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Peer grading should not be anonymous.
Thread poster: bea0
bea0  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 18:22
English to Spanish
+ ...
Jun 12, 2001

It would be highly interesting to add a link to the profile of members who peer grade answers.



Proz.com offers us translators the chance to exchange ideas with language professionals all over the world, but we are unprotected before anonymous peer grading comments that are not only arbitrary but also disqualisfying.





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Nikki Scott-Despaigne  Identity Verified
Local time: 00:22
French to English
Jun 13, 2001

This one had crossed my mind too. I had even thought about initialling one or two of my comments. However, unless it was possible in a protected way, I though that some unscrupulous people might start using false PROZ identities when grading, trying to pass themselves off for another member.



Anonymous grading comments are perhaps not such a bad idea after all. The unhelpful comments can be disregarded.


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gianfranco  Identity Verified
Brazil
Local time: 19:22
Member (2001)
English to Italian
+ ...
Jun 14, 2001

I agree with the suggestion of adding automatically the authors name to the peer-grading comments.

I have seen some unappropriate or disparaging comments, obviously anonymous.

Also, the persons receiving a comment could check on the credentials of the author and get a feel for the reliability of the help received.





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Silvio Picinini  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 15:22
English to Portuguese
+ ...
Jun 18, 2001

I agree to the idea of identifying the peer too.

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Henry Dotterer
Local time: 18:22
SITE FOUNDER
Jun 19, 2001

Personally, I think the cons of including peer grader names outweigh the pros. I will explain my opinion...



The KudoZ structure is designed to focus attention on the term(s) to be translated. From that standpoint, peer comments should be strictly language related (ex. \"should be plural\", \"missing dependent clause\", etc.), and should be directed not to the answerer, but to the asker. When someone makes a peer grade along the lines of \"you stink\", it is destructive, I agree, and we should work to discourage this type of peer comment.



Perhaps including peer grader names would help to prevent such comments. But the flip side of including names is this: it would allow the discussion to be carried further away from the term(s) that require translation. That is, a comment like \"should be plural\" might be met with a personal retort (via email through profile page) from the (offended) answerer.



This would not be good. If an answer should be plural and isn\'t, the asker needs to know. But the person who pointed it out should not have to back up his/her opinion later to the answerer. Answerers should put their best cases forward, and peer graders should put their best cases forward (don\'t forget, this is all on behalf of the asker!), and in the end, the asker should make a decision based on the information presented. We should not facilitate answerer-peer debates, as this will take away from the focus on the task at hand.



(For what it is worth, answerer names are only included to give credit where it is due. The important thing is the answers they present.)



Personally, the threat of a \"drive-by\" peer comment poking a hole in my proposal prompts me to fortify my answers from the start. This is a good thing. As for the occasional \"you stink\" comments, well, I doubt that many askers put any stock in them.



Of course, if people are stongly in favor of making peer grading non-anonymous, we will try it...I am interested in hearing more opinions on this...


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xxxeurotransl
German to English
+ ...
Jun 19, 2001

Graders should definitely NOT be able to hide behind an anonymous system any longer. There has been too much abuse, and I, too, was seduced into writing up a less than objective grade comment at times.



If the answerer feels the need to send a nasty e-mail to the grader, so be it. My advice: if you don\'t like what you read in your e-mail, delete it (and you may also want to block out the sender of such messages). Just ignore it and move on if that happens.


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Alaa Zeineldine  Identity Verified
Egypt
Local time: 00:22
Member (2002)
English to Arabic
+ ...
Jun 19, 2001

I agree that the cons of identifying graders outweigh the pros. I had also thought of initialling my grade once, but after some pondering, I realized that I might be setting myself up to expect a return favor.



Identifying graders is likely to lead to favoritism, partisanship, and ultimately compromised objectivity.



Alaa


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DPS
Australia
Local time: 08:22
Member
German to English
+ ...
Jun 19, 2001

Eurotrans is right. It is wrong to allow graders to hide behind an anonymous system any longer. Abuse can be witnessed almost daily, and many of us have been the victims of it in the past. Grades often seem unreasonable and rather based on personal likes or dislikes.

The biggest problem, however, is that many members tend to answer questions overzealously simply to increase the balance of their Kudoz accounts, which leads them astray to areas they are not necessarily knowledgable in, to irrational grading of \"competitors\", endless repetitions of answers already posted, pasting of excessive - and often completely unrelated - website excerpts and what not.



