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Why do people flock to Proz.com? Is it for the jobs? For getting certified?.......
Thread poster: Telesforo Fernandez
Telesforo Fernandez
Local time: 17:19
English to Spanish
+ ...
Oct 20, 2001

I would like to start a new discussion. Why do translators flock to PROZ.COM? Is it to see the jobs that are posted, or for pinning up their profiles, for working together and helping each other in times of translation difficulties, or is it for getting cetified?

Different people come for different resasons, obviously. I come to the site because it helps me in times of translation difficulties and believe me it is a good samaritan for anyone, even for those who want to get a whole paragraph translated. And the wonder of wonders is that , you get so many choices - a real warehouse of intelligent and helpful translators - and that too for free.

Others have helped me a lot on this site, and I too have helped my colleagues. As far as the jobs are concerned, it is a bit difficult to say - of course there are many colleagues who have said that they have secured lot of jobs through this site.

Now this question of native speakers - up to now we were transnational translators and multilingual at times, but now we will soon become segregated as specific natives,and later on, perhaps, as Europeans or Americans or Asians. In such circunstances it may so happen that the Europeans may not help the Americans, for example,for the term difficulties and vice- versa. I would like to have your inputs please.


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Catherine Bolton  Identity Verified
Local time: 13:49
Member (2002)
Italian to English
+ ...
not for certification Oct 20, 2001

Native speaker certification is a new just this month, whereas Proz has had tons of members for quite some time. It may draw new people but it\'s not the reason.

The reason I like Proz is the very reason Henry founded it: ours is a lonely profession and it\'s wonderful to know that you can turn to someone for help when you need it.

I doubt that certification will create barriers. People who are unwilling to help someone out probably wouldn\'t join proz in the first place.


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CLS Lexi-tech
Local time: 07:49
Member (2004)
English to Italian
+ ...
What Proz.com can do for us, and what we can do for Proz.com Oct 20, 2001

Agree with Bolton, about the loneliness of the profession and how Proz.com has helped create a virtual, and real, community. I have made several friends through Proz.com, and established many professional ties to other translators. Henry Dotterer has been very open to translators\' input and suggestions, and has given us a number of useful tools, upgraded the server several times.

I think that the time has come to think in very practical terms how we can help Henry continue to improve the site. Obviously, the site needs money, and so far membership has been free and Platinum/Premium optional.

Personally, I agreed right away to the option above, as a very small fee indeed to pay for the plethora of services offered and the great sense of community of peers.

Every day we get new members who appreciate the benefits. Let\'s think how we can contribute to the site\'s growth, financial and otherwise.



Paola L M



[ This Message was edited by: on 2001-10-20 05:56 ]

[ This Message was edited by: on 2001-10-20 05:57 ]


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Giuliana Buscaglione  Identity Verified
Austria
Local time: 13:49
Member (2001)
German to Italian
+ ...
Alone on the Road Oct 20, 2001

As to the rethorical question why people come to Proz.com, allow me to recall the old times (1987), when I started working: I had no computer at home, so I used to go to my agency every morning, to break my head in trying to remember all the DOS combinations I needed in order to be able to load, to save or to rescue my work..hard times! No Internet, no nothing. We were a little group of translators there, who used to spend about 12 hours a day at office, facing the same troubles in different languages. Still, we were used to ask questions to each other, whenever we felt unsure or helpless. Now we mostly sit at home in front of a very modern tecnology, but would be cut off from the \"rest of the world\" in this sense, if we hadn\'t sites like Proz.com. I have been here only for a couple of days now, but I had already the chance to feel the way I felt when at office with my old colleagues/friends: less alone! It is good to see that I am not the only one feeling unsure of a translation, that so many other people are ready to help and to suggest solutions... There are misunderstandings, of course, I had already noticed this problem in mailing-lists before, where the \"remote\" contact and the only use of written words let us sometimes misunderstand the meanings, but all in all it is easy to \"communicate\" (as to linguistics), because we all share the same interest, language and communication.



Thank you all,



Giuliana
[addsig]


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Telesforo Fernandez
Local time: 17:19
English to Spanish
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
You have hit the nail on the head.... Oct 20, 2001

You are absolutely right, ours is a lonely profession and perhaps this native tag may alienate us more in this lonely profession. Henry and others have helped to cement the ties between translators who are natives , aboriginals and the not so natives also. What ticks a site is the manner in which translators come to help each other.I have sometimes seen 8 to 10 translators answering the question( there was no need, in fact), until his colleague is satisfied and among them there were natives helping the not so natives and sometimes a non - native helping a certified native. It is the spirit of cooperation that makes a site move and sustain.

The job market is very tight - even if you are accredited by reputed bodies, or for that matter as a native speaker - getting jobs is a different kind of a ball game.

We sometimes tend to chase tags in the hope of getting jobs - but several factors come into play.



Very recently I saw a job posting - the poster clearly wrote this warning \" inutile de telephoner\" . I felt some creeping uneasiness.

Sometimes we want to get as many accreditations or certifications in that sheer illusion of bagging the jobs posted. I think we are chasing a mirage. At times this mad rush may lead to mud slinging also. We have seen some fireworks on this, just yesterday on this forum page.Let us not chase mirages.


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CLS Lexi-tech
Local time: 07:49
Member (2004)
English to Italian
+ ...
Any ideas on how to keep this cooperative growing stronger and viable? Oct 20, 2001

I noticed that the people participating in the discussion are for the most part Platinum members, i.e. people who believe that putting money in Proz.com is a sound investment for many tangible (job offers, profile on the web, glossaries, kudoz) and intangible (sense of community, exchange, input and friendships) benefits.

