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How about a "respect" system, a sort of KudoZ+, for assistance received, but not through KudoZ?
Thread poster: Levan Namoradze

Levan Namoradze  Identity Verified
Georgia
Local time: 10:00
Member (2005)
English to Georgian
+ ...
Jul 4, 2007

Dear colleagues and Proz staff,

I would like to suggest as follows:

Along with the "normal" KudoZ points, there may be "established" another system. Something like "respect" system and any member could award a certain number of points per month (per year?) to his/her colleagues, who could not be awarded he "normal" KudoZ points due to various reasons, but deserved some other "points" through their valuable assiatnce.


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Henry Dotterer
Local time: 02:00
SITE FOUNDER
Can this concept be combined with one for an "appreciation" network? Jul 4, 2007

Hi Levan,

In the past, an "appreciation network" has been suggested. Based only on the title, do you think the two concepts could be combined into one? What would the details of this feature be?

Anyone?


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Levan Namoradze  Identity Verified
Georgia
Local time: 10:00
Member (2005)
English to Georgian
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
For sure Jul 4, 2007

Hi Henry!

Thank you for your response. In my judgement, any "network" or "system" in place may serve therefore. My point is that often, I NEED to express my gratitude to colleagues, whom I CAN NOT assign those KudoZ.

As for the details, for instance, any member may be allowed to assign (let us say) 3, 5 or 10 (as per Proz discretion) such "appreciation" points per week or month (as per Proz discretion again) to his/her colleague against any substantial assistance (for instance, clarification of a concept, provision of useful links, etc.) which could not be valued by means of KudoZ points.

I believe that could be useful.


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Niraja Nanjundan  Identity Verified
Local time: 11:30
German to English
Position in directory Jul 4, 2007

Good suggestion, Levan. I think these "appreciation" points should also determine a member's position in the directory, just as KudoZ points do in the present system.

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Henry Dotterer
Local time: 02:00
SITE FOUNDER
Would points be necessary? Jul 4, 2007

The suggestion that arose was along the lines of something like testimonials among members. Others could see the expressions of appreciation, that is all.

Do you think this would be enough, without involving points?


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Lawyer-Linguist  Identity Verified
Portugal
Local time: 06:00
Dutch to English
+ ...
No points Jul 4, 2007

Awarding points to colleagues/friends out of appreciation for things that cannot really be objectively verified in any way, for them to then have an effect on directory rankings, would:

a) be open to abuse;

b) create an unnecessary workload for moderators and staff in view of the complaints of foul play that would inevitably arise.

Keep it simple, just say thanks.

[Edited at 2007-07-04 10:00]


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Levan Namoradze  Identity Verified
Georgia
Local time: 10:00
Member (2005)
English to Georgian
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
Well, could we hear ... Jul 4, 2007

Well, could we hear opinions of other members as well? On my mind, testimonials (expressed in the same single point) could be enough.

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gianfranco  Identity Verified
Brazil
Local time: 03:00
Member (2001)
English to Italian
+ ...
It could be linked to the best forum contributions Jul 4, 2007

Lawyer-Linguist wrote:

Awarding points to colleagues/friends out of appreciation for things that cannot really be objectively verified in any way, for them to then have an effect on directory rankings, would:

a) be open to abuse;

b) create an unnecessary workload for moderators and staff in view of the complaints of foul play that would inevitably arise.

Keep it simple, just say thanks.



Hi all,

we often see in the site forum a large number of good contributions and occasionally, even some truly excellent contributions.

I think that the community lives in the forum as much as in KudoZ, and as much help is offered there, in all aspect of our profession, perhaps even more than the terminologic help offered in KudoZ.

We could add a relatively simple feature to the forum, and allow members to rate the best postings, for example, granting 1 star per member, per day, or a similar and reasonable and capped number of awards per period of time (day or week or month).

The advantage would be that the stars awarded would be justified by the content, which is visible to all, leaving little scope for abuse or arbitrary attributions.

The awarding names could be made available hovering with the mouse over the number of stars attributed, and the number of starred postings could be reflected somewhere in our profile.


I think that such feature would be positive because:

- it would incentivate excellence in forum content
- it would be accountable
- it would acknowledge the importance of the forum in our community



bye
Gianfranco


[Edited at 2007-07-04 10:33]


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Deschant
Local time: 06:00
Reply Jul 4, 2007

I have some issues with the fact that some of the colleagues who contribute the most to the site via forums, GlossPosts, etc. do not have an appropriate recognition (i.e. position in the directory) because they do not answer KudoZ, or in other words, I feel that the current system of classification in the directory (members, non-members, then by KudoZ point) is incomplete. However, I'm not sure I would like to see this "respect system" established. I'm afraid that we would soon see the "point grabbers" phenomenon which is so frequent in KudoZ, and here the issue would be still worse because the nature of this system would be even more subjective. I don't want to sound pessimistic, but I think that's what we can expect given the way some people behave in KudoZ...

