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KudoZ: No Context = No Truth or ....
Thread poster: Giuliana Buscaglione

Giuliana Buscaglione  Identity Verified
Austria
Local time: 18:40
Member (2001)
German to Italian
+ ...
Apr 19, 2002


.... translation = a guess!



Dear colleagues,



Terms help okay, but there\'s no rule saying we ought to be telegraphic and not to provide enough context. I would say context is absolutely necessary for us to understand and to provide real help. Sometimes I think askers simply forget we don\'t see the whole text.



From KudoZ Start Page:



\"Before you ask a KudoZ question, please note the following rules:



- Only ask a question after searching dictionaries and the ProZ.com glossaries. (View now)\"



Wonderful! May I say I have to believe some don\'t?



\"- Terms / phrases should be less than 10 words in length.

(For larger jobs, use: InstantJobs)\"



I understand this sentence following way: translation of 10 words (context not included)



Am I wrong?



10 words per question: I think it\'s too much in some cases(KudoZ Easy: we provide the translation of a full sentence this way. I don\'t think this can still be called \"term help\"... wrong?)



I wish you all a nice weekend.



Giuliana


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Egmont
Spain
Local time: 18:40
Afrikaans to Spanish
+ ...
CONTEXT IS ALMOST ALL! Apr 19, 2002

Wihtout the context you can only guess...

Then imagination and intuition are some of the solutions...
[addsig]


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Francesco D'Alessandro
Italy
Local time: 18:40
English to Italian
+ ...
I 100% support Giuliana's reminder Apr 19, 2002

Please let us all carry out a 30-second conscience examination before we hit the \"send question\" button to ask ourselves:

- did I search the glossary first? We all are in a hurry... particularly the answerers, because they are translating two jobs at the same time: their own and the asker\'s. And, kudoz and browniz points apart, the second job is for free...

- did I include in my question ALL the possible context? As any translator knows, translation may vary according to context. If we want accurate responses, we should do all we can to help the answerer help us. Please let\'s include as much context as we can to help the answerers understand our questions. A full sentence encompassing the dubious term is welcome.



I can personally remember a few cases when an answerer\'s response saved me a big headache and a waste of time, so let\'s make the best of this wonderful facility: a global super-brain and terminology bank no CAT can ever equal!


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Yubing YANG
English to Chinese
+ ...
In name of a professional translator! Apr 20, 2002

There\'re two situation I would be much interested in getting involved in Kudoz,

1.A foreigner who knows little about Chinese or Chinese culture

2.Professional translators have difficulty in translating some terms in specialised subjects.

3.Project manager seeking experienced, qualified professionals



If a asker is honest, serious, professional, we can always tell from the CONTEXTS or NO CONTEXTS he/her has posted. I joined Proz.com communities for nearly a half year, and now I\'m actively participating in Kuoz. I understand there\'re the good professionals and there\'re some who are not. It takes a while and you will understand everything if you\'re a qualified one.



It\'s a pity when a project manager who may not understand your language pair.


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Gilda Manara  Identity Verified
Italy
Local time: 18:40
German to Italian
+ ...
I agree with Giuliana Apr 20, 2002

Posting questions without context is completely against the spirit of this site.

It shows no consideration for the colleagues who are asked to answer - their work is not made easier by hacinng to guess what might be the right answer, and frequently discover they have given a wrong one, only because the asker had been to telegraphic in his question. It leads to entering wrong or misleading translations in the glossaries. It makes it difficult to give an agree/disagree, and so the asker is not helped to choose the right answer, neither can the question be closed when the asker doesn\'t do it (this is frequently the case, especially when askers are anonymous or no members of the site). I agree 100% with the message of Giuliana - and would even suggest that some fundamental rules for using ProZ, either as a member or as a visitor, should be given a much more evident location on the main page.



Gilda


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Roberta Anderson  Identity Verified
Italy
Local time: 18:40
Member (2001)
English to Italian
+ ...
Compulsory fields when requesting help Apr 20, 2002

Technical solution:

How about some automatic mechanisms to ensure that all the correct information is provided and force the asker to think again if something is missing?



Something like filling in some compulsory fields:

1. Term (with a max. number of characters allowed)

2. Context

3. Question

If 1 of these fields is left empty (or just filled in with spaces or xxx), the asker gets a message like: \"Nothing has been entered for: \'_\'. Pls provide all information requested.\"



If in spite of this guidance context and questions are still not forthcoming, then potential answerers will at least know that info has purposefully (and not carelessly) been omitted.

Roberta


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Giuliana Buscaglione  Identity Verified
Austria
Local time: 18:40
Member (2001)
German to Italian
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
Thanks! Apr 20, 2002

Hi,



Thanks for your support! The absence of and little context have always been a sort of \"thorn in my eye\". I wonder how one can deal with languages at a professional level and still ask for \"THE correct translation\" of a single term. Of course, I am not talking about basic questions. Still, even basic questions might hide germs for a possible misinterpretation which might lead to a correct formulation not suitable for the (given) context. A little example: \"I love you\". With no context, anyone thinks at the more immediate context, love between man and woman. In many languages you don\'t have to ask: \"_between man and woman_ or _a mother to her child_?\", therefore you think there\'s no need for context. Well, we do in Italian: we need to know whether a woman is saying \"I love you\" (to her husband - ti amo - or to her child - ti voglio bene -). The more immediate translation isn\'t actually wrong, but it sounds strange. For hair splitters: we do use the verb \"amare\" for our children, when we are saying to someone else we love them.



Thank you MingKwai for highlighting this point: \"China and Chinese culture\" or you need to know \"language, Country and culture\", if you want to provide a good translation. Actually, worse: context is not enough sometimes... it seems only to be the first step: without it you can\'t climb that steep ladder leading to safe ground.



I have seen some very educated proposals in old KudoZ and I think it was a double shame the questions were still open: no context, several educated proposals (= unfortunately, pure guesses in those cases), no real help for askers... all efforts for no use.



Let\'s forget KudoZ and think about our daily work: Isn\'t it counterproductive (if not dangerous) for a professional to translate without asking for appropriate context? Would you translate without a clear context?



Perhaps, I am repetitive, but I have begged some colleagues several times to add some context with little improvement, no improvement or I have encountered only \"deaf ears\".



Personally, I won\'t try to provide any further _real_ help to these people, for the little I could, only one of the possible suitable answers, should I feel like, as no context means to me that the asker is satisfied with any of the suitable answers. It\'s a shame.



Giuliana
[addsig]


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