a text he/she had no idea about. I've never seen this user in a forum and I've never seen him/her answer other people's questions either.

We all taken on jobs where terminology presents a bit of a problem, but this user consistently abuses the goodwill of his colleagues. Needless to say, I never answer any of his/her questions.

If Proz aren't prepared to do anything about it, the least we can do is filter his/her questions. Unfortunately, there will always be people prepared to lend him/her a helping hand.


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Paul Cohen  Identity Verified
Greenland
Local time: 03:01
German to English
+ ...
KudoZ-aholics - Is there a 12-step program? Oct 2, 2007

I wholeheartedly agree that there should be stricter limits on the number of KudoZ questions asked. If you can't manage to get through the month on "just" 30 KudoZ questions, then you're not a professional translator.

What amazes me is how many people use KudoZ as a way of advertising the work that they're doing. "Oh, I don't know how I'll ever finish translating this huge PowerPoint presentation on combating toxic industrial waste in the food chain! The client is so BIG and IMPORTANT and this text really has me stumped! And the deadline is tomorrow morning! Could anybody help with this term…?" I can only assume that these askers think that it bolsters their image when they flaunt their latest jobs like this, but in reality hundreds (if not thousands!) of their colleagues around the world are rolling their eyes in disbelief. It's not positive advertising to ask a question that reveals that you are (once again) totally out of your depth, have accepted a job that you should have turned down, and are absolutely desperate for help. It's negative advertising! At the end of the day, such askers may be able to deliver a (slightly) better product to their clients thanks to a handful of KudoZ questions, but the price is high. They will gradually reap the scorn and mockery of their fellow colleagues on the Web.

The bottom line of course is what kind of translations can KudoZ abusers deliver to their customers. All's fair in love and war - and translating! If you can crank out your texts and continue to meet your deadlines with high-quality work that keeps the customers happy, then I say all the more power to you! Most clients aren't even aware of KudoZ or that their texts are being analyzed by a huge global network of translators anyway. Fire away! Ask us a question! Any question!

Let's be honest, though. Nobody who consistently takes on work that is far beyond their abilities will be able to achieve and maintain a high level of quality output. Nevertheless, we shouldn't make life too easy for KudoZ-aholics. If you notice that people are way out of their depth and abusing the system, ask them for input and feedback. What are their own ideas and what has their own research produced? Could they show us what they have so far so we can see what direction they are going with the translation? The askers may not get the hint, or pretend not to care, but your fellow professional colleagues at proz.com will understand that they are not helping peers but rather parasites – and very likely ignore their questions in the future.

Unfortunately, there is no 12-step program for KudoZ-aholics. The best we can do is avoid being enablers.

And now, if you'll excuse me, I have to return to my urgent 800-page top-secret white paper on global warming and the secondary effects of industrial and agricultural waste in the marine food chain - boy, what a JOB!! Whew! I'm exhausted already...and it's SO late and I have a tight deadline and I was wondering if anyone had an idea of how to translate the term "bio-industrielles Auseinandersetzungsprofil mit negativen Folgen"? Of course I know what the author is trying to say but...


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Vadim Poguliaev  Identity Verified
Russian Federation
Local time: 09:01
English to Russian
I don't see a problem Oct 2, 2007

If translator is basicly a knockhead or doesn't have any idea about the subject, even a 10^6 kudoz questions won't help to him/her to produce decent translation, so why bother with limits?
Let those people AND their customers have what they want.


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Enrique Cavalitto
Local time: 03:01
SITE STAFF
On tightening KudoZ limits Oct 2, 2007

There was a quick poll last year on the issue of having stricter limits on the amount of questions that can be asked.

The question was: "Would you agree with lowering the weekly limits of KudoZ questions to 45/15 for member/non-members?"

Out of the 1223 who voted
  • 36.6% selected "No, keep them at 60/20"
  • 34.1% selected "I don't care
  • 22.7% selected "Yes"
  • 6.5% selected "I don't know"


Regards,
Enrique


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xxxLia Fail  Identity Verified
Spain
Local time: 07:01
Spanish to English
+ ...
making others aware Oct 2, 2007

James Calder wrote:

Couldn't agree more, Tampa. There was a fellow member in our language pairs flooding out Kudoz with questions the other day, obviously working on a text he/she had no idea about. I've never seen this user in a forum and I've never seen him/her answer other people's questions either.



I think I know who you mean. It's becoming obvious, I think.

In exactly 2 years X has posted over 2000 questions and answered about 10.

It makes my blood boil to see someone take so much and give so little, I stopped helping this person a LONG time ago -- my decision, as it's my blood that's boiling:-)

But no harm to raise the issue and make other people aware.

I'm not sure if an absolute limit should be set, but maybe a relative upper limit-- relative to the amount of Qs answered, as a gentle reminder to "give" even if not very "generously", and not to take all the time.


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xxxLia Fail  Identity Verified
Spain
Local time: 07:01
Spanish to English
+ ...
It's not ......... Oct 2, 2007

Enrique wrote:

There was a quick poll last year on the issue of having stricter limits on the amount of questions that can be asked.

The question was: "Would you agree with lowering the weekly limits of KudoZ questions to 45/15 for member/non-members?"

