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Help request: "Unclean" a clean document after revision?
Thread poster: David Jessop

David Jessop  Identity Verified
Spain
Member
Spanish to English
+ ...
Apr 16, 2009

Hello everyone,

I have been using Trados for some time but have stuck mostly to basic functions. Typically, what I do is use Trados as a tool for translating and then once I am done with the translating part, I “clean it up” with the Workbench Menu function. I then do revisions and proofreading from the “cleaned up” version and afterwards submit that version to my client. A client has asked me to provide them with a clean and unclean version of a project. I would like to provide the client with a fully revised bilingual (unclean) file as well. Until now, the only way I know to do this is, while revising the clean document, to have the bilingual file open next to it, and make changes manually.

So my question is: after revising the cleaned up document, is there a way to “unclean” it, thereby giving me a bilingual file in its final revised version? If there is no way to do this precisely, is it possible to handle this situation in a more automated fashion? I am sure I am not the only who has struggled with this question but cannot find any information anywhere. Any help is appreciated!

Thanks!

Best,
David


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Ildiko Laskay  Identity Verified
Hungary
Local time: 22:59
Member (2009)
English to Hungarian
+ ...
First proofread the bilingual file, then clean it up Apr 16, 2009

Hello David,

You should make a slight change in your workflow.
When you're ready with the translation, don't clean it up immediately, but do the revision and proofreading on the bilingual file. You can hide the source text if it disturbs you at this stage. Then only when all the corrections/changes etc. are made, clean up the file using the option 'Update TM.' This will save all the changes to the TM as well.

Ildikó


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David Jessop  Identity Verified
Spain
Member
Spanish to English
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
Thanks and a fear! Apr 16, 2009

Ildiko Laskay wrote:

Hello David,

You should make a slight change in your workflow.
When you're ready with the translation, don't clean it up immediately, but do the revision and proofreading on the bilingual file. You can hide the source text if it disturbs you at this stage. Then only when all the corrections/changes etc. are made, clean up the file using the option 'Update TM.' This will save all the changes to the TM as well.

Ildikó


Hello…

Thank you for the helpful reply. I will try this next time!

The only fear that I have is, despite the fact that the Trados scripted text will be hidden, I will damage something so Workbench will not read it correctly when cleaning it up. Is this a founded concern?

Best,
David


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Marijke Singer  Identity Verified
United Kingdom
Local time: 21:59
Dutch to English
+ ...
Corrupting the unclean file Apr 16, 2009

David Jessop wrote:

The only fear that I have is, despite the fact that the Trados scripted text will be hidden, I will damage something so Workbench will not read it correctly when cleaning it up. Is this a founded concern?

Best,
David


Yes, this is a concern but if you stick to not touching the first and last letters of a sentence (therefore, put your cursor just before the second letter in a sentence and change the word and then go back and delete just the first letter by first selecting it) you should be fine (and the same for the last word of a sentence although usually you have a full stop too and, therefore, you will not be messing with the code). Another option is to only make changes with find and replace. This will not touch any of the hidden text or the code. Should you damage the coding anyway, no worries. You can copy and paste code too. Just make all hidden text visible and you will see where and what has been corrupted. If you clean and Trados tells you there were problems with segments, find them in your clean file by searching for >> in acid green (you can search in Word based on colour). Then you can fix the problem in your unclean file and clean again. Try it out with a document for yourself first and get a feel for it. The best way to learn is by doing in my book. The tool is there to help you and you should not be afraid of it!

[Edited at 2009-04-16 09:34 GMT]


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Margreet Logmans  Identity Verified
Netherlands
Local time: 22:59
English to Dutch
+ ...
Possible, but preventable Apr 16, 2009

I was still typing when Marijke posted, so this may be a bit of an echo of what she's saying...


Yes, it is possible to do some damage, but only at the beginning and end of segments. That's where the Trados markings are - they look something like this in your bilingual file with all text displayed: {} Damage to these markings can be disastrous.

