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I consider Platinum membership a waste of time and money
Thread poster: xxxArtebuz
xxxArtebuz
Local time: 23:22
English to Spanish
+ ...
Feb 26, 2003

I have had more luck researching agencies, and approaching those that do the kind of work I can and want to do, than bidding on ProZ. From the ridiculous to the raunchy is how I see the bidding system. Someone puts up a 3000 word document at 2 cents a word and people still BID??? What do you bid? Do you offer to PAY for doing the work? Perhaps you folks need to waste your time gabbing about how great this site is, and how puppy warm you feel about your community, but I work for a living. And two cents a word and the one cent a word \"offerings\" ain\'t going to pay for no fridge or the milk in it. I wish I would have used my $100 bucks on something more usefull, like boooozzz!



Artebuz


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Monika Coulson  Identity Verified
Local time: 22:22
Member (2001)
English to Albanian
+ ...
Platinum membership does not automatically give you jobs Feb 26, 2003

Hello Artebuz,

I am sorry that you feel this way. I am writing my 2 cents here quickly, since I have a huge load of translation to finish...

What I want to say is that Platinum membership does not automatically give you jobs in this site. There are lots of other factors that will lead a professional to jobs.

2. It is true that there are some low-pricing jobs here at ProZ.com, but they are everywhere, look at some other Translators\' sites and tell me if I am wrong.

3. I am a Platinum member because I like to support this site that gives me back so much. Of course, I do not get all the jobs that are posted here (because there are lots of other qualified translators, I am not the only one, but I have \"won\" enough bids to pay off my membership dues. IMHO, it was not my Platinum membership that helped me win those bids (this definitely helped some); it was due to my own qualifications for the respective jobs. In my sub-community there are lots of non-platinum members whom I know who have won some of the bids. What I want to emphasize is that my membership won\'t give me jobs automatically; there are lots of factors combined together for this to happen.





Sincerely,

Monika

[ This Message was edited by:on2003-02-28 01:54]


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two2tango  Identity Verified
Argentina
Local time: 01:22
Member
English to Spanish
+ ...
Don´t blame the site Feb 26, 2003

Quote:


On 2003-02-26 20:40, Artebuz wrote:

Perhaps you folks need to waste your time gabbing about how great this site is, and how puppy warm you feel about your community, but I work for a living.







Artebuz,



The fact that you didn´t find the way to get jobs through ProZ is not the site\'s fault. We do work for a living, and got many good jobs through ProZ. We were happy to renew our Platinum membership.



Enrique

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Ralf Lemster  Identity Verified
Germany
Local time: 06:22
English to German
+ ...
Just pointing the finger won't do... Feb 26, 2003

Artebuz,

I can understand your frustration, but I would strongly recommend looking at why you may not have been successful in attracting work through ProZ.com - leaving aside the issue of how professional the language used in your post gets across to potential outsourcers.



I had a look at your profile - there\'s some information, but there\'s nothing, really, that would set you apart from competitors. I also downloaded your CV - TBH I would not consider an application if you sent me one like this: being \"very computer literate\", I would have expected you at least to spend a few minutes to make it look appealing.



Shouting abuse at others is one thing - being successful in business is quite another.



Best of luck, Ralf


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Dyran Altenburg  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 00:22
English to Spanish
+ ...
To bid or not to bid Feb 26, 2003

Quote:


On 2003-02-26 20:40, Artebuz wrote:

I have had more luck researching agencies, and approaching those that do the kind of work I can and want to do, than bidding on ProZ.





I totally agree with you.



Still, places like ProZ help serious agencies/clients separate the wheat from the chaff, if you get my drift.



FWIW, I get the best results (i.e. very well-paid jobs) by being a member of the ATA and having my profile on their website.



Also, although it\'s obvious it works for some (many?), I consider the fuzzy-feeling environment to be rather unprofessional. So do the clients I work for, BTW.



PS: Good to see Mexican colleagues participating. A welcome change.

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Henry Dotterer
Local time: 00:22
SITE FOUNDER
You have been a platinum member for one month... Feb 26, 2003

... what exactly did you expect?



