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Editing polls before posting
Thread poster: Nikki Graham

Nikki Graham  Identity Verified
United Kingdom
Local time: 20:08
Partial member (2003)
Spanish to English
Aug 26, 2005

Could polls please be checked carefully before they are posted so that we can avoid having glaring grammatical errors on the homepage of a professional translation website?

Thank you


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Marijke Singer  Identity Verified
United Kingdom
Local time: 20:08
Dutch to English
+ ...
Polls and their worth Aug 26, 2005

Is it just me, or are some of these polls misleading/rather pointless.

For example:
Has your eyesight been affected since you started your work as a translator?

Do they mean because of our work or in general. Most people's eyesight deteriorates over time. What is the point?

I could ask Has your sex life improved since you started translating? But what is the connection?

I'm sure nobody would reply to this. Or maybe they would?

I'm being devil's advocate here so I hope nobody will be offended.

Maybe more thought should also go into the actual issue being investigated as well as the grammar side.

I have 2 solutions for the grammar issue:
1.
Appoint a moderator (or two) just for this.
2.
ProZ could actually employ a person who would be in charge of checking most polls (and other text) before they are posted and charge (paying) members an extra fee (say 10%) to cover costs.


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Nikki Graham  Identity Verified
United Kingdom
Local time: 20:08
Partial member (2003)
Spanish to English
TOPIC STARTER
Thanks Marijke Aug 26, 2005

Thanks, first for the laugh...

and secondly, for the good suggestions. I think that appointing a moderator to check polls is a very good idea. I'm not sure who checks them/chooses them at the moment. And having somebody generally check the text of the site would be great too, although probably too expensive. And what about all the other languages the site is in? I often read complaints about the general standard.


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PAS  Identity Verified
Local time: 21:08
English to Polish
+ ...
Since we're on the subject... Aug 26, 2005

It's very difficult to set up a poll question correctly - regardless of its usefulness.
I hear this whenever I get suckered into answering telephone polls. Some questions are simply unanswerable.
I treat the ProZ polls as 10 seconds of entertainment between one page and the next, but I find I am unable to answer most of them because of the way the question is asked.

I think one of them was "Do you proofread your work on-screen or from printouts". My answer is either/neither/both. If at least the question was "Do you prefer to...."

I wouldn't worry too much about the weight of the questions, but you are right - they should be checked for grammar or spelling.

Cheers,
Pawel Skalinski


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Nikki Graham  Identity Verified
United Kingdom
Local time: 20:08
Partial member (2003)
Spanish to English
TOPIC STARTER
wording of polls Aug 26, 2005

PAS wrote:

I treat the ProZ polls as 10 seconds of entertainment between one page and the next, but I find I am unable to answer most of them because of the way the question is asked.

I think one of them was "Do you proofread your work on-screen or from printouts". My answer is either/neither/both. If at least the question was "Do you prefer to...."

Pawel Skalinski


Actually Pawel, that was one of my suggestions, and it was worded: Do you usually check your translations on screen or on paper?

The "usually" is not a million miles away from prefer, IMHO, but there you go. And no, it hadn't occurred to me to give the option neither. I wouldn't like to think that there are people out there who don't check their translations before sending them off on a regular basis.


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Sara Freitas
France
Local time: 21:08
French to English
Ditto for gloss posts Aug 26, 2005

Nikki Graham wrote:

Could polls please be checked carefully before they are posted so that we can avoid having glaring grammatical errors on the homepage of a professional translation website?

Thank you


I just noticed the "Racial slur database" at "ryan(at)fuck.org" showcased on the Proz homepage.

Not that this might not be an extremely useful resource for translators, but I personally don't like seeing it on the homepage. I guess it's the second part that has me stumped (the "fuck.org" part).

Maybe I'm way off base, but that's just my opinion.

Cheers,

Sara


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PAS  Identity Verified
Local time: 21:08
English to Polish
+ ...
Figure of speech Aug 26, 2005

Nikki Graham wrote:
I wouldn't like to think that there are people out there
quote]

Nikki, I simply wanted to point out that the wording of the original question is inaccurate.
Also, I am aware (even on this site, I believe) of two-person spouse/partner teams, of whom one does the translation and the other proofreads the text. So that's where the "neither" fits

P.A.S.


