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Word search functions: Finding verbs only
Thread poster: Rafa Lombardino

Rafa Lombardino
United States
Local time: 20:20
Member (2005)
English to Portuguese
+ ...
Mar 28, 2006

I'm not sure if this is the correct section, but I couldn't find anything Microsoft Word-related...

I'm proofreading this one document which has already been translating from English into Spanish and the client just told me that they need the speech to be informal, that is, instead of referring to "Usted" it has to be directed to "tú".

Since there are only so many pronouns, I was able to do a quick search and change what needed to be informal. But I cannot do it with the verbs, since there's a lot of them being used here and there. I've already gone over the whole file before I heard this little detail and I was trying to avoid simply going over it again to change all of the verbs because I'm afraid my eyes are too familiar with the text...

Well, my question is: is there any technique I could use to have Word find only the verbs it can identify on the text? I know that it has some proofreading and summarizing functions (even though I'm sure that they're as reliable as the spell check — that is, not that reliable!), but I've never went as far as using it and was wondering if it can come in handy to help me out in this case.

Thanks!


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Clarisa Moraña  Identity Verified
Argentina
Local time: 01:20
Member (2002)
English to Spanish
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Wrong procedure Mar 29, 2006


I'm afraid my eyes are too familiar with the text...


I'm afraid the chosen procedure is wrong. You cannot use a search and replace function for Spanish verbs in a proofreading. Besides, as you are not Spanish speaking you shouldn't have accepted that job. You risk of not detecting details unseen when Spanish is not your mother tongue.

If you consider that your Spanish is enough good to do a proofreading, why don't you read the text aloud? You'll notice immediately when the wrong verb is used. Or, go and search: "Tú". After it, you'll always find a verb.

Regards

Clarisa


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Rafa Lombardino
United States
Local time: 20:20
Member (2005)
English to Portuguese
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
¡Qué pena que no me has comprendido! Mar 29, 2006

Clarisa Moraña wrote:

I'm afraid the chosen procedure is wrong. You cannot use a search and replace function for Spanish verbs in a proofreading job. Besides, as you are not a Spanish speaker you shouldn't have accepted that job. There's a risk of not detecting details that may be left unseen when Spanish is not your mother tongue (or "native language".)

If you believe that your Spanish is good enough to do a proofreading job, why don't you read the text aloud? You'll notice immediately when the wrong verb is used. Or go and search: "Tú". After it, you'll always find a verb.

Regards

Clarisa


Clarisa,

Aunque el español no sea mi «lengua madre», espero que con este mensaje puedas comprender que no he aceptado un proyecto que no esté calificada para concluir. Soy periodista y llevo algunos años corregiendo profesionalmente textos que no sean muy técnicos en inglés, portugués y español. Además, estoy estudiando en UCSD para el certificado de traducción en inglês y español, que está aprobado por el Estado de California.

Bueno, estereotipos aparte, mi pregunta se trataba de buscar una manera que me ayudara a localizar solamente los verbos para que pudiera decidir si hay que cambiarlos (esto es, solamente cuando se refieren a «Usted», pues el cliente quiere tener un texto informal para «tú»). Como dice, ya había echado un vistazo en la traducción antes de que supiera que se tratara de un texto informal y, considerando el echo de que el documento está muy largo, me gustaría saber si pudiera isolar estos verbos con la función de búsqueda para que los examine ANTES DE QUE REVISE EL TEXTO POR ÚLTIMA VEZ.

Creo que si uno no puede ayudar, no debería hacer críticas negativas sin enterarse del contexto... Y si me permites he corregido tu contestación como puedes ver en la citación. Por ejemplo, en inglés se dice «If you consider that your Spanish is GOOD ENOUGH to» y «enough good» está malo... Y tocante a tu sugerencia de que lea el texto en voz alta, esto es exactamente lo que hago durante la última lectura.

...

Casi me olvidé de decirte que no hace falta poner un «tú» o otro pronombre delante de cada verbo... Al menos que la Real Academia Española haya cambiado la gramática para que esta estructura sea obligatoria y hasta el momento no me hubiera enterado...

¡Gracias por tus comentarios!