Sorry if you assumed $100 would buy you full time work from day one. As I tell people, ProZ.com needs to be just one more tool in your belt. Contacting agencies is good, so is joining organizations like the ATA.



In the meantime, no one is asking you to praise the site or be warm and fuzzy. But mutual respect for colleagues is expected.


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xxxArtebuz
Local time: 23:22
English to Spanish
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
Automatically no jobs, that I believe... Feb 26, 2003

Quote:


On 2003-02-26 20:56, monika wrote:

Hello Artebuz,

There are lots of other factors that will lead a professional to jobs.



I agree, but this site is not one of them.





2. It is true that there are some low-pricing jobs here at ProZ.com, but they are everywhere, look at some other Translators\' sites and tell me if I am wrong.



You are. I have not seen or been offered one cent a word jobs on any other site I visit.



3. I am a Platinum member because I like to support this site that gives me back so much.

Perhaps, but it does not give me back the things I am interested in, such as a response to my bids. Why can\'t we ever find out WHY we didn\'t get a job. Am I bidding against a trojan horse? That is, how do I know that the bidding system is not being used by agencies or individuals with false postings that are only ment to drive prices down? Who guarantees that these so-called job offers are not just a way for agencies or individuals to prepare quotes for their prospective clients?



What I see in this system is a total disregard for quality and professionalism. These last four weeks alone I got $3000 USD of work. Not one cent came through bidding systems and it certainly wasn\'t work that was done in the 2-3 cent range. There are others out there paying fair prices for our work--why don´t they show up here?



Artebus



[ This Message was edited byn2003-02-26 21:05]



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Amy Williams  Identity Verified
United Kingdom
Local time: 05:22
Italian to English
+ ...
Each to their own.. Feb 26, 2003

Hello.

Just a few words:



Don\'t think that just because there are bids on a job there are professionals interested - I think more often than not there are a wealth of \"bids\" complaining about the poor rate. So take heart : if the rate is that low and the details seem to spell trouble, it\'s probably not worth doing in the first place.



Bear in mind that you\'re working in one of the most common language pairs and that on Proz the competition is always fierce for SpanishEnglish.



Stick a picture in your profile. Start a glossary. Write a good profile and ask someone to proofread it through.



Best of luck with it all.



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xxxArtebuz
Local time: 23:22
English to Spanish
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
Who is shouting? Feb 26, 2003

Quote:


On 2003-02-26 21:13, Lemster wrote:

Artebuz,

I can understand your frustration,



There is no frustration, just what I think.



I had a look at your profile -



Hmm, it seems that a little dissent merits a lot of attention.



I also downloaded your CV -



Should I also send you my personal files to peruse?



Shouting abuse



Why is honest disagreement considered abuse? Are all to just post flowery comments and thus avoid having our peers look through our CV to see just how \"unprofesional\" we are?



It seems to me that this is not a forum. It seems more like a mutual-pat-on-the-back club.



Best of luck, Ralf



Thanks, Ralf, it seems I will need it.







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xxxArtebuz
Local time: 23:22
English to Spanish
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
What's next, Hank? Drummed out of the corps? Feb 26, 2003

Quote:


On 2003-02-26 21:15, Henry wrote:

... what exactly did you expect?



Sorry if you assumed $100 would buy you full time work from day one.



Uh, Hank, this is not day one, and, uh, Hank, its two cents a word, so I can at least write 50 words.



In the meantime, no one is asking you to praise the site or be warm and fuzzy. But mutual respect for colleagues is expected.



If indeed mutual respect is expected, why is so much anger being expressed by so many just because I dissent?



What\'s next? Drummed out of the corps?







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xxxArtebuz
Local time: 23:22
English to Spanish
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
Thanks. One voice of kindness among many angry shouts. Feb 26, 2003

Quote:


On 2003-02-26 21:14, Dyran wrote:

Quote:


On 2003-02-26 20:40, Artebuz wrote:

I have had more luck researching agencies, and approaching those that do the kind of work I can and want to do, than bidding on ProZ.





I totally agree with you.





It seems that everyone is intent in pointing out my faults and no one answering my questions.