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sylvie malich
Germany
Local time: 21:08
German to English
Sara, I completely agree with you Aug 26, 2005

Sara Freitas-Maltaverne wrote:

I just noticed the "Racial slur database" at "ryan(at)fuck.org" showcased on the Proz homepage.

Not that this might not be an extremely useful resource for translators, but I personally don't like seeing it on the homepage. I guess it's the second part that has me stumped (the "fuck.org" part).

Maybe I'm way off base, but that's just my opinion.

Cheers,

Sara




For heaven's sake, we have to get rid of this immediately. How can a thing like this happen? And I don't see how this can be a useful resource for translators or anybody for that matter. This should not be taken lightly.

Quote from the "resource" page: The racial slur database. Helping to make the world a better place.
Please submit new slurs along with whom they represent and their reasons or origins, if you know them.
New or different (correct?) reasons or origins can be submitted here as well but please make sure to include the slur/represents combo.
Make sure that your submission is of racial or ethnic nature (homosexual is not a race).


I for one don't want garbage like this linked to this site.

sylvie

[Edited at 2005-08-26 17:28]


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Magda Dziadosz  Identity Verified
Poland
Local time: 21:08
Member (2004)
English to Polish
+ ...
Aren't they telling? :) Aug 26, 2005

Quick polls indeed reveal a lot about us - not only that translators make grammatical errors but also that:

most of us work without any marketing plan,
don't have a degree in translation,
own less then 20 dictionaries,
and haven't earned tested credentials,
yet
translation/interpreting is our main source of income,
we earn more then €15K annually,
our work is steady,
we work more then 12 hours a day,
we consider ourselves good or excellent translators
and

92% of us like proz.com polls!!

Chrres,
Magda


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Magda Dziadosz  Identity Verified
Poland
Local time: 21:08
Member (2004)
English to Polish
+ ...
From one of the GlossPost moderators: Aug 26, 2005

[quote]sylvie malich wrote:

Sara Freitas-Maltaverne wrote:

I just noticed the "Racial slur database" at "ryan(at)fuck.org" showcased on the Proz homepage.




For heaven's sake, we have to get rid of this immediately. How can a thing like this happen? And I don't see how this can be a useful resource for translators or anybody for that matter. I take great offence. This should not be taken lightly.
sylvie


Thanks for pointing it out. The info about the source has been modified.

I suggest we leave the opinion about how useful the resource is to those of us who translate movies, literature or law enforcement cases. We may don't like some words, yet we can't ignore them when we translate, can we?

Magda


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NancyLynn
Canada
Local time: 15:08
Member (2002)
French to English
+ ...

MODERATOR
unfortunately Aug 26, 2005

this language is with us - and some of us need these resources.

However, I don't feel it should be showcased on the front page. Surely there are Legal, Medical, Pharmaceutical, primary resource extraction etc etc that could be put up there, of far greater interest to mainstream translators?

Nancy


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Özden Arıkan  Identity Verified
Germany
Local time: 21:08
Member
English to Turkish
Racial Slur Database Aug 26, 2005

Hi all,

I am the GP mod who vetted the link, and I apologize for the one mistake I made during the vetting process.

Sara Freitas-Maltaverne wrote:

Not that this might not be an extremely useful resource for translators, but I personally don't like seeing it on the homepage. I guess it's the second part that has me stumped (the "fuck.org" part).


I agree. So that we have an offensive flag in Kudoz, the same consideration should be taken elsewhere in the site. In fact, after editing a GP link, we have the option whether we want the link announced in the homepage (and the first time it was introduced, I had wondered why we would not want a link to be shown there - now, I know why!)

The thing is, what caught my attention first was the 'racial' bit, so I had to check whether the source, as well as the glossary itself had a racist tone. It didn't. So I vetted, but I missed the fuck.org part; more precisely, I missed that it was the name of the source, and took it as the URL itself, so thought that it wouldn't appear in the homepage box. Here is the mistake I made, and sorry for the lack of sufficient attention at that point.