Out of the 1223 who voted
  • 36.6% selected "No, keep them at 60/20"
  • 34.1% selected "I don't care
  • 22.7% selected "Yes"
  • 6.5% selected "I don't know"


Regards,
Enrique


...about weekly limits

OR

about members/non-members

I'm not a member and I answer FAR more Qs than I ask, apart from the fact that I don't need to ask a huge amount (I have dictionaries, the WWW, colleagues, etc, and only use ProZ as a last resort). The limits that exist, as far as I'm concerned, are more than enough.

It's about giving in some proportion to what one gets, it's about not abusing the generosity/innocence of answerers, it's about not propping up people who take on jobs above them because they KNOW they can pick brains in ProZ ....

That would mean setting a limit to Qs asked as a ratio of Qs answered that would dissuade freeloaders.


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Marie-Hélène Hayles  Identity Verified
Local time: 07:01
Italian to English
+ ...
Answers Oct 2, 2007

Lia Fail wrote:

That would mean setting a limit to Qs asked as a ratio of Qs answered that would dissuade freeloaders.


Unfortunately the one thing that can't be regulated is the quality of the answer provided - and while I agree in principle that discouraging freeloaders by making them answer questions if they want to ask questions is not a bad idea, there's nothing that makes my blood boil more than a totally literal answer produced from a 20-second Google search by someone with no experience whatsoever on the subject... and I fear that if Lia's suggestion was implemented, there'd be a lot more of those around.

[Edited at 2007-10-02 12:46]


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Kim Metzger  Identity Verified
Mexico
Local time: 00:01
German to English
The current limit is 240 questions per month Oct 2, 2007

The limits are listed under KudoZ - About. Members can ask 60 questions per week, 240 questions per month, and 3,120 questions per year.

31. ASKING: Is there a limit on the number of questions that I can ask?

Yes. Your daily limit (measured over a sliding 24-hr period) depends on your membership level. If you are not registered with ProZ.com, you can ask one (1) question per day. If you are registered but not member, you can ask five (5). If you are member, you can ask fifteen (15). There are also weekly limits of 20 questions for registered non-members and 60 questions for members.

http://www.proz.com/?sp=about/kudoz


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Amy Duncan  Identity Verified
Brazil
Local time: 04:01
Portuguese to English
+ ...
Who cares? Oct 2, 2007

Who cares how many questions somebody asks? Does it really have anything to do with you or me? If you find it objectionable, just don't answer them!

Amy


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xxxLia Fail  Identity Verified
Spain
Local time: 07:01
Spanish to English
+ ...
sigh! Oct 2, 2007

Marie-Hélène Hayles wrote:

Lia Fail wrote:

That would mean setting a limit to Qs asked as a ratio of Qs answered that would dissuade freeloaders.


Unfortunately the one thing that can't be regulated is the quality of the answer provided - and while I agree in principle that discouraging freeloaders by making them answer questions if they want to ask questions is not a bad idea, there's nothing that makes my blood boil more than a totally literal answer produced from a 20-second Google search by someone with no experience whatsoever on the subject... and I fear that if Lia's suggestion was implemented, there'd be a lot more of those around.

[Edited at 2007-10-02 12:46]


You're right of course, one can't really force someone to "give".


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Charlie Bavington  Identity Verified
Local time: 06:01
French to English
It's not just about the askers in question Oct 2, 2007

Vadim Poguliaev wrote:

If translator is basicly a knockhead or doesn't have any idea about the subject, even a 10^6 kudoz questions won't help to him/her to produce decent translation, so why bother with limits?

I see your point, up to a point.
One issue which sometimes gets mentioned in these threads, and sometimes does not, is that of the impact on others.

If a knockhead [sic] is posting 15 questions per day, then that "pollutes" the list, which means that other, "genuine" askers' questions can easily get overlooked.
(This happened to me once, which is why, to answer Amy, for example, I care. I was desperate, had looked for hours, asked a Q, two hours later it was off the first page of Fr-Eng questions because of some remarkably boneheaded questions)

In my idle moments (which are not many), I sometimes wonder what would happen if those of us who DO object to the number of Qs had a kind of concerted campaign to post the maximum number we were allowed, just to prove the point that the limits are too high?


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Kristina Kolic  Identity Verified
Croatia
Local time: 07:01
Member (2007)
English to Croatian
+ ...
The current limits are fine Oct 2, 2007

In my opinion, the current limits are fine and I wouldn't like to see any further limitations. As a matter of fact, the problem is not the limit itself but the quality of the KudoZ asked.

Personally, I do not use KudoZ much (I have asked only 5 so far, which does not mean that I will not, eventually, need to ask more questions per day in the future) other than to answer KudoZ asked by my peers but I do not see any problem with the reverse situation. Some of us may be insecure and therefore ask more questions than others (young translators, beginners...), some of us may even abuse of the system... (what harm could they do other than to themselves, because any outsourcer can check the poster's profile and see the KudoZ asked and answered by such poster). I just cannot imagine ProZ, i.e. KudoZ, becoming an excessively selective and restrictive space instead of an open space - as it is now, with its appropriate rules - for translators.

In my opinion, ProZ should remain what it is - a space for translators to share their experience and knowledge and to help each other. If you don't want to answer a question, just don't. I do not see why there should be further restrictions imposed.


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