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Is it possible to translate in Adobe Pagemaker 6.5 without actually possessing the software?
Thread poster: Anneken

Anneken
Local time: 01:21
French to Dutch
+ ...
Apr 16, 2002

Dear all,



I have a huge translation project coming up, but the text is in an Adobe Pagemaker 6.5 and the customer refuses to copy and paste it into a Word document since it would take up too much time to reinsert the translation into the original format. Does anyone know whether it is possible to translate in this format, without actually having to buy the software?



Thank you for your help!!



Kind regards,



Anneken

[ This Message was edited by: on 2002-04-17 06:23 ]


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Jerzy Czopik  Identity Verified
Germany
Local time: 01:21
Member (2003)
Polish to German
+ ...
Perhaps yes Apr 16, 2002

As far as I know, only if you have TRADOS.

TRADOS has a tool called Story Collector for PageMaker. The problem is, this tool must be installed on the computer, where PageMaker is installed too. It means, your customer should have at least this tool, then he could give you exported PageMaker files, which you could translate using TAG-EDITOR from TRADOS package (it depends on TRADOS release - with TRADOS 3.0 you need an additional FilterPack, availlable on TRADOS web site for free download, and with TRADOS 5.0 or 5.5 you don\'t need any additional software).

I don\'t know any other possibility to translate PageMaker files. The situation with FrameMaker ist better - the FM files need only to be saved as *.MIF documents, and than you can translate them with TRADOS.

Perhaps can other CAT-tools offer an workout for translating PM-files without having PM on your computer, but I don\'t know the solution.

Should you need the links for downloading the TRADOS upgrades for free, so please contact me via my profile and I provide these links to you.



Perhaps you can get a copy of PM software from your customer. As far as I know it is legal if he has mor licences to lend one to you for the time you are working on his project. After that you must remove the software from your computer. But it\'s better than to refuse the job.



Regards

J. Czopik



PS

I have used this TRADOS tool many times - it works very good. It is far easier to work with extracted files as to overwrite text direct in PM. After importing the translated files into PM there is only a little work to do. But first of all - before you begin to export the stories from PM - check if the documents are formatted properly! You can save you a LOT of work. You should pay attention, if all paragraph have appropriate styles assigned and if ther are NO CARRIAGE RETURNS after the end of each line (that means, that after end of the line nobody should press the ENTER key). If there is something like this:

\"A line beginning [here is ENTER pressed]

and the text following\"

you get TWO TRANSLATION UNITS in TRADOS.

So check the text befor.

I know, it is not a good explanation because of my poor english, but if you need any further assistance, please don´t hesitate to contact me. I´ll try to explain this to you.

Regards

JC

[ This Message was edited by: on 2002-04-16 17:30 ]


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Roberta Anderson  Identity Verified
Italy
Local time: 01:21
Member (2001)
English to Italian
+ ...
No, you can't Apr 16, 2002

The time and effort required to export the text from PM and reimporting later really depends on the way the original document has been setup. If it has several unconnected \"stories\", then it would indeed be a big hassle; if it follows one main stream, with an intelligent and structured use of styles, then it\'s quite a straighforward task.



Trados might have something to extract the text from PM and then flow it back in, but I\'ve never done that. Maybe other colleagues have?

Roberta


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Dinorah Maria Tijerino-Acosta
Local time: 19:21
English to Spanish
+ ...
Sorry, but no Apr 16, 2002

I had a huge translation with Adobe PageMaker 6.5 and as you, the client refused to use MS Word, I tried in every possible way to transfer it to Word, but it was a hassle and it requiered too much work, due to the lay out of the document. I desisted and got the software. Sorry! I know it\'s not good news!

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Csaba Ban  Identity Verified
Hungary
Local time: 01:21
Member (2002)
English to Hungarian
+ ...
Deja Vu? Apr 16, 2002

If you have Deja Vu (www.atril.com), you have an option of creating a project with \"PageMaker tagged text\". I use DV often, but so far I have not done any PM files. But since the option is there, there should be a way of translating PM tagged text using DV.

