Mobile menu

Pages in topic:   [1 2] >
Poll: When quoting for a project via ProZ.com, would you price lower than when quoting for the same projec
Thread poster: ProZ.com Staff
ProZ.com Staff
Local time: 15:06
SITE STAFF
Feb 8, 2006

This forum topic is for the discussion of the poll question "When quoting for a project via ProZ.com, would you price lower than when quoting for the same projec".

This poll was originally submitted by Nikki Scott-Despaigne

View the poll here

A forum topic will appear each time a new poll is run. For more information, see: http://proz.com/topic/33629


Direct link Reply with quote
 
Romina Minucci
Italy
Local time: 23:06
English to Italian
+ ...
I'm pleased.. Feb 8, 2006

...that many of us have answered NO..

cheers!


Direct link Reply with quote
 

Anjo Sterringa  Identity Verified
Spain
Local time: 23:06
Member (2003)
English to Dutch
+ ...
If at all, it should be the other way around Feb 8, 2006

If an agency cannot find a translator in its data base for a specific project, and posts the job somewhere, this means that they should be willing to pay more, not less for that specific project! On the other hand, I have the feeling that there are many outsourcers posting jobs, just 'fishing' (or should it be 'phishing, in this day and age?) for cheap translators. "Let's see if there's another victim just starting out and willing to work for peanuts." Oh well.... I wonder why people answered 'maybe' because this question begs for a 'certainly not' answer!

Direct link Reply with quote
 

Sandra C.
France
Local time: 23:06
English to French
+ ...
I used to... Feb 8, 2006

...but I refuse to do that now, unless for a friend. It is a great skill we all have, why should we not be paid accordingly?? I am appalled at the rate suggested by certain posts, i.e. 0.04 USD/word for translation!!! Have they taken a look at the cost of living these days?? Unbelievable.
We should all stand our ground, that's the only way things'll change for the better.


Direct link Reply with quote
 

M. Anna Kańduła  Identity Verified
United Kingdom
Local time: 22:06
English to Polish
Maybe... Feb 8, 2006

Anjo Sterringa wrote:

(...) "Let's see if there's another victim just starting out and willing to work for peanuts."


And that works, I'm afraid. One has to gain some experience to be able to show that one is skilled (and to be skilled), and non-profit and cheap translations are one of ways to be "experienced" in eyes of a potential job offerer and to get experience in fact.


Direct link Reply with quote
 
Fred Neild  Identity Verified
English to Spanish
+ ...
I abstain Feb 8, 2006

Now I am the one who finds this poll irrelevant since I believe Proz.com job postings are irrelevant.

If the rates offered are not extremely low, they want it yesterday (maybe at those lowlow rates). Today, I received one asking to translate around 9000 words of technical stuff for today.

Fred


Direct link Reply with quote
 

Lawyer-Linguist  Identity Verified
Portugal
Local time: 22:06
Dutch to English
+ ...
FAF (Friendly Advice for Fred) Feb 8, 2006

Fred Neild wrote:

Now I am the one who finds this poll irrelevant since I believe Proz.com job postings are irrelevant.

Fred


Hi Fred,

Don't to be too hasty there .......

Much as I wholeheartedly share your view as far as many of the job postings are concerned, don't dismiss them altogether.

I found one of my best clients by responding to a job posting and I've had regular - in fact, almost daily - work in my field (legal) ever since and the relationship is now a long-established one.

I don't make a habit of responding to job postings but if I see something that's up my street, I quote at my going rate (which doesn't sell me short by any stretch of the imagination) and when it comes off, I've always managed to gain a repeat client.

That said, it has almost always been in my Dutch»English pair and not Portuguese»English. Lower rates unfortunately prevail for the Romance languages it seems.

Just keep your eyes peeled.

Bye for now
D



[Edited at 2006-02-08 16:06]


Direct link Reply with quote
 
Fred Neild  Identity Verified
English to Spanish
+ ...
Nothing is sacred in business Feb 8, 2006

Deborah do Carmo wrote:

I found one of my best clients by responding to a job posting and I've had regular - in fact, almost daily - work in my field (legal) ever since and the relationship is now a long-established one.


Thanks Deborah, this is quite encouraging.

