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KudoZ proposal - bonus points for other good answers
Thread poster: Rowan Morrell
Rowan Morrell  Identity Verified
New Zealand
Local time: 18:52
Member (2003)
French to English
+ ...
Aug 8, 2002

We have all asked KudoZ questions where we have received more than one good answer, but have only been able to award points to one answerer, while others equally deserving miss out.



I have thought of a possible way to resolve this, and it would like to propose it here. My idea is this: that in addition to the KudoZ points, a secondary, \"bonus\" point system should be introduced, which in the ProZ tradition could be called BonuZ points.



It would work as follows: you would still only be able to award KudoZ points to one answerer, giving 1-4 points as before. But in addition, if you felt that other answers had merit, you could award those people a BonuZ point each. In order not to detract too much from KudoZ, it should only be possible to earn one BonuZ point at a time.



BonuZ points could go on people\'s profiles under their KudoZ record. They could be classified in much the same way as KudoZ points. Like KudoZ points, they would be an indicator of expertise. Hopefully, they would improve the accuracy of demonstrating people\'s expertise. There are many times when people miss out on KudoZ points even though they give the right answer. But if they at least get a BonuZ point in these cases, some justice would be done.



Here are a couple of examples of the possible BonuZ points sytem in action. Let\'s say someone posts a question that has a fairly clearcut and straightforward answer. Three people get in with the same answer. The fastest one gets the KudoZ points (well, that\'s how it usually works). The other two, who would have previously got nothing, have the consolation of a BonuZ point, which goes on their record. Or let\'s say a more complicated question is posted, and five people answer it. The asker really likes three answers and doesn\'t think much of the other two. Eventually, the asker has to give one person KudoZ points, but can award the other good answers with a BonuZ point each.



Now admittedly, there would probably be times when people who deserved BonuZ points didn\'t get them, just as people who deserve KudoZ points don\'t get them now. But I do think that a BonuZ points system to complement the existing KudoZ one would improve on the existing situation and ensure a higher number of deserving people got their just reward. Also, a few changes might have to be made to accommodate the new system, but I don\'t think any radical overhaul would be needed.



So, that\'s my proposal. What do the rest of you opine?



Best Regards



ROWAN MORRELL

(WriteWord Translations)


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AAAmedical  Identity Verified
Belgium
Local time: 06:52
English to Dutch
+ ...
Why??? Aug 8, 2002

KudoZ is there to help other colleagues or people. It is not about gaining as much points as you can.



Sure KudoZ points show a certain expertise in a field but the system is more created (I feel) to help EACHOTHER out when having troubles with certain words or sentences.


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Antonella Andreella  Identity Verified
Italy
Local time: 06:52
German to Italian
+ ...
I agree with you Aug 8, 2002

I find that your proposals are realistic and sound good.



Bye



))


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Jacek Krankowski  Identity Verified
English to Polish
+ ...
Agree Aug 8, 2002

I have always been an advocate of what was previously discussed as \"splitting points\" so I also support your new version of this.

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Rowan Morrell  Identity Verified
New Zealand
Local time: 18:52
Member (2003)
French to English
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
More To KudoZ Than Helping Aug 8, 2002

Quote:


On 2002-08-08 11:21, AAAmedical wrote:

KudoZ is there to help other colleagues or people. It is not about gaining as much points as you can.



Sure KudoZ points show a certain expertise in a field but the system is more created (I feel) to help EACHOTHER out when having troubles with certain words or sentences.





I don\'t buy into the argument that KudoZ is solely about helping people. Perhaps I\'m not very politically correct (in fact, I rather hope I\'m not), but I believe there is more to KudoZ than just helping someone else in need, though this is certainly a very important facet of it.



The other side to KudoZ, which you have already acknowledged, is that of demonstrating expertise. As I understand it, it was with this goal in mind that KudoZ points were created in the first place. However, the way the system is set up at the moment, they do not always show expertise very accurately. That is why I have made the suggestion of a BonuZ points system, as well as reorganising people\'s KudoZ records to show how many points they\'ve gained in Easy or Pro questions. I believe these suggestions would improve the accuracy with which KudoZ points demonstrate expertise. They would not perfect it, but I think they would improve on what we have now.



The other thing about showing people\'s Easy and Pro points, which I discussed in another post, is that it would discourage those who answer solely for points. Lots of points for Easy questions would carry less weight than lots of points for Pro ones.



But back to the current thread. My post is mainly from the point of view of askers who would like to award points to more than one person but cannot currently do so. A BonuZ points system would change that, plus it would lessen the number of times people went unrewarded for a right answer.