There are two ways to prevent this:
-If you need to make changes at the beginning or end of a segment, you can 'unhide' the text in Word. Do NOT touch the purple markings.
-You can also keep Workbench running and simply open the segment you want to edit. You will then see both source and target for that segment. Close it again after you've finished editing. This is the safest way.

After making your changes (either way), make sure to tick 'update TM' when you clean up your document. This way you will also have the corrections in your TM.
If you do this correctly, nothing will go wrong. If you want to be absolutely sure, copy your file and edit the copied file. Then your original file will be safe.

Good luck!

P.S. If you check spelling in Word, you can also do this in your unclean file. Then do 'Translate to Fuzzy'. Trados will stop in each segment where you have made a correction, and you have to accept each and every one of these segments manually. However, Word does this safely and it helps to keep your TM clean. You can try this sometime to see how it works.


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Marijke Singer  Identity Verified
United Kingdom
Local time: 21:59
Dutch to English
+ ...
What a lot of hidden information we all have! Apr 16, 2009

Margreet Logmans wrote:

I was still typing when Marijke posted, so this may be a bit of an echo of what she's saying...




No echo. We approached it from different angles!


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David Earl  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 14:59
Member (2007)
German to English
Make a copy? Apr 16, 2009

I add an extra step to the workflow. Once I'm done translating, I save the file and make a copy of it for backup purposes. Then, I clean the primary version. It helps in situations where Trados is unhelpful with formatting (such as when the end customer has abused the Normal style) or when the final translation needs to be adjusted to maintain the spacing used. By doing that, I can have both the cleaned/primary & uncleaned/backup open at the same time.

David.


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Sandra& Kenneth  Identity Verified
Israel
Local time: 23:59
Member (2009)
French to English
+ ...
Unclean your document Apr 17, 2009

I would suggest saving the unclean file in a special directory, for the possibility that you may need to restore it, should the TM become corrupted for some reason.

To "unclean" the file, take the original document received from the customer (even if you did not save it you probably still have it at least as an attachment in your email), and run it through Trados's Translate to Fuzzy. You should get an unclean file within minutes.
This assumes that your TM has been updated with your corrections, of course. Otherwise I don't think you can recover them other than by comparing the two output documents in Word using the Compare documents function and entering the changes manually.
HTH
Sandra

[Edited at 2009-04-17 11:49 GMT]


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David Jessop  Identity Verified
Spain
Member
Spanish to English
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
Thanks and help! Apr 17, 2009

Thank you to everyone´s detailed answers, they have been very helpful!

So now I am trying to hide the hidden text and am having troubles. I am using Word 2007 and my process is the following:

I Select All text. Then I click on Word Options on the Office Menu. I go to Display and uncheck Hidden Text under "Always shows these formatting marks on the screen."

It does nothing. Any ideas on what I am doing wrong?

Thanks again!

David


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mariale125
Local time: 16:59
English to Spanish
Use a shortcut Apr 17, 2009

Maybe the suggestions given here work for you

How to hide source text in Word 2007/Trados 2007:

http://www.proz.com/forum/sdl_trados_support/120697.html


HTH


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Marijke Singer  Identity Verified
United Kingdom
Local time: 21:59
Dutch to English
+ ...
What else is selected Apr 18, 2009

Have you also deselected Show all formatting marks? If it is still selected, hidden text will be shown. I always leave paragraph marks, spaces and tabs selected (the first 3 choices) and not the rest. Then you can see where the cursor is.

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David Jessop  Identity Verified
Spain
Member
Spanish to English
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
Confused still... Apr 18, 2009

mariale125 wrote:

Maybe the suggestions given here work for you

How to hide source text in Word 2007/Trados 2007:

http://www.proz.com/forum/sdl_trados_support/120697.html


HTH


Hi.

I have deselected Show all formatting marks as well as tried the advice in the link that Mariale125 provided but neither of these works. I will also try Sandra's advice since this approaches the issue from a totally different angle...

Thanks.

David


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