Deborah do Carmo wrote:

That said, it has almost always been in my Dutch»English pair and not Portuguese»English.


I have the illusion that in some pairs (not mine) the situation may be better, and you have confirmed it.

Deborah do Carmo wrote:
Lower rates unfortunately prevail for the Romance languages it seems.


Maybe some believe that we are powered by solar energy and we work in huts by the sea so we don't pay rent.


However, you have been here for a while, and you don't seem to have acquired many clients through this system. Maybe the 'price' we pay for this system is too high. If we made a list of pros and cons what would happen? Maybe that client you got could have contacted you in another way. Maybe we wouldn't have so many amateurs 'showing off' in KudoZ. Maybe rates wouldn't be so... What about our image as a professional community? We are the benchmark for cheap, any doubts?

Who is benefitting from KudoZ and Job postings? Aren't we being naive? Outsourcers get quality (sometimes) at KudoZ for free, and cheap prices at Job postings.

Major companies have (or are) implementing at the moment bidding systems. Why are they doing this? They have excellent reasons for that. Do we? Is this Agencies.com or Proz.com?

Once a successful business man told me something like, "nothing is sacred in business", i.e. nothing is eternal, specially in this era where we need to keep evolving and change has become what differentiates a winner from a loser. What used to work in the past doesn't necessarily have to work in the future.

Fred


Direct link Reply with quote
 

Angela&Claudio
Italy
Local time: 23:06
Italian to Spanish
+ ...
"Free market"; what a swindle!! Feb 8, 2006

Shouldn't "being competitive" mean offering very high quality for a reasonable rate instead of offering very low rates?
Yes, it sounds nice but then...we're living on a "free market" world, what can we do?
And well, I voted yes. I do it sometimes, I need the work... but guess what; I still get always outbidden.


Direct link Reply with quote
 
Romina Minucci
Italy
Local time: 23:06
English to Italian
+ ...
I don't agree with you Fred Feb 8, 2006

[quote]Fred Neild wrote:

If the rates offered are not extremely low, they want it yesterday (maybe at those lowlow rates).

I found 2 of my best customers through Proz, answering to their job posts. I'm very satisfied with their rates (which aren't low at all) and professionalism.

be more optimistic


Direct link Reply with quote
 
Fred Neild  Identity Verified
English to Spanish
+ ...
less than 1 good client/year Feb 8, 2006

Romina Minucci wrote:

I found 2 of my best customers through Proz, answering to their job posts. I'm very satisfied with their rates (which aren't low at all) and professionalism.

be more optimistic


Hi Romina,

Two good clients since 2003 (this is what I found in your profile). Be optimistic? That is an average of less than 1 good client/year.

Anybody with two digits please?

Fred


Direct link Reply with quote
 

sabina moscatelli  Identity Verified
Italy
Local time: 23:06
Member (2004)
German to Italian
+ ...
This is a never ending story. Feb 8, 2006

If rates are low, it's just because we keep accepting them. We are not obliged to, but as far as I can see there is no single job posting which doesn't receive at least 1 answer from one professional.

Who's to blame?


Direct link Reply with quote
 

Russell Gillis  Identity Verified
Local time: 16:06
Spanish to English
One client per year with ongoing work is very good! Feb 8, 2006

Hello Fred,

I also have increased my workload substantially through ProZ, by both responding to the occasional job posting and being contacted directly.

I think you have missed the point of the above posters. Landing one good agency/client is very worthwhile if they provide you with ongoing work. Two agencies that I found in this manner (quoting), provide me with work on a weekly basis. Often I have to turn down work because I am sent too much!

So don't discount someone because they only find one client per year. I would rather have one good client with ongoing work than ten with sporadic work!

Best regards,

Russell


Direct link Reply with quote
 

Luis Arri Cibils  Identity Verified
Local time: 17:06
Member (2003)
English to Spanish
+ ...
Bidding wars in other areas Feb 8, 2006

Hi Fred,

You may find of interest these excerpts from an article published in the February 2006 issue of IP Law & Business, a trade magazine distributed among Intellectual Property lawyers, among others. The bidding war is not limited to freelance translators. Incidentally, I understand that there is a lot of patent prep work (for filing in the US) that is migrating from the US to other “low-cost” English-speaking countries.