[Edited at 2006-03-29 01:38]

[Edited at 2006-03-29 01:42]


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Clarisa Moraña  Identity Verified
Argentina
Local time: 01:20
Member (2002)
English to Spanish
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I don't understand Mar 29, 2006

Rafaela

Thanks for correcting me. I wish I could learn someday... I do know I've got a lot of mistakes. I only write in English in order to communicate with my colleagues here.

I know it's good reading aloud at the end of a proofreading job. But if you also start reading the text in Spanish, aloud and clear, you'll detect the wrong verbs immediately because they will sound absolutely ugly. A search function will never replace your ability to detect a bad sound when you hear it.


Regards

Clarisa


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Rafa Lombardino
United States
Local time: 20:20
Member (2005)
English to Portuguese
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TOPIC STARTER
It's not about right or wrong... Mar 29, 2006

Clarisa Moraña wrote:

Rafaela

Thanks for correcting me. I wish I could learn someday... I do know I've got a lot of mistakes. I only write in English in order to communicate with my colleagues here.

I know it's good reading aloud at the end of a proofreading job. But if you also start reading the text in Spanish, aloud and clear, you'll detect the wrong verbs immediately because they will sound absolutely ugly. A search function will never replace your ability to detect a bad sound when you hear it.


Regards

Clarisa


Reading out loud is the best option, for sure. The thing is that formal verbs are not wrong and I myself use them when I'm working on localizations that do have this kind of tone. However, our clients chose to have the material pretty informal, which is totally their call. I'm kind of bummed out with the situation because it's a large file and I've already corrected everything I was able to pick up with the first reading. The thing is that I'll have to go around and change things like

"¿Está aburrido...?" ==> "¿Estás aburrido...?"
"Haga clic en..." ==> "Haz clic en..."
"Visite el sitio..." ==> "Visita el sitio..."

Well, as you can see, whenever these verbs are written in a formal manner, I'll have to go hunting for them and change each one of them into the informal version. Since I'm so familiar with the text, I was afraid I could miss a couple and overlook one "visite" o "haga" and fail to change them into the imperative that corresponds to "tú"...

Thanks for your comments!


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Clarisa Moraña  Identity Verified
Argentina
Local time: 01:20
Member (2002)
English to Spanish
+ ...
Suggestion Mar 29, 2006

It won't work for all the verbs... but perhaps for the most used ones:

Start reviewing from the beginning (yeah, I know this is too obvious), but as soon as you find the first verb, highligth it in order to remember the location, and search for that verb AND a blank space after it:
(e.g. * visite_ * haz_, where _ is a blank space).

Replace if necessary and go back to the highlighted location. Find the second verb and browse the whole document... It is important to include the blank space in the search.

Perhaps someone can give you a better suggestion.


If we lived in a real world, I would suggest you to forget the file and return to it in two days so you can pick up those verbs.- But I know that we are translators and that ile has to be delivered ASAP (or was it for yesterday?)

Regards

Clarisa


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Riccardo Schiaffino  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 21:20
Member (2003)
English to Italian
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One thing you can try Mar 29, 2006

Rafa Lombardino wrote:

"¿Está aburrido...?" ==> "¿Estás aburrido...?"
"Haga clic en..." ==> "Haz clic en..."
"Visite el sitio..." ==> "Visita el sitio..."

Well, as you can see, whenever these verbs are written in a formal manner, I'll have to go hunting for them and change each one of them into the informal version. Since I'm so familiar with the text, I was afraid I could miss a couple and overlook one "visite" o "haga" and fail to change them into the imperative that corresponds to "tú"...

Thanks for your comments!


What I would suggest is to

1) search for the appropriate verb endings (for all conjugations and for at least the most likely irregular verbs

so you would search in your example for "tá" "ite", etc.

2) replace them with the appropriate ending ("tás", "ita", etc.) PLUS some symbol character that you would not otherwise find in the file (e.g."*"), so your actual replacement strings would be "tás*", "ita*", etc.

3) once you have done your search and replace (which you can speed up by using macros), you would have a translation full of "Visitas*", "Haz*", etc., plus probably a few asterisks in places where they are not appropriate.

4) search for the asterisk symbol, and delete them... making sure that, where the previous replace operation replaced something that was not appropriate, you correct the result.

This is probably quite a bit of work, and not absolutely foolproof. If you decide for something like this, I would suggest to record everything in a macro (that might come handy next time something like this happens).


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Word search functions: Finding verbs only

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