ProZ.com global directory of translation services
 The translation workplace
Ideas

 
Pages in topic:   < [1 2 3] >
User
Discussion for ProZ.com & TAUS present: The Great Translation Debate (2011)

This discussion belongs to ProZ.com's Virtual Conferences » "Discussion for ProZ.com & TAUS present: The Great Translation Debate (2011)".
You can see the ProZ.com's virtual conferences page and participate in this discussion from there.


Drew MacFadyen
Local time: 14:05
SITE STAFF
Aurora, you are registered Sep 14, 2011

Hi Aurora, I did a search for "Aurora" at http://www.proz.com/virtual-conferences/262/registrants/ and your name did come up - so you are registered, and should be all set to go.

Thanks

Drew


Direct link Reply with quote
 

Katalin Horváth McClure  Identity Verified
Local time: 14:05
Member (2002)
English to Hungarian
+ ...
Search does not work right Sep 14, 2011

Drew,
Please do look into this, as the search does not seem to work OK.
I could not find Aurora either, neither by first name, nor by last name.
Then I tried the Advanced Search, and selected Argentina as the Country.
The search found 39 registrants, 20 of them displayed on the first page - Aurora was not among them, so I clicked the "Next" button. To my surprise, it did not continue the Argentina list, but simply displayed ALL registrants (976), in other words, it completely "forgot" the search criteria.
I tested this for another country, France, same problem. It doesn't matter if I use the "Next" button, or "2" to go to the next page, it always goes back to the full list.

Katalin

[Edited at 2011-09-14 02:12 GMT]


Direct link Reply with quote
 

Aurora Humarán  Identity Verified
Local time: 15:05
English to Spanish
Still have problems Sep 14, 2011


Drew MacFadyen wrote:

Hi Aurora, I did a search for "Aurora" at http://www.proz.com/virtual-conferences/262/registrants/ and your name did come up - so you are registered, and should be all set to go.

Thanks

Drew


Thanks, Drew, but I still cannot find my name.

I got the exact same results Katalin is commenting. I will appreciate your help with this.

Au


ps: in which page do you see me?


Direct link Reply with quote
 

BeaDeer  Identity Verified
English to Slovenian
+ ...
I suggest a shift of focus, from TMs---> TERMINOLOGY. Sep 14, 2011


Michael Beijer wrote:

Yes, it does seem to keep coming back to that problem. My personal opinion is that people like TAUS, and MyMemory, etc. should perhaps shift their focus from TM to TERM BASES.

That is, from TM --> terminology.

That way they could still feed their machines, and no one would have to worry about legal issues.


This is possible for content translated with taxpayers' money. But there isn't a single NDA that I have signed in the past fifteen years with commercial clients which does not include terminology. Uploading of any kind of material to the web or sharing TMs is completely out of the question.

And of course there is the question of intellectual property that is never discussed when it comes to "TM sharing". Under the EU law, a TM belongs to the person or company that has created it. Even in the US one has to agree to sign away (give or sell) one's ownership rights ("work for hire"). The "sweat of the brow" doctrine applies: whoever invests time, money and effort into building a data base, owns the thing. Have you paid for your CAT? If yes, you own the product that you have built with your work. Even if you signed no NDAs regarding terminology, "sharing" TMs means giving away, for free, what you have *worked* to create, so that somebody else may make a profit.

It would seem that freelancers often aren't aware of these implications. Even when they are, they perceive themselves as powerless - the global translation brokering companies have cornered the market and have the upper hand.

I would ask why are legal aspects consistently ignored, left out of such debates?

A legal representative of SDL Trados admitted a few years ago at a FIT conference that, yes, a translator may stand by his or her ownership rights, but that this would cost a translator jobs. Does this mean that we should accept "might makes right" as an axiom?

Years ago I was offered to head a local branch of one of the big international translation brokers. The most significant thing for me was when the founder of the company said "well, translators should get as much as 40% of the price; in return, they will get as much work as they can accept". I replied that working in a sweatshop wasn't my idea of a decent life.

We are NOT gadgets, Jaron Lanier has a point there! Translation requires much skill and expertise, years of study and work. Language changes as culture and technology change. Machines will not be able to replace a human. Not in the long run. Machine translation has its specialised purposes, of course, such as in quickly sifting through large amounts of intelligence data.

But the focus of this particular debate should really be on us, our role in the global world.
We should resist being corralled into (or by) the hive mind.

We should refuse to be commoditized - this is what this debate is really about.

Peace to you all





















[Edited at 2011-09-14 14:42 GMT]

[Edited at 2011-09-14 14:48 GMT]


Direct link Reply with quote
 

Michael Beijer  Identity Verified
United Kingdom
Local time: 19:05
Member (2009)
Dutch to English
+ ...
'All words are in the public domain.' Michael Beijer Sep 14, 2011


But there isn't a single NDA that I have signed in the past fifteen years with commercial clients which does not include terminology. Uploading of any kind of material to the web or sharing TMs is completely out of the question.


As far as I know there is no way to copyright terminology. That is: bilingual glossaries, consisting of lists of words. Problems arise when there are definitions of these words/terms ...