HOW LOW WOULD THEY GO?
Firms raced to the bottom in an auction for Tyco´s patent preparation work.

When Bill Lytton arrived at Tyco International Ltd. in late 2002, one of the new general counsel´s first moves was to reduce the number of outside law firms … for IP work alone, Tyco employed about 100 firms.
.. . . .
Lytton chose an unconventional approach: He told the legal department´s top IP lawyer to hold an e-auction to find the lowest law firm bidders for its business.
. . . . .
[Tyco] sent out requests for proposals to about 30 firms, asking them about the technology at their firms, the kinds of patent applications they’d handled before, who would be on their Tyco team, and general questions about IP philosophy. Ultimately 14 firms were invited to participate, and 12 accepted.
. . . . .
The IP team watched the auction together, sitting at a computer terminal [at company’s headquarters]. At first, firms kept their prices high and the bidding moved slowly … But, as closing time approached, prices dropped quickly… No one will disclose the bid numbers … [but it is estimated that] Tyco is now paying about $2,000 less per patent application than it was in the preauction era…[T]he company filed more than 900 applications in 2005 –saving about $1.8 million.
. . . . .
The winning boutiques included [2 firms unknown, at least to me]. A few large firms participated in the bidding, but most were not price-competitive … A few opted not to participate at all.
Even the winning firms bid reluctantly. “We were skeptical as to the wisdom of any company seeking the lowest bidder for services as important as procuring intellectual property”…[However, some participants] viewed the e-auction as an opportunity to work with other Tyco divisions. [One of them] now represents two more.
. . . . .
Of course, the real winner was Tyco. “Today about 75 percent of our patent prep work is with eight firms,”says Pace, [adding that] the option process gave Tyco an idea of how much the services should cost, so it can set fees in the future without going through an auction.


[Edited at 2006-02-08 18:12]


Direct link Reply with quote
 
Fred Neild  Identity Verified
English to Spanish
+ ...
Betting on the wrong horse and odds Feb 8, 2006

Russell Gillis wrote:
So don't discount someone because they only find one client per year.


Hi Russell,

I suppose you refer to Romina.

@Romina,

Please accept my apologies if I have somehow offended you. Any translator capturing new clients is admirable (specially nowadays).


I am sure that translators get jobs through postings, but everybody must have a marketing and business strategy plan with clear goals to make sure you are not betting on the wrong horse and wasting time while the competition is 10 blocks ahead of you.

I respect your opinion Russell but one good client/year is good depending on efforts made to achieve this, and other factors. I am sure that for some this will be a great result and for some it will be a poor one.


Russell Gillis wrote:
I would rather have one good client with ongoing work than ten with sporadic work!

Russell


I am afraid I disagree. This strategy is extremely dangerous and is like betting all your chips on one number. Odds are against you. I'd rather have the 10 sporadic clients (if I were forced to choose), although we need both IMO.


Last year I had this great weekly basis client and suddenly they started pressuring me to lower rates (when my trend is constantly upwards). I was lucky to have other clients, so I let them go (it wasn't easy at first). This is actually quite common and if a significant part of your income is based on a few clients you become very dependant.

Fred


Direct link Reply with quote
 
Pages in topic:   [1 2] >


To report site rules violations or get help, contact a site moderator:

Moderator(s) of this forum
Jared Tabor[Call to this topic]

You can also contact site staff by submitting a support request »

Poll: When quoting for a project via ProZ.com, would you price lower than when quoting for the same projec

Advanced search






memoQ translator pro
Kilgray's memoQ is the world's fastest developing integrated localization & translation environment rendering you more productive and efficient.

With our advanced file filters, unlimited language and advanced file support, memoQ translator pro has been designed for translators and reviewers who work on their own, with other translators or in team-based translation projects.

More info »
WordFinder
The words you want Anywhere, Anytime

WordFinder is the market's fastest and easiest way of finding the right word, term, translation or synonym in one or more dictionaries. In our assortment you can choose among more than 120 dictionaries in 15 languages from leading publishers.

More info »



All of ProZ.com
  • All of ProZ.com
  • Term search
  • Jobs