How can we strengthen Proz.com as a workplace, to allow it to do the things it already does for us better and on a larger scale?

This was one of the question raised during the first convention in Italy a few weeks ago. And a question that belongs to this Forum on Proz.com as a cooperative.

Obviously, we have all invested in the site with our Platinum membership and therefore we are talking to the converted.

How can we make it more attractive to oursourcers and to translators alike? Should we invest more of our dollars as translators in marketing our skills through Proz.com, in approaching agencies as Proz.com? What should we do to keep this cooperative growing stronger, on a viable financial basis?

These are some of the questions we should ask ourselves as active and caring members of Proz.com.



Paola L M


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Gilda Manara  Identity Verified
Italy
Local time: 13:49
German to Italian
+ ...
What could be done for contributing financially Oct 20, 2001

could there be some way of applying a small fee - proportional to the amount of the job - to translators who get a job from bids posted in ProZ? they are going anyway to earn something, and they are also improving their profile, adding a reference to it, so they could be more willing to pay it.

I mean of course the translators who have actually got the job!

[ This Message was edited by: on 2001-10-20 23:50 ]


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Telesforo Fernandez
Local time: 17:19
English to Spanish
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
Yes. Proz.com should charge a small fee for the translation Oct 20, 2001

Yes, you are right. Proz.com should charge a small fee to the translator for sustaining the site and improving it from time to time. I had suggested this to Henry last year. Along with this Proz.com should indicate to the bidders the name of the Proz member who bagged the job. This is for transparency purpose. Proz.com seems to come up with all types of innovations but seldom indicates which member bagged the job. I think we need to know who bagged the job. We get certified by you as native speakers, but let us also know which of our native speakers bagged the job.



Quote:


On 2001-10-20 22:32, reymarktco wrote:

could there be some way of applying a small fee - proportional to the amount of the job - to translators who get a job from bids posted in ProZ? they are going anyway to earn something, and they are also improving their profile, adding a reference to it, so they could be more willing to pay it.



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CLS Lexi-tech
Local time: 07:49
Member (2004)
English to Italian
+ ...
Bid winner, reasons for declining bids and fee on jobs Oct 21, 2001

Only recently I have been receiving replies from the outsources on my bids (my two bids were declined and I don\'t know why).

It would be useful to us as translators to be told why our bid was declined (not enough qualifications, or experience, rate too high etc.) so as to guide us in our next replies to bids. This could be a service implemented with the payment of a fee per bid, as proposed by Henry. The quality of the bids would go up and we would get useful feedback from the outsourcers. This would not be feasible if the number of bids were too high. I also agree on the need for transparency (and this is why I think that when bids are declined we should be informed about the reasons) but perhaps there are also privacy considerations to be taken into account as to divulging the name of the bid winner.

I still think that the outsourcer too should pay a fee to the site for accessing its database of translators.

I also agree on the fee on jobs, proportional to the rate charged by the translator. After all when we work for an agency, we know how much more the agency charges the end client.



paola l m



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Gilda Manara  Identity Verified
Italy
Local time: 13:49
German to Italian
+ ...
Privacy Oct 21, 2001

Quote:


perhaps there are also privacy considerations to be taken into account as to divulging the name of the bid winner.





Of course, you are perfectly right - I didn\'t mean that ProZ must divulge the name of the winner, I meant that in our Profiles there is a box where one can show \"completed jobs\" and so it would be from there, that the profile comes better into evidence. Maybe it might be possible to link that box with the commission to be paid to ProZ.

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Telesforo Fernandez
Local time: 17:19
English to Spanish
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
But who bags the jobs? Oct 21, 2001

There should be a transparency at all stages and a fee charged for the services rendered.We are a true cooperative of translators. Look what we do :

- we post anybody\'s jobs with all sorts of conditionalities.

- we even allow blank profiles to be posted

- we gladly answer anybody\'s term questions

- we even allow simple term questions to be posted repeatedly.

- we do sample translations for job posters free of cost( we know them for Adam\'s- but the site gives them this licence)

- we prompt the job posters to dictate the country in which a translator should live.

-we allow them to set a deadline for submitting translations.

- we allow them to write demeaning messages like \'inutile de telephoner\'

- we allow job posters to freely access our database.

- we are told how many bids were received( the more , the merrier)

BUT FINALLY WHO GETS THE JOB IS A BIG MYSTERY



Quote:


On 2001-10-21 04:45, reymarktco wrote:

Quote:


perhaps there are also privacy considerations to be taken into account for not divulging the name of the bid winner.





Of course, you are perfectly right - I didn\'t mean that ProZ must divulge the name of the winner, I meant that in our Profiles there is a box where one can show \"completed jobs\" and so it would be from there, that the profile comes better into evidence. Maybe it might be possible to link that box with the commission to be paid to ProZ.



[ This Message was edited by: on 2001-10-30 09:41 ]

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Gilda Manara  Identity Verified
Italy
Local time: 13:49
German to Italian
+ ...
privacy Oct 21, 2001

well, there is the Income Tax to be considered...

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Giovanni Guarnieri MITI, MIL  Identity Verified
United Kingdom
Local time: 12:49
Member (2004)
English to Italian
charging a fee will kill the site Nov 5, 2001

Proz is great because it\'s free. Don\'t charge translators or agencies, the site will die. There is only one way... more ads. We will put up with them, if it means the survival of Proz. Not all ads are rubbish. They could be from providers directly involved with the translation community... publishers, agencies, software houses and so on.

My modest opinion.



Giovanni


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