But,

sylvie malich wrote:

For heaven's sake, we have to get rid of this immediately. How can a thing like this happen? And I don't see how this can be a useful resource for translators or anybody for that matter. This should not be taken lightly.


now I have to disagree here. It is indeed a valuable source for literary translators, and even more so for those working in the area of subtitling. I translate fiction very often myself, and many times I had to find and/or invent such words. Slang is a very rapidly changing thing, and you may not find every definition in dictionaries. Also, such terms in one language would hardly have a ready equivalent in another, so you have to invent the target term quite often, and knowing about the background, or the perception behind the source word, would help you a lot in the process of inventing. This is one other point that makes the glossary in question valuable: it not only explains the meaning of a slur, but also provides the background or perception that caused that particular slur to come into use.

It has nothing to do with being mainstream, off-mainstream, or marginal, either. What could be more mainstream than literature in translation? Literature was being translated long before pharma companies began selling their products abroad. And any translator might come across such a term in any text - not necessarily in a novel, or movie subtitles, but it could well be a newspaper article, or even a court document. The existence of such terms in a piece of text tells nothing about the nature of the text itself, nor is such a term alone a statement the author makes. I think this is something we all know as translators.

[Edited at 2005-08-27 01:21]


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Parrot  Identity Verified
Spain
Local time: 21:08
Member (2002)
Spanish to English
+ ...
Actually... Aug 27, 2005

sylvie malich wrote:

For heaven's sake, we have to get rid of this immediately. How can a thing like this happen?


We (GP administrators) asked for that function, among others, and in response we now have a (fairly, at 2 months) brand-new high-tech interface (well, high-tech in comparison with what we had before, where we felt like 5 blind monkeys in a library*). The interface remits to the language forums and/or to the home page. The reason for the language forum remittance is rather obvious, I guess: when a glossary redounds to the greater glory of your TL, you might just want to "collect" it. I personally reserve homepage remittance for the large glossaries with big TL audiences (UN, IMF, WB, EU, PAHO, ITU...) and the exceptional, interesting or highly colourful ones (we've got one on Bollywood, if you care). But this homepage feature changes all the time.

Since we're talking about polls, I've got one coming up which is rather related to this, though the way it was worded may sound 'stupid': "Do you use a pop-up killer or similar application". And I asked that one because I wanted to resolve a doubt we had regarding computer safety. Many glossaries come with pop-ups, and some of them MAY JUST be harmful. (The present line of GP administration on the issue is, minimal risk, and so far so good. I'm in a mind to maintain that, but the information will also be useful for us).

*GP Pioneer Maria Eugenia Farre is still around but very busy. Authorized library personnel are Translator Resources mod, Maria Karra, Magda, Xola and myself.


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Özden Arıkan  Identity Verified
Germany
Local time: 21:08
Member
English to Turkish
As for the original topic Aug 27, 2005

Hi Nikki,

Nikki Graham wrote:

Could polls please be checked carefully before they are posted so that we can avoid having glaring grammatical errors on the homepage of a professional translation website?




Of course, it would be better to have everything flawless than otherwise, I'm not sure if we have yet the resources to linguistically check all polls, though. Anyway, I tend to see it this way: polls are like forum postings, they are published with a personal signature and are all in English, because it's the site language, but not because all people who write poll texts offer services in English. So they might have flaws, because of a lack of attention at some given point, or lack of sufficient linguistic command. Polls are not representative of the quality of this site, nor of the services offered by its translators, but their existence and the degree of interest they arouse are indicative of the participation, active involvement, and dedication of site members... just as it is the case with forum postings.

[Edited at 2005-08-27 01:09]


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Larry Salas  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 15:08
Member (2003)
Dutch to English
+ ...
Racial Slur Database Aug 28, 2005

I also could not believe my eyes when I saw this link, let alone on the home page. I think it is offensive and, rather than help the world be a better place, it promotes divisiveness and hate in the world. I almost reconsidered my membership because of it. Get rid of it quickly, please!

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