Trados doesn't open pre-translated segments
Thread poster: Lise Smidth

Lise Smidth  Identity Verified
Austria
Local time: 15:01
German to Danish
+ ...
Jul 19, 2004

Hi,

I am working on a word file which i pre-translated with my TM and now I want to change the translations in the fuzzy matches.
Unfortunately now Trados seems to be unable to open any segments in the word file.
I have tried working with and without "hidden text", the Trados-tags (marking the segments) seem to be ok. I tried "Fix document" - no results. I don't get any error message in the workbench.
The segments all have hard returns at the end and were pre-translated with Trados (apparently) without any problems - so maybe it's a problem with word???

I am working with Trados 6.5 and word xp

Thanks in advance for any advices

Lise


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Ralf Lemster  Identity Verified
Germany
Local time: 15:01
English to German
+ ...
Do you get the same problem when trying to work on the original file? Jul 19, 2004

Hi Lise,
Have you tried working with the source text only, i.e. without pretranslation?

(On a slightly different note, pre-translation is primarily designed to facilitate interaction with translators who don't have Trados. One major disadvantage of pre-translated documents is that a changed 100% match needs to be placed manually into the target segment.)

Best regards, Ralf


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Lise Smidth  Identity Verified
Austria
Local time: 15:01
German to Danish
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
well, yes, but that's not really a solution... Jul 19, 2004

Ralf Lemster wrote:

Hi Lise,
Have you tried working with the source text only, i.e. without pretranslation?

yes, that works fine - but is not really a satisfactory solution.


(On a slightly different note, pre-translation is primarily designed to facilitate interaction with translators who don't have Trados. One major disadvantage of pre-translated documents is that a changed 100% match needs to be placed manually into the target segment.)

Best regards, Ralf


I'm afraid I don't get your point? What do you mean by "placed manually into the target segment"?

I work in this way, which I found to be very efficient for my purposes:
When I get word-files with say 80% or even more segments with high matches from my TM I don't want to re-re-read the same translations over and over again.
I pretranslate the document with the TM using different colours for 100% and for Fuzzy matches (e.g. dark grey for the 100% matches and green, brown, blue or something else for the fuzzy matches).
When working in the Word file I can easily see, which sentences need to be changed - I only have to open the fuzzy matches and the sentences that weren't translated at all.
This saves me from re-reading the 100% matches and repetitions x times - I only read them in a final proofing to make sure everything is ok.

- But unfortunately there seems to be something fishy with the word file I'm working with just now and I didn't manage to find a solution yet....

Kind regards
Lise



[Edited at 2004-07-19 10:08]


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Ralf Lemster  Identity Verified
Germany
Local time: 15:01
English to German
+ ...
Translate to Fuzzy? Jul 19, 2004

Hi again,

(On a slightly different note, pre-translation is primarily designed to facilitate interaction with translators who don't have Trados. One major disadvantage of pre-translated documents is that a changed 100% match needs to be placed manually into the target segment.)

Best regards, Ralf


I'm afraid I don't get your point? What do you mean by "placed manually into the target segment"?

Let's assume you translated "My name is Lise." as "Mein Name ist Lise." before. Let's also assume that this sentence occurs numerous times in the document. Obviously, when pre-translating the document, this will be used.

Now you decide that you'd prefer "Ich heiße Lise" instead.

When working interactively, you only need to make the change once - Workbench will automatically place the new version. However, if the document was pre-translated, this won't happen, as Workbench will find a different target segment.

This saves me from re-reading the 100% matches and repetitions x times - I only read them in a final proofing to make sure everything is ok.


Have you tried using "Translate to Fuzzy"?

Best, Ralf


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Lise Smidth  Identity Verified
Austria
Local time: 15:01
German to Danish
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
Pre-translating a new document solved the problem Jul 19, 2004

Thanks for your comments.
Now I see what you mean.


Have you tried using "Translate to Fuzzy"?



yes of course, but when working in word files with complex formatting I find it too slow - I get impatient waiting for Trados opening coutless segments until I can start working again.
And I also encounter yet another problem while using this function: Very often Trados keeps opening the next segment event if it is a 100% match - but this is actually a minor problem.

