ProZ.com: pros...or dangerous amateurs?

On 2002-04-18 02:05, nonogogo wrote:

A good translator has a lot of knowledge and it is like knowledge from any profession.

BUT

I believe one can become a good translator without necessarily going to translating school or having a diploma. BUT, the person doing this has learned by doing. I\'m in favor or accreditation by PEER REVIEW. That\'s how good science is carried on also. Not by the diplomas...how many people realize that? In that sense, translation is like science...



That\'s all for now. Please let\'s not fight. Let\'s get something done...









Jane,



True, as far as it goes. But I am not aware that anyone without a PhD is going to get many papers published in scientific journals, peer review or not peer review.




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On 2002-04-18 02:05, nonogogo wrote:

A good translator has a lot of knowledge and it is like knowledge from any profession.

BUT

I believe one can become a good translator without necessarily going to translating school or having a diploma. BUT, the person doing this has learned by doing. I\'m in favor or accreditation by PEER REVIEW. That\'s how good science is carried on also. Not by the diplomas...how many people realize that? In that sense, translation is like science...



That\'s all for now. Please let\'s not fight. Let\'s get something done...







But the discussion really revolves around establishing rules and regulations for our profession. As I pointed out, I don\'t care how you acquire your translation skills (school, mentoring), as long as admission to our profession is regulated and standards are defined (as is the case for lawyers and all other professions). Take lawyers in the UK, for example: you can go to law school or you can train with lawyers (\"formal\" vs. \"informal\" route).



Again, it is a real pain to see that we are the only profession where any bum can just come along and harvest what others have sown. And unless we change that, translators will never be as regarded and recognized as other professions are. An even greater pain are those \"interlopers\" that keep telling us that we don\'t even have the right to protect our profession or to set standards, and they will always come crawling out of the woodwork trying to silence the few professionals this site has. ▲ Collapse

On 2002-04-18 03:43, Rick Henry wrote:

My take on it is that translators have more in common with musicians. A (good) musician has innate talent. What this musician choses to do with this talent can be many things. S/He can develop her/his craft, and yes I believe it\'s a craft just as much as translating is a craft, by taking lessons and studying - privately, or through the university. They key to improving any craft is a combination of study - in any form, and practice. Without BOTH of those things you\'ll only get half the picture.



R.

==





Very good point! To quote one of my professors (a leading conference interpreter in her field and a member of AIIC):



People who speak a few languages without formal training are like \"hobby musicians\": they play at home or in the garage or among friends.



Concert pianists, opera singers, etc. have gone through gruelling training at a conservatory, practising for hours every day. And professional translators/interpreters are the \"concert pianists\", \"opera singers\", etc. of the language industry.



In other words, those detractors that attack anyone who favours rules for our profession are just \"hobby musicians\"; the rest of us give concerts at The Met. ▲ Collapse

On 2002-04-18 12:46, mayet wrote:

I am one of those translators who should be hiding in the shadows so that my mistakes do not offend those translating in blissful competence.



Arguments in my defense:



I have lived the first half of my life in Germany, the second half in the United States. My highest degree is Dr. rer. nat. (PhD) in Chemistry (Biochemistry).

The German university admissions system required the \"Great Latinum\" (or another old language) and 6 years of English (or another modern language).



Please, tell me: Should I now (having worked as a translator for quite a while) be forced to shell out 1000s of dollars for courses, which in quality do not come close to those that I have already taken?



Maybe, some of you nice people could start including all the facts for all of us? I know some of you and thought that begging might help some.







Have most of you lost the ability to read and assimilate information? This is not about degrees, but about rules for our profession.



Ursula, no one is asking you to fork over thousands of dollars; there are two ways of getting your translation-specific training: \"formal\" vs. \"informal\" route (see above).



Frankly, I don\'t see the problem. Many of you have asked here and in other threads: What can be done to stop the rate decline? What can we do to be recognized as professionals?



Well, the answer is \"simple\": to achieve these objectives, translators will have to organize in the same manner as all other professions have.



In Canada, these things have been achieved to a large extent (95%). Canadian clients will always ask for a translator certified by one of the provincial associations or accredited by the Translation Bureau. Certification is obtained through exams or peer review, and accreditation through peer review (Translation Bureau). So, if you don\'t like this way, too bad for you. In Canada, we are fully recognized as professionals (and we always get mentioned in the same breath with lawyers, etc.). If you don\'t want to achieve the same level of recognition in your countries, suit yourself!

[ This Message was edited by: on 2002-04-18 13:24 ] ▲ Collapse

Very good point! To quote one of my professors (a leading conference interpreter in her field and a member of AIIC):



People who speak a few languages without formal training are like \"hobby musicians\": they play at home or in the garage or among friends.



Concert pianists, opera singers, etc. have gone through gruelling training at a conservatory, practising for hours every day. And professional translators/interpreters are the \"concert pianists\", \"opera singers\", etc. of the language industry.



In other words, those detractors that attack anyone who favours rules for our profession are just \"hobby musicians\"; the rest of us give concerts at The Met.





I wish I could speak a few languages, I speak and write only two.

In rebuttal to your quotes:



Edison was a pre-high-school-drop-out. His father considered him \"somewhat dumb\".

Einstein could not get a job after graduation. Neither his grades nor his reputation cut it in the eyes of his \"superiors\".


These are only the two most famous examples, there are many more. Grades are poor predictors for success in a profession or for ethical behaviour.

Since we are considering examples: Many experts in the Enron clique are Harvard graduates. (Now, there they are: They did not know anything, and they did not care. You can see their intelligence shine in committee hearings.)

Of course, I would never think that a certification would not help a basically lazy person with few interests, no aptitude for independent learning and no morals. The problem with degrees (including PhDs and certificates of any kind) is that they are handed to inexperienced people.




Disclaimer:

This was written for the sake of balance. Everyone in this forum with a translator\'s certificate is explicitely excluded from all negative implications.



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