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Marie-Hélène Hayles  Identity Verified
Local time: 07:00
Italian to English
+ ...
Testimonials Jul 4, 2007

I agree that a points system would be open to abuse, but I like the idea of being able to show appreciation to an esteemed colleague. Perhaps the number of testimonials received by a colleague could in itself be used as part of a grading system? - As suggested by Gianfranco, although I'd make it more general rather than restrict it to forum contributions.

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Kirill Semenov  Identity Verified
Ukraine
Local time: 08:00
Member (2004)
English to Russian
+ ...
Adding to the person's profile? Jul 4, 2007

"Testimonials" may be a nice idea! I'm not sure if we need yet another kind of points or any kind of regular (monthly/yearly) rating, so maybe it would be better to create a special field in profiles, so that anyone who wants to thank their fellow colleagues for their help in kudoZ and express his/her gratitude to others may simply make an special entry to this person's profile, to add a testiomonial entry.

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Niraja Nanjundan  Identity Verified
Local time: 11:30
German to English
Regarding points Jul 4, 2007

I would much rather not have points for anything, KudoZ, BrowniZ or the "respect and appreciation" system that is being suggested in this forum because of the abuse and "points grabbing" that already exists, which is leading to poor quality personal glossaries being uploaded, inaccurate KudoZ answers being given points and people just agreeing with KudoZ answers to get the BrowniZ.

I suggested the "appreciation" points because Levan gave KudoZ as a comparison.

[Edited at 2007-07-04 11:50]


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ICL  Identity Verified
Spain
Local time: 07:00
English to Spanish
+ ...
No Oscar awards... Jul 4, 2007

Hi,

I basically agree with Lawyer-Linguist and emoreda, the first ones to suggest in this thread that there may be room for "point grabbing" or abuse if any "point" or "star" system is implemented to appreciate the contribution of members/users in forums or in any other areas of Proz.com.

Not too long ago, there was a thread about thanking vs. not thanking agreers, and one of the posters mentioned a very interesting reason about why she thought that thanking should be left as optional: participation in Kudoz should not become a "popularity" contest, à la high-school cliques, where "my" team might end up doing the "wave" for me whenever I say something that pleases them.

I think in an adult environment such as Proz.com, we are all mature enough to realize and immediately appreciate contributions whenever they take place and based on how useful they become to each of us individually, plus there are many people who are too "shy" to contribute publicly and may send Support Tickets with great suggestions that may never be known to other site members/users and thus may never get the recognition they deserve.

My 2 eurocents from partly sunny Wiesbaden.

Best regards,

Ivette


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Michele Johnson  Identity Verified
Germany
Local time: 07:00
German to English
+ ...
Enough "pointz" systems as is, and problems similar to WWA? Jul 4, 2007

I'm interested in principle, but similar to Kiril and Lawyer-Linguist, my 2 immediate concerns are:

1) I really think the number of points (as a concept) already verges on the absurd. Kudoz and Browniz are fine, but I wonder if we really need Starz or Thankz or any additional point system? It doesn't seem so professional to me.

2) WWA debacle, here we go again. If it's a feedback system, do I have to opt in, or totally opt out? Do I have control over what people write? What is to keep someone (logged member, unlogged member) from sabotaging my Testimonialz? What if a member has 20 positive Thankz messages, then a competitor leaves an anonymous negative message? Or for that matter, why shouldn't we allow negative feedback, if we're going to have such a system? Do staff and mods really have the time to vet these entries? Don't make me link to the WWA mega-thread ...

In my experience, the best way to send appreciation to an esteemed colleague is to drop them an email.


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Levan Namoradze  Identity Verified
Georgia
Local time: 10:00
Member (2005)
English to Georgian
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
I see... Jul 4, 2007

I do understand almost all the responses hereunder. But please, be kindly advised that the ONLY reason for opening this discussion (once again?) was that I TRULY NEED some mechanism in addition to the KudoZ points as I explained above. If any additional mechanism (points or alike) may create any basis for FURTHER increase of "the point grubbing practice" (and I strongly believe that such practice is already enogh extensive) or alike (no offense!), then the Proz staff could allow for division of those 4 KudoZ points.

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How about a "respect" system, a sort of KudoZ+, for assistance received, but not through KudoZ?

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