I enden up making a new word file and pre-translated it again - and now everything seems to work fine. So I didn't find out what went wrong the first time, but at least I can now go on working

Sunny regards from Vienna 8)
Lise


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Stefan Keller  Identity Verified
Germany
Local time: 15:01
English to German
Is it a bug or a feature? Jul 19, 2004

Lise Smidth wrote:

Very often Trados keeps opening the next segment event if it is a 100% match - but this is actually a minor problem.


This is something which really annoys me too with Trados. My suspicion is that the concordance window is the perpetrator here. Far from being a minor issue in my view. I consider this a bug. Or is it a feature?)

Regards,
Stefan


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Ralf Lemster  Identity Verified
Germany
Local time: 15:01
English to German
+ ...
What exactly is the problem? Jul 20, 2004

Lise and Stefan, can you please provide more details?

Lise Smidth wrote:
Very often Trados keeps opening the next segment event if it is a 100% match - but this is actually a minor problem.

This referred to Translate to Fuzzy - opening the next segment if the current one is a 100% match is exactly what this function is supposed to do. I don't see your problem yet - can you describe it in more detail, please?

Stefan Keller wrote:
This is something which really annoys me too with Trados. My suspicion is that the concordance window is the perpetrator here. Far from being a minor issue in my view. I consider this a bug. Or is it a feature?)

Where do you see the connection to the Concordance function? Are you referring to the AutoConcordance function introduced with T6.x?

Thanks for providing some more details.

Best, Ralf


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Lise Smidth  Identity Verified
Austria
Local time: 15:01
German to Danish
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
seems to be a bug Jul 20, 2004

Ralf Lemster wrote:

Lise and Stefan, can you please provide more details?

This referred to Translate to Fuzzy - opening the next segment if the current one is a 100% match is exactly what this function is supposed to do. I don\'t see your problem yet - can you describe it in more detail, please?


I\'m afraid I\'m not able to provide more details really.
When translating a text with more 100% matches it more often than not happens, that the Translate to Fuzzy often seems not to recognize the 100% matches correctly. Trados simply opens the next 100% match segment as if I had used Set/Close Next Open/Get. It would open the next 3 or 4 segments like this, then handle the next 2 or 3 100% matches correctly (not waiting for me to accept the translation) and then again open yet another 100% match as if it was a fuzzy match.


Where do you see the connection to the Concordance function? Are you referring to the AutoConcordance function introduced with T6.x?



I am not sure - afaIk the AutoConcordance function is only supposed to get active in matches below the Minimum match value set in the Memory Options.
Stefan, I think it\'s a bug too - but it doesn\'t mean I can\'t work - it\'s just annoying.
But what can you do about it? It\'s not easy to solve, since the problem ist not easily reproduced....

kr
lise


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Stefan Keller  Identity Verified
Germany
Local time: 15:01
English to German
The Connection Jul 21, 2004

Hi Ralf,

Ralf Lemster wrote:

Where do you see the connection to the Concordance function? Are you referring to the AutoConcordance function introduced with T6.x?

Thanks for providing some more details.

Best, Ralf


Yes, in Trados 6.5, when you do a concordance search once and use Translate To Fuzzy afterwards without having manually closed the Concordance window, Workbench will open even 100% matches and will stop translating.

Regards,
Stefan


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Ralf Lemster  Identity Verified
Germany
Local time: 15:01
English to German
+ ...
Known issue Jul 21, 2004

Hi again, Stefan - thanks for raising this. I contacted Trados and got the following response from Daniel Brockmann (Product Manager Translation Tools):


this is a known issue, a side effect of the new AutoConcordance feature.

Rather than closing the Concordance window, it should be enough to click once anywhere into the TWB window (e.g. on the Source window), then back into Word/TE and try again.

TWB "thinks" Translate To Fuzzy has been interrupted, and this can be fixed by clicking once into the TWB window, then back into the editing environment.


HTH, Ralf


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