What is often left sight of is that the idea of term help is in the first place to help colleagues or the public (as potential future clients) with language questions; \"consolidating\" our savings accounts is important too, but still should have only secondary priority.



I acknowledge of course that peer grading is important, since the asker otherwise in many cases might be unable to evaluate the quality of a reply. I would suggest though that instead of the current system where anyone can merely give a grade 0-4 without any comment and without disclosing their identity, those who feel they have to comment, add, correct, or praise an answer should post a completely new reply to the question.



I think that such a system where the comments have been explained and reasoned would less likely lead to nasty e-mail exchanges. The wiser ones of us would simply ignore unfounded hate e-mail anyway.



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xxxeurotransl
German to English
+ ...
Jun 19, 2001

Eliminating the grades altogether would be one possibility. But, they might be used for awarding KudoZ points in case the asker fails to do so (see Henry\'s message).



I think identifying the graders will not lead to favoritism, etc. as one member has pointed out. On the contrary: if the graders are known, there will be no more room for \"shady\" or \"less than honorable\" actions. Anyone who wants to post a nasty comment about somebody else will think twice before attaching his or her name to messages such as \"complete nonsense - as usual\", etc. - or worse.



I admit this whole KudoZ issue is a tough nut to crack, and it\'ll be while (????) before we find (???) a perfect solution.


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Henry Dotterer
Local time: 18:22
SITE FOUNDER
Jun 24, 2001

Thanks for sharing your opinions here, and via private email. The topic of anonymous peer grading has been discussed at length among site moderators, too.



More and more people have suggested that peer grading of KudoZ answers no longer be anonymous.



On principle, I had contended that what was important was not the identity of the peer reviewer, but the content of his or her comment. Unfortunately, many of the comments have no linguistic merit, and are of no value to askers (for example, comments along the lines of \"simply wrong\", \"why do you guess?\", \"huh?\", etc., are difficult to glean value from.)



I have therefore changed peer review as follows:

- Henceforth, peer comments will be accompanied by the peer\'s name

- There will no longer be \"grading\". Instead, there will only be \"agree\" or \"disagree\" options.



Please share your opinions in a few weeks on whether or not this move has resulted in a change for the better.


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gianfranco  Identity Verified
Brazil
Local time: 19:22
Member (2001)
English to Italian
+ ...
Jun 24, 2001

Henry,

I like the new format \'agree/disagree plus comment\'.



This is so much better than the previous grading system and it has enough flexibility to provide feedback to the asker, wich is the ultimate aim of these comments.



Well done!



Still, I don\'t see the names of the authors appearing next to the comments?!?



Is this a bug or it happens because you are still working on it?







[ This Message was edited by: on 2001-06-24 07:27 ]


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xxxeurotransl
German to English
+ ...
Jun 24, 2001

Henry, award yourself a couple of KudoZ points for introducing these changes to the KudoZ section. Well done and thank you!

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Telesforo Fernandez
Local time: 03:52
English to Spanish
+ ...
Jun 26, 2001

I think the peers grading should be abolished. It is so anonymous and can be abused. Come on, we have too many frills to this PROZ questions features which is the USP of this site.Too many feathers may kill the bird. Henry are you listening?

We should surely do away with this peers grading. Let the asker do the job. Or at the most, the moderators could add their comments.If they are good enough to moderate, they can also be the\'peers\'.


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Rebekka Groß  Identity Verified
Local time: 23:22
English to German
Jun 27, 2001

I don\'t think peer grading should be abolished completely although I am not sure a simple \"disagree\" will be of much help if the peer doesn\'t qualify this comment.



Being able to peer grade ideally makes it easier for the asker to decide and it gives other people who would have given the same answer the chance to reinforce the correct answer(s).


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Henry Dotterer
Local time: 18:22
SITE FOUNDER
Jun 28, 2001

Thanks for raising this topic, bea0.



As a result of this discussion, emails sent directly to me, and the outcome of a parallel discussion among moderators, peer grading was changed, and is no longer anonymous.



When one disagrees, one is prompted to give a reason.



Peer grades that were posted prior to the change will remain anonymous.



I am \"locking\" this thread.


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Peer grading should not be anonymous.

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