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tool to count words in Tag Editor?
Thread poster: Marion Delarue

Marion Delarue  Identity Verified
France
Local time: 19:19
Spanish to French
+ ...
Apr 15, 2008

hello!
Is there a tool to count words in Tag Editor like in word?
thanks


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Henk Peelen  Identity Verified
Netherlands
Local time: 19:19
Member (2002)
German to Dutch
+ ...
Workbench Apr 15, 2008

Menu Tools, Analyse

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Erik Freitag  Identity Verified
Germany
Local time: 19:19
Member (2006)
Dutch to German
+ ...
Please read the documentation Apr 15, 2008

Dear Marion,

I strongly suggest that you read the documentation that came with your software (I reckon you did buy it?), so you get a general overview about how these basic functions work.
The documentation is installed as PDF files onto your computer, you can find them in your start folder.

Kind regards,
Erik


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ehs_proz
South Korea
Local time: 02:49
English to Korean
SDL Trados Apr 16, 2008

Hi Marion,

When I used Trados 6.5, I had the same question. At the time, I had to use Workbench-> Tools> Analysis. I wish a function could show wordcount as I translate.

Now, I have SDL Trados 2007. I'm new on this version. I am not good at it.

I tried this way :
1) Opened SDL Trados Synergy (Start> Programs> SDL International> SDL Trados 2007> Synergy)
2) Create a project for a translation job(Synergy Toolbar-> Create New Project)

I was able to see word count by status(via Project Status tab) by pressing "Project" button(from Status bar).
I really like this feature.







[Edited at 2008-04-16 00:46]


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maciejm  Identity Verified
Poland
Local time: 19:19
English to Polish
+ ...
Analysis Apr 16, 2008

Mihea Shim wrote:

Hi Marion,

When I used Trados 6.5, I had the same question. At the time, I had to use Workbench-> Tools> Analysis. I wish a function could show wordcount as I translate.


This function can show you the wordcount as you translate. Just analyse the file and all 100% matches represent the portion that is done. Everything else, i.e. fuzzy matches and no matches represent the portion to be done.

M


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Vito Smolej
Germany
Local time: 19:19
Member (2004)
English to Slovenian
+ ...
about 100% matches Apr 16, 2008

... all 100% matches represent the portion that is done...

Factually incorrect as far as I know.

If the analysis is done with a TM defined, then "the portion that is done" will turn up under "Repetitions": that's the segments already present in the TM. If there's a new segment in the text, that's unknown to TM, then it will be counted once as a no-match and N-1 times as a 100% match (N being the number of its occurences). Pretty much the same policy applies to the fuzzies (1x no-match plus N-1 times in the corresponding similarity class).

The point is essential - and never stated explicitely! - when the prices for repeats are discussed: if a no-match sentence costs me 100% to translate, how much is then my cost, and eventually my price, for a repeat?

Readers, who would not touch CAT with a ten-foot pole, do not need to answer.

My indicator for "how much has been done" is always the no-match count: until it's down to zero, the work is not yet finished.

[Edited at 2008-04-16 05:32]


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Heinrich Pesch  Identity Verified
Finland
Local time: 20:19
Member (2003)
Finnish to German
+ ...
Use SDLX Apr 16, 2008

Then you know all the time how many words are untranslated. SDLX comes with SDL Trados and is easy to learn.
But in TE I copy the rest of the file to word and count the words there, quick and dirty approach.


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Henk Peelen  Identity Verified
Netherlands
Local time: 19:19
Member (2002)
German to Dutch
+ ...
A temporarily, dummy TM could provide you with a "neutral" count Apr 16, 2008

Whether you are already translating the document or not, the "Total" line in the analysis always tells you the total amount of words. The "Match type" doesn't affect the Total word count.

In case you already translated the file (partly of totally) and for invoicing reasons would want a Match type breakdown not affected by your own translation efforts, you could take the "virgin" files from the e-mail the client did send you. In case he didn't send an TM, but just a file to translate, and you'd want want a Match type breakdown not affected by your own translation efforts, you could put a temporarily, dummy TM in your Workbench (Ctrl + N) on your desk top or so. After analysing, you put that dummy TM in the garbage bin, return to your normal TM and continue translating.


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Marion Delarue  Identity Verified
France
Local time: 19:19
Spanish to French
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
tools to count translated words Apr 16, 2008

Thank you all, now I have the choice!