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Jerzy Czopik  Identity Verified
Germany
Local time: 01:21
Member (2003)
Polish to German
+ ...
PM tagged text Apr 16, 2002

Quote:


On 2002-04-16 17:56, Ban Csaba wrote:

If you have Deja Vu (www.atril.com), you have an option of creating a project with \"PageMaker tagged text\". I use DV often, but so far I have not done any PM files. But since the option is there, there should be a way of translating PM tagged text using DV.





Well if it is so, there should be a tool for tagging PM-files. If such tool is not present, you can only translate files which are already tagged. There is no possibility to save a tagged text from PageMaker itself.

For example, using TRADOS to translate PM textes means exporting \"stories\" from PM and thus generating \"tagged files\", which can be processed with TRADOS. The reason is, that if you process any file with a CAT-tool the internal formatting options and other steering commands of the DTP-programm - so called TAGs - mut be protected from overwritting. If you remove or destroy TAGs, the text cannot be converted back to the original format.



Regards

JCzopik

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Trudy Peters  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 19:21
German to English
+ ...
Anneken, Apr 16, 2002

Would it be possible for the client to \"lend\" you the program for the duration of the job, if you promise to remove it from your computer when the translation is done?



I remember hearing once that this is \"legal.\"

But I may be wrong...



Trudy


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Ursula Peter-Czichi  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 19:21
German to English
+ ...
You can "lend" Adobe PageMaker for 30 days Apr 16, 2002

There!

http://www.adobe.com/products/tryadobe/main.html



It is a 30-day trial version.

Hope, you will make lots of money and consider(!) to buy the program.



HTH


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Jerzy Czopik  Identity Verified
Germany
Local time: 01:21
Member (2003)
Polish to German
+ ...
This is not the right way! Apr 17, 2002

I\'m sorry, but the trial version does not save any files, so it is useless, even working with some CAT tools.

Both TRADOS and DeJaVu have a possibility to export stories from PageMaker and translate them outside, what is far easier as overwritting in PageMaker itself. But both TRADOS and DeJaVu need PM installed on the same computer. So the only solutions I see are to lend PM from the customer for this particular project or to let the customer export stories with the apropriate CAT tool (for this your customer must have one of them - because both TRADOS and DeJaVu are dongle protected) or to buy PageMaker (the current version is the 7.0).

I\'m sorry, but I don\'t know any other possibility to work with PM.



Regards

JC


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Anneken
Local time: 01:21
French to Dutch
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
Thanks to you all!! Apr 17, 2002

Thank you very much for your suggestions!

The customer has finaly decided to deliver the files in PDF format, which I can import in Word through Wordfast. It will still mean some extra work, since I will have to put everything right before I can start translating with Trados, but this way I will be able to send the translated files back in Word format (and the customer will have to do the extra DTP-part to put the text back into the PDF file ).

Jerzy, a special word of gratitude to you... You seem to be well experienced in this field (and your English is not poor at all!! ). Since I have Trados and the customer has Pagemaker (of which they seem to have lost the original installation cd), we did not really find a solution in this. I hope I will be able to use your technique some day, but, for now, that would mean that I would have to buy Pagemaker, which is exactly what I was trying to avoid...



Kind regards,



Anneken


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Roberta Anderson  Identity Verified
Italy
Local time: 01:21
Member (2001)
English to Italian
+ ...
PageMaker Tagged Text Apr 17, 2002

Quote:


On 2002-04-16 18:34, JCzopik wrote:

Quote:


On 2002-04-16 17:56, Ban Csaba wrote:

If you have Deja Vu (www.atril.com), you have an option of creating a project with \"PageMaker tagged text\".




Well if it is so, there should be a tool for tagging PM-files. If such tool is not present, you can only translate files which are already tagged. There is no possibility to save a tagged text from PageMaker itself.





What I think DV means by \"PageMaker Tagged Text\" is the text format with which you can export PageMaker text, where each paragraph