Turnkey translation system and 'abuse' by translators
Nicole Y. Adams, M.A. Australia Local time: 14:17 Member (2006) German to English + ...
Jun 24, 2011
Good morning,
I posted a very small text yesterday to test the turnkey translation system from a client's point of view. From what I understand, Proz.com has set a fixed rate of $0.10/word for translators willing to take on turnkey translations. I was also under the impression that all translators who are site members can choose whether or not they wish to receive turnkey translation notifications, knowing the fixed rate is $0.10.
So I posted a few words yesterday as a client and I was told by the system how much Proz.com will charge me for it. I was not given the option to enter a rate I'd be willing to pay, but Proz.com set the price.
Shortly afterwards, I found an abusive message in my inbox sent to me by a Proz.com member educating me about how no serious person would work for $0.10 and enquiring how dare I propose such a low rate!
Now let's assume I was a 'real' client posting a job through this system, would I really want to receive a message like that just for making legitimate use of a feature this site offers me??
Secondly, this colleague clearly isn't familiar with the turnkey translation system or they'd know that this rate is set by Proz.com, not by the client posting the job. And they don't seem to be aware that they can opt out of receiving these notifications if they don't agree with the turnkey system or its rates. Perhaps Proz.com could do a bit more work to educate members about this particular site feature?
Having said all that, I do agree that the set rate for turnkey translations is way too low and should be at least 50% if not 100% higher than the current rate set by Proz.com. Perhaps this will change once the system leaves the beta phase?
But an abusive message (at least that's how I perceived it) to a potential client and paying site user by an uneducated colleague is really the last thing I want to see as a paying site member myself.
If I have misunderstood any aspect of the turnkey system, please do let me know.
Any thoughts?
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writeaway Local time: 06:47 Partial member Dutch to English + ...
Is it still only for P badge people?
Jun 24, 2011
How was it determined who the job offer was sent out to? Did the site make the selection for you and was the job offered to anyone who didn't have a P.
A colleague of mine posted two turnkey jobs when it first started up. She only got P people. One was apparently OK and the other was a disaster. But the rate was 10 cents.
I have never seen any option to indicate my willingness to take on turnkey jobs. So I assume it's for a select group. Hopefully someone from the site staff will post here and explain the policy used for selection and also explain why the rates are so very low.
Perhaps they could state in the mail sent out that Proz sets the rates, not the person offering the job?
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Ambrose Li Canada Local time: 00:47 Member (2011) Chinese to English + ...
settings
Jun 24, 2011
writeaway wrote:
I have never seen any option to indicate my willingness to take on turnkey jobs. So I assume it's for a select group.
If willingness to take on turnkey jobs is the same thing as getting notifications for them, then I think the setting is under Jobs & directories | Settings, in the “"Classic" job notification preferences” section.
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Ildiko Santana United States Local time: 21:47 Member (2002) English to Hungarian + ...
below the minimums
Jun 24, 2011
Ambrose Li wrote:
writeaway wrote:
I have never seen any option to indicate my willingness to take on turnkey jobs. So I assume it's for a select group.
If willingness to take on turnkey jobs is the same thing as getting notifications for them, then I think the setting is under Jobs & directories | Settings, in the “"Classic" job notification preferences” section.
This thread made me curious because I have not received a single turnkey job notification before. I followed Ambrose Li's suggestion and found that my turnkey tr. notification is already set to ON. The reason I never get them is explained under the settings:
Turnkey translation notifications
Regardless of this setting, you will not be notified of turnkey jobs where the offered rate is below the minimums you specify for each language pair below. If needed, you can set minimum rates for all language pairs at once.
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writeaway Local time: 06:47 Partial member Dutch to English + ...
Yes, thank you. The option is there
Jun 24, 2011
Ambrose Li wrote:
writeaway wrote:
I have never seen any option to indicate my willingness to take on turnkey jobs. So I assume it's for a select group.
If willingness to take on turnkey jobs is the same thing as getting notifications for them, then I think the setting is under Jobs & directories | Settings, in the “"Classic" job notification preferences” section.
I never check job settings but I just did because of Ambrose Li's helpful information.
But there is also the message Idiko mentions (Regardless of this setting, you will not be notified of turnkey jobs where the offered rate is below the minimums you specify for each language pair below.)