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maciejm  Identity Verified
Poland
Local time: 19:19
English to Polish
+ ...
Factually correct Apr 16, 2008

Vito Smolej wrote:

... all 100% matches represent the portion that is done...

Factually incorrect as far as I know.



Since for the last two months I have been doing a very large project of about 90 thousand no match words in a single.ttx file, I know what I am talking about. If you use the TM you are working with and, let's say at the end of each working day, analyse the file, you will see by comparing analyses from consecutive days that the number of 100% matches grows, and that represents what you have done so far. The number of no matches decreases and the same happens with repetitions, which shows that whatever they are, they are in the portion of the text that is still to be done. As far as the number of fuzzy matches is concerned, it fluctuates - possibly, when the translation memory is updated, it re-classifies the fuzzy segments. The analysis of the finished text shows such and such number of 100% matches, which is equal to the total number of words in the text, and zeroes in all other categories, repetitions included. The total number of words never changes.

It is important that you use the same TM that you are working with, and that you do not change the minimum match value in the TM Options, since changing it e.g. from 50% to 70% will affect the number of both no matches and fuzzies. The lower the minimum match value, the lower the number of no matches and the higher the number of "low fuzzies" - 50 - 74% category. In the case of the file I am talking about, changing the minimum match value by 20 % resulted in changing the number of no match words by as much as 2 thousand.

Of course the indicator of how much I still have to do is the number of no match words, even though the fuzzies in the 50% - 74% category will probably take as much time for less money, but how much the client pays is of no interest to me here, I only want to show the way of counting words while your work is in progress.

M


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Marion Delarue  Identity Verified
France
Local time: 19:19
Spanish to French
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
which value in minimum match value? Apr 16, 2008

Thank you Maciejm.
This is just what I started to do from this morning (counting words comparing the no matches of the different days).
You talk about the minimum value of the matches. What sould be the value in this field?
Now I have it at 50%, but actually it is what I had by default, and I started to translate my document without paying attention about it.
Now I understand why before I started to translate, I analysed the document with the TM that the client gave me and her analyse didn´t match with mine... the diference was not so big and her analyse said more "no matches", so I didn´t say anything... I think the reason of the difference is that she had a higher minimum match value.

But now the question is which minimum match value should I work with? and Can I change it now I begun with the translation already?

Thank you


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maciejm  Identity Verified
Poland
Local time: 19:19
English to Polish
+ ...
Minimum match value Apr 16, 2008

Marion Delarue wrote:



But now the question is which minimum match value should I work with? and Can I change it now I begun with the translation already?

Thank you


I would not change anything now. At 50 % you just have to remember that the relatively high number of the fuzzies in the 50% - 74% category means that they will take some time sooner or later, since they are usually not very similar to what you want. Or you may want to make it higher, e.g. 70%, which would mean more no matches but fewer fuzzies. Anyway, when you have decided on some value, just stick to it.

BTW, it is also quite interesting to see what happens when there are several closely related files with high repetition rate, which one translates using he same TM, as may be the case with instruction manuals of similar machines made by the same manufacturer. The results of the analysis are completely different when you analyse them separately one at a time and all of them at once. In such a case one should start the translation from the one that has the highest number of no match words, when analysed jointly. I know too little about the theory behind it but that is what I was told by a more experienced colleague, when it once took me several hours to translate a file (one of four) that supposedly had fewer than 100 no match words and a very large number of fuzzies.
M


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ehs_proz
South Korea
Local time: 02:49
English to Korean
a function could show wordcount like in word Apr 18, 2008

maciejm wrote:

Mihea Shim wrote:

Hi Marion,

When I used Trados 6.5, I had the same question. At the time, I had to use Workbench-> Tools> Analysis. I wish a function could show wordcount as I translate.


This function can show you the wordcount as you translate. Just analyse the file and all 100% matches represent the portion that is done. Everything else, i.e. fuzzy matches and no matches represent the portion to be done.

M


Hi Maciejm,


I meant the wordcount like in word....by clicking few buttons. At that time, I really enjoyed the features in Trados in word as a novice. To me, the features(repetition, word count, copying sources etc.) seemed very neat. I hadn't really experienced in any other materials(formats) including TagEditor.
Then I had the chance to work on TagEditor. I had to struggle with unfamiliar stuffs(tags, protection, inconveniency in word count etc.).
As I have got used to features like Analysis, some of tags, Settings and some of file formats, I could begin to like TagEditor better than Word.


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