I\'m going to close with a politically incorrect admission: I like getting KudoZ points. Getting that \"Congratulations!\" message is a buzz. However, I do not answer questions merely to get points. Indeed, if someone proposes an answer that I am convinced is better than mine, I\'m more than happy to agree with it. The most important thing is for the asker to get the best answer possible. At the end of the day, it\'s not a competition, but nonetheless, there is more to KudoZ than merely being nice to our fellow-translators. Let\'s face it: we\'re marketing ourselves as well. And I think that when we are giving of our time and effort to help someone, we SHOULD get some recompense for it.



But I also like giving KudoZ points and, like many others, have wanted to share them out on more than one occasion. With a BonuZ points system, I could give those people who give good and helpful answers some just reward. And it does appear that my proposal has some support, so we\'ll see what happens with it.

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Giovanni Guarnieri MITI, MIL  Identity Verified
United Kingdom
Local time: 05:52
Member (2004)
English to Italian
I'm with you... Aug 8, 2002

good idea. The KudoZ system, as it is now, is quite unfair. Your suggestion would readdress the balance somewhat.



Regards



Giovanni


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Silvina Beatriz Codina  Identity Verified
Argentina
Local time: 02:52
Member (2002)
English to Spanish
+ ...
That would help both askers and answerers Aug 8, 2002

It is true that the ultimate purpose of KudoZ is to help the colleagues, but I think Rowan\'s proposal would help not only the answerers (by granting points in a fairer manner) but also the asker. How? I think that if multiple answers can be chosen, this will encourage people to participate more, give more elaborate answers with more explanations and references. Sometimes you can add something interesting to an answer someone else has given. Right now you have no encouragement to do so, other than helping someone selflessly, because you will not receive points for that. And of course, you feel great when you help someone, but let\'s not be mistaken. Points are important. Your position in the list of pros depends on how many points you\'ve got, and they are a way to showcase your knowledge. People will be more interested if they know that even if they are not the fastest gun in the West, they can still get some reward.

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Roberta Anderson  Identity Verified
Italy
Local time: 06:52
Member (2001)
English to Italian
+ ...
I think it's a good idea too Aug 8, 2002

and in fact it\'s along the lines of the star or thank you or smiley reward I mentioned in the (Suggestion: 24 hours to elapse prior to awarding) thread.

If we answering questions from a purely altruistic point of view, it\'s nice to be thanked anyway.

And if we use Kudoz as a means to prove one\'s competence, it\'s a useful unit of measure to put alongside Kudoz points.

Roberta


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xxxTanuki
Japanese to Italian
+ ...
A very interesting idea - worth a try, definitely. Aug 8, 2002

IMHO it would not hurt, to say the least, and it might help improve the overall quality of the answers. As a matter of fact, even translators not interested in Kudoz per se might might be willing to try get some Bonuz.

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Ralf Lemster  Identity Verified
Germany
Local time: 06:52
English to German
+ ...
See the parallel thread Aug 8, 2002

For some reason, Rowan decided to post two threads which are very closely related. See Henry\'s comment in there:



www.proz.com/?sp=bb/viewtopic&eid_c=20821&topic=4409&forum=23&7


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sudeshna mukharji
India
Local time: 11:22
English to Bengali
+ ...
I Agree to the proposal of consolation Kudoz Aug 8, 2002

Many a time one might give a better answer but by sheer dint of being faster than the previous one ,the earlier one gets the KUdoz points ,so I think the proposal is surely a very good one,and would surelyimprove the quality of the work concerned.

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Hans-Henning Judek  Identity Verified
Local time: 14:52
German to English
+ ...
KUDOZ split might be a good idea and easier to implement Aug 9, 2002

I am both, frequent asker and answer provider, if my work load allows it, and the \"One-shot\" KUDOZ rule was sometimes anyoing.



When asking, I had frequently the situation that I would have liked to give two or more answerers the KUDOZ, but also when answering myself, I had frequently disappointing experiences. For example, the asker gave a term and then added the context in a sentence in the body text.



After 20 minutes difficult research on the net I answered with the equivalent term in the target language. 5 minutes later another answerer took my answer and translated the sentence as well, which was now, where the crucial term was on the table, a piece of cake. He/she got the KUDOZ and I was frustrated.



KUDOZ split would give anybody the chance to get a share of the pie and is most probably the easiest method to implement at the moment without creating another category of points. Henry, think about it

[ This Message was edited by: on 2002-08-09 02:51 ]


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Hinara  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 21:52
Member (2011)
Spanish to English
+ ...
I agree Aug 9, 2002

Your proposal deserves serious consideration. Often times I have been torn between two answerers because both have equally good responses. I usually end up giving the points to who answered first, or to the one whose answer I use. Other times I use 2-3 responses/explanations to formulate my \"term\" and yet, I\'m limited to awarding points to only one expert.



I too believe that the Kudoz points go beyonf demonstrating solidarity or generosity. The points are one way of demonstrating expertise.



I urge Proz to look into your suggestion.


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