Why no feed back from posters? Why is that not considered unprofessional. Just as Ralf said about my CV, wouldn´t it be \"nice\" if the posters were obligated to be more \"professional\" and post the winning bid?



Who guarantees that the postings are true jobs?



Why do a lot of the posters have e-mail addresses in Yahoo, and hotmail and other public sites? Can\'t they afford a site of their own? Who are these people?



These are honest questions that should be answered by the people responsible for this site. I guess it\'s that Hank guy. But, he seems more intent on telling me that my \"platinum\" memebership guarantees nothing.



Saludos, compadres.

Artebuz

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Henry Dotterer
Local time: 00:22
SITE FOUNDER
Check yourself Feb 26, 2003

Why no feed back from posters? Why is that not considered unprofessional.



It is unprofessional. It is discouraged.



Just as Ralf said about my CV, wouldn´t it be \"nice\" if the posters were obligated to be more \"professional\" and post the winning bid?



Yes. This is a problem. We are preparing functionality to prompt outsourcers to follow through better with those who submit offers.



Who guarantees that the postings are true jobs?



No one. We do not have the wherewithal to guarantee the reliability of job posters, or of you. Sorry.



Why do a lot of the posters have e-mail addresses in Yahoo, and hotmail and other public sites? Can\'t they afford a site of their own? Who are these people?



Ask them. They might ask you the same.



These are honest questions that should be answered by the people responsible for this site. I guess it\'s that Hank guy. But, he seems more intent on telling me that my \"platinum\" memebership guarantees nothing.



You did not ask any questions until now. All you did is belittle your colleagues. You complain about inconsiderate outsourcers, and I agree. But I advise you check yourself--I find you no more considerate.



Platinum membership is refundable on a prorated basis. Just say the word, 92% of your membership period ($89 after credit card fees) remains.


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Dyran Altenburg  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 00:22
English to Spanish
+ ...
More on bidding Feb 26, 2003

Quote:


On 2003-02-26 21:13, Lemster wrote:

I can understand your frustration, but I would strongly recommend looking at why you may not have been successful in attracting work through ProZ.com...





I don\'t know about others, but in my case it\'s price, plain and simple. I know, because several prospective clients who have contacted me through ProZ have told me so.



Let\'s face it. ProZ has a reputation of being the premiere site to find translators who will work for the lowest rates (particularly in the EnglishSpanish pairs). Naturally, job offers reflect this expectation.



What I have come to realize is that the clients I like to work with don\'t come looking for translators here. So, naturally I contact them (and they contact me) through other venues.



Now, don\'t get me wrong. ProZ fills a niche and is very successfull in it\'s own way. Plus, a good number of translators are perfectly happy with how things are. Good for them. But it\'s evidently not for everyone.



On a related note, I\'m pretty sure ad hominem attacks are a big no-no here. Has that changed recently?

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Steffen Pollex  Identity Verified
Local time: 06:22
English to German
+ ...
Your whole posting sounds absolutely pointless to me Feb 26, 2003

First, you complain yiu get no jobs through Proz. Let me tell you It took me some two years to attract a few jobs this way. And, I cannot but agree with Ralf here, your profikle doesn\'t tell anything to distinguish you among the others plus your language combination is probably quite seldom.



Second, you shout at us that we should not bid and that there are no decently-paid jobs on proz. I repeat, when reading your stuff one immediately gets the impression that if you were standing in front of me you would shout and cry out your frustration.



This is not our fault, neither is it your business to tell us to bid or not. If you are that successfull in working through other channels whhy the heck did you come here?!



Third, you complain on having spent 100 Dollars for nothing?. Would it be our fault? Are we the one who forced you to do so? Couldn\'t you have considered this earlier?



SUMMARY: What is your point?!!


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xxxArtebuz
Local time: 23:22
English to Spanish
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
You can keep the money, Hank. Feb 26, 2003

Quote:


On 2003-02-26 22:38, Henry wrote:

Platinum membership is refundable on a prorated basis. Just say the word, 92% of your membership period ($89 after credit card fees) remains.





You can keep it, Hank. Bye, I am out of here. This is no place for grownups.

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