When I translate a text for a client, I wouldn't go so far as to say that the TM is mine, because, after all, the source material was and remains theirs. However, the glossaries that I create when working on a project are mine, to do with as I please. Which, in my case means: give away for free, as I am a firm believer in free information.

Michael

[Edited at 2011-09-14 19:08 GMT]


Direct link Reply with quote
 

Aurora Humarán  Identity Verified
Local time: 15:05
English to Spanish
Help with registration Sep 14, 2011


Drew MacFadyen wrote:

Hi Aurora, I did a search for "Aurora" at http://www.proz.com/virtual-conferences/262/registrants/ and your name did come up - so you are registered, and should be all set to go.

Thanks

Drew


Hi Drew,

Can you please indicate in which page you see me? I seem not to be in the list. (I have also tried with Humaran [without accent] but that does not work either).
Thanks for your help.

Au


Direct link Reply with quote
 

Pablo Julián Davis  Identity Verified
Local time: 13:05
Member (2011)
Spanish to English
+ ...
Cannot find Aurora's registration either Sep 15, 2011

I registered in the last half-hour, and my name shows up via the registrants search. Out of curiosity, I searched for Aurora via both given name and surname (the latter w/ and w/o accent), and she does not appear as a registrant. I can also confirm that on the second page of the advanced search using Argentina as criterion, the criterion has been 'forgotten' and the general list of 1,000+ participants is what appears.
Both out of concern for a colleague, and wishing for my own part to be able to access a reliable, complete list of registrants, I would very much like to see a solution found to this problem.
Thanks!


Direct link Reply with quote
 

BeaDeer  Identity Verified
English to Slovenian
+ ...
Invite Jaron Lanier to the debate! Sep 15, 2011

If the organisers of this "great translation debate" wanted to make it interesting, an open and thoughtful debate, they should invite Jaron Lanier to the discussion. He is the one person I would love to hear in this setting and would pay to join the debate.

Direct link Reply with quote
 

Drew MacFadyen
Local time: 14:05
SITE STAFF
Issues with search Sep 15, 2011

That's strange - I am able to search and find Aurora properly, but when pseudo logged as you Katalin I cannot. Not sure why search is working for some and not others. We will fix this straight away - thanks for letting me know.

Drew


Direct link Reply with quote
 

Drew MacFadyen
Local time: 14:05
SITE STAFF
Freelance translator perspective Sep 15, 2011

Thank you all for your comments and input.

We are happy to include translators on panels and discussions. It's something we've been trying to do without success. Freelance translators that are willing to participate in the debate should contact me directly. That said a number of the panelists have also been translators.

We expect that there will be people with deep reservations among the participants. And as these are interactive sessions, we hope there will be ample opportunity to have all views expressed. In the end of course it's participants votes that will decide whether motions are passed or not!

Regards,

Drew


Direct link Reply with quote
 
Coti
Argentina
Local time: 15:05
English to Spanish
Cannot find Aurora's registration either Sep 28, 2011

I have just made the same search (for Aurora) and her name does not come up.
Regards,
Elizabeth Casals


Direct link Reply with quote
 
Stephen Reader
Local time: 20:05
German to English
Freedom of information and language as a 'living evolving organism' - Cf. JMD and Michael Beijer Sep 29, 2011

With JMD and Michael Beijer.- Just to second that line of argument where terms are concerned. Cf. the (in)famous plant/gene patents issue. By analogy - do we want to apply for a licence or face prosecution (or lend that mental set credence) every time we even think of the noun, 'neem'?

Direct link Reply with quote
 

Oleg Delendyk  Identity Verified
Ukraine
Local time: 21:05
Member (2007)
English to Russian
+ ...
What is TAUS? Sep 29, 2011

-

Direct link Reply with quote
 

pangeanic
Spain
Pangeanic - cannot enter debate Sep 29, 2011

We are TAUS members and MT developers, but cannot enter the debate. What can be done to have access? I see other TAUS members have had the same problem.

Direct link Reply with quote
 

Drew MacFadyen
Local time: 14:05
SITE STAFF
Pangeanic - i show you as registered Sep 29, 2011

I pseudo logged in as you and am seeing you as properly registered.

Thanks

Drew


Direct link Reply with quote
 
Pages in topic:   < [1 2 3] >


To report site rules violations or get help, contact a site moderator:

Moderator(s) of this forum
Drew MacFadyen[Call to this topic]

You can also contact site staff by submitting a support request »

Discussion for ProZ.com & TAUS present: The Great Translation Debate (2011)






Across Personal Edition – Free Full Version for Freelance Translators
Across is an integrated CAT tool, which means that you will find everything you need in one place.

Freelance translators receive a full version of Across Personal Edition, a single-workstation version of Across, for free. You are always working in one and the same environment, regardless of whether you create a new project or translate a document

More info »
Déjà Vu X3
Try it, Love it

Find out why Déjà Vu is today the most flexbible, customizable and user-friendly tool on the market. See the brand new features in action: Completely redesigned user interface Live Preview Inline spell checking Inline formatting and more

More info »