So, the person who complained to Nicole must have programmed their settings to accept jobs at $0.10 a word. Maybe Proz could make it €0.10 a word for Euro zone people, since the dollar rate means it drops to €0.069 a word.
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Nicole Schnell United States Local time: 21:47 Member English to German + ...
Cough, cough.
Jun 24, 2011
writeaway wrote:
must have programmed their settings to accept jobs at $0.10 a word. Maybe Proz could make it €0.10 a word for Euro zone people, since the dollar rate means it drops to €0.069 a word.
Honestly - what makes you think that any US-based translator in this language pair would get out of bed for this rate? Europeans should be paid in Euro, the same amount of cents in US $ is good enough for the Americans? Wow, writeaway. Really...
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writeaway Local time: 06:47 Partial member Dutch to English + ...
Reality check
Jun 24, 2011
Nicole Schnell wrote:
writeaway wrote:
must have programmed their settings to accept jobs at $0.10 a word. Maybe Proz could make it €0.10 a word for Euro zone people, since the dollar rate means it drops to €0.069 a word.
Honestly - what makes you think that any US-based translator in this language pair would get out of bed for this rate? Europeans should be paid in Euro, the same amount of cents in US $ is good enough for the Americans? Wow, writeaway. Really...
Well, look at the number of bids for jobs posted even below $0.10 a word. I know that the Belgians are having a field day sending jobs to the US and have been since the dollar fell. Taxes are lower, cost of living is lower so apparently people are willing to work at that rate (and/or less). I'm not, you're not but, but clearly (many) others are.
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Nicole Schnell United States Local time: 21:47 Member English to German + ...
In the US?? Where, in the desert?
Jun 24, 2011
writeaway wrote:
cost of living is lower
Well. I do live in the middle of one of the most expensive cities in the US, and I never noticed any difference in comparison to the large cities in Germany where I used to live before. On the other hand, I don't know any translators in North Dakota or the Nevada desert. I have no idea, where those fairy tales come from. And I thought, we Americans were pompous...
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Henry, the site founder, has previously stated on the turnkey system that:
This service is intended for very small jobs, for example the type of project for which it may not even be worth making a job posting over. Some people have described this type of job as a hassle for translation companies, and it would seem that there may be an opportunity to make a positive out of a negative by providing a tool that would be useful to translation outsourcers, and at the same time provide an opportunity for translators to make contact with new outsourcers.
It would be fair to assume that, as is the case with every other "matching system" at ProZ.com, what is being provided is a way for translation outsourcers and translators to meet. Outsourcer and translator would certainly have access to each other (unless either side opts out, I suppose) and, as usual, far from being prevented, working together directly in the future without going through ProZ.com would be encouraged.
I hope this helps clarify a bit.
Jared
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Samuel Murray Netherlands Local time: 06:47 Member (2006) English to Afrikaans + ...
Report the abuser
Jun 24, 2011
Nicole Y. Adams, M.A. wrote:
Shortly afterwards, I found an abusive message in my inbox sent to me by a Proz.com member educating me about how no serious person would work for $0.10 and enquiring how dare I propose such a low rate!
Report the abuser to ProZ.com staff, and hope they get banned from the site.
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Nicole Y. Adams, M.A. wrote:
Shortly afterwards, I found an abusive message in my inbox sent to me by a Proz.com member educating me about how no serious person would work for $0.10 and enquiring how dare I propose such a low rate!
Report the abuser to ProZ.com staff, and hope they get banned from the site.
Thanks Samuel! If you feel a site rule has been violated in the message you received, Nicole, by all means do report it to site staff (using the support system and providing the related details).
Jared
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Ildiko Santana United States Local time: 21:47 Member (2002) English to Hungarian + ...
numerous bids on low-rate jobs
Jun 24, 2011
writeaway wrote:
look at the number of bids for jobs posted even below $0.10 a word.
Bids are private, only their number is visible to the community. Perhaps all those "bids" are actually complaints from translators who would *not* consider such low rates... you never know.
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writeaway Local time: 06:47 Partial member Dutch to English + ...
No-it's impossible to make sweeping statements about anything
Jun 24, 2011
Ildiko Weinberger wrote:
writeaway wrote:
look at the number of bids for jobs posted even below $0.10 a word.
Bids are private, only their number is visible to the community. Perhaps all those "bids" are actually complaints from translators who would *not* consider such low rates... you never know.
I agree. I don't see how anyone can know for sure who will work for what rate, no matter what country they live in.
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