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Payment through ProZ.com ? (Staff: 'Not for now')
Thread poster: xxxchance
xxxchance
French to Chinese
+ ...
Feb 8, 2004

Dear Henry and All,

Is it possible to add an option : being able to be paid through Proz.com in order to prevent nonpayment ?

AFAIK, a kind of site who provides the service for the exchanges between private buyers and sellers such as some second-hand sell. A buyer can ask information about an article and a seller can reply the questions through the site. When a buyer decides to buy, he pays to the site and the site keeps the sum until the buyer receives the article in the prefixed condition. If there is no protest against the seller about the received article, the site will transfer the sum to the seller, except X% for the site. At the end, everybody is happy and the site wins good reputation.

I know it is easy to say, but hard to practice. However, if it comes true, most professionals including translators, agencies and direct clients could profit from this system.

Moreover, our respectable moderators deserve some rewards too.

This is only an idea. Hope to hear from others.

[Edited at 2004-02-08 05:20]


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Lucinda  Identity Verified
Local time: 01:12
Member (2002)
Dutch to English
+ ...
If it is workable, it would be great. Feb 8, 2004

I think that it is a good idea, but in practice I don't know if it would be feasible.

Maybe Henry and the tech. and especially LEGAL people can bow their heads over this one.

I envision that a translator would charge a bit more to cover the fee to the site - so that might not sit well with the client. Some clients might be offended.

Does this system create a lot of extra work for the folks who run the site?

How do you get your money? Does the site deposit it in your bank account or send you a check, like PayPal.

How do folks in countries with a less than perfect banking system get their money? If they have to pay so many banking fees, nothing is left over from the earned money.

This system would IMHO violate a bit the confidentiality between client and translator. I am not sure, just a thought.

Etc, Etc.
A lot to consider.

Chao,
Lucinda


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Evert DELOOF-SYS  Identity Verified
Belgium
Local time: 05:12
Member
English to Dutch
+ ...
Such system has been in place for quite a while Feb 8, 2004

and we used to be able to pay other members thru our ProZ.com wallet.
Unfortunately this payment method has now been abandoned.

[Edited at 2004-02-08 12:17]


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Ralf Lemster  Identity Verified
Germany
Local time: 05:12
English to German
+ ...
Exposure to legal and commercial risks Feb 8, 2004

Hi Evert,
Unfortunately this payment method has now been abandoned. Too much work ?

Don't think so - in fact, Lucinda's reference to legal issues is spot on.

Henry explained the reasons for withdrawing the service in this thread, about a year ago.

If ProZ.com were to offer a service as suggested, it would be exposed to legal risks (getting involved in disputes between outsourcer and provider - who is to make the decision as to whether the money should be released?), as well as to commercial risks (what happens if the outsourcer decides not to accept delivery - will the translator take action against ProZ.com?).

I don't think this is a major technical issue (as you correctly pointed out, the system - albeit in a very simplified manner - is already in place), but it involves a number of crucial legal and business issues.

Best regards, Ralf


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xxxchance
French to Chinese
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
I wonder whether we, the elder, could also try sth intelligent as our younger are doing. ;) Feb 8, 2004

The site I am talking about is in French.
It is a well-known site among younger. My daughter of 13 years has sold several articles without any problem and she cares a lot about the notes that her buyers gave. She said it is her credit and very important if one day she wants to sell sth. else. It functions well, so I am not sure it is “illegal”.

The conditions are strict and functional so that only serious people appreciate this service, where you cannot cheat easily.

Different payment practices could be taken into consideration: wallet, transfer, check...

What I suggest is only an option, you can choose it or not. It depends on your judgment. A translator who knows well his client or a client who knows his translator will probably not need this service.

[Edited at 2004-02-08 18:08]


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Ralf Lemster  Identity Verified
Germany
Local time: 05:12
English to German
+ ...
Perfectly legal - but there are still legal risks Feb 8, 2004

Hi again,
chance wrote:

The site I am talking about is in French.
It is a well-known site among younger. My daughter of 13 years has sold several articles without any problem and she cares a lot about the notes that her buyers gave. She said it is her credit and very important if one day she wants to sell sth. else.

I suppose you're referring to Ebay and its subsidiary, Paypal?

It functions well, so I am not sure it is “illegal”.

Of course not - the issue for ProZ.com is not necessarily whether running a payments facility is legal (although in some countries - including Germany - you could argue that it constitutes banking services and would therefore require a bank license). But even so, the fundamental difference would be in the legal status of ProZ.com: today, ProZ.com is only a venue where buyers and sellers of a service can establish contact; ProZ.com is not a party to their bilateral agreement. Were ProZ.com to get involved in the fulfilment of the contract (payment against delivery of the work), it would necessarily have to become a party.

The major problem I see with this is deciding whether or not the contractually agreed service has been provided. That's simple if you buy something on Ebay - all you need to check if the defined article was delivered. But who is going to check if the translation is ok?

The attraction of such a service to both translators and outsourcers is obvious - but Henry would need to make a fundamental decision as to whether ProZ.com should really get involved.

Best regards, Ralf


[Edited at 2004-02-08 18:18]


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xxxchance
French to Chinese
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
Thank you very much Ralf for your close attention and detailed explication :) Feb 8, 2004

Yes, it is a site like Ebay for second-hand articles. As you know, it is rather difficult to find the just definition for a second-hand article, but they got it and they are going on !

I copy the link here, but it is not for the advertising : http://www.priceminister.com/

For the time being, their buyers or sellers are limited for the residents from 20 countries of Europe. I just learnt it from their site.


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Henry Dotterer
Local time: 00:12
SITE FOUNDER
Thanks for the suggestion, chance - maybe one for the future Feb 9, 2004

Hi Chance.

Being a payment intermediary is something we once did, and something we would consider in the future. At the moment we don't have the wherewithal to do it well and to be prepared to handle the risks.

Thanks for the suggestion!


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xxxchance
French to Chinese
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
Thank you Henry :) Feb 9, 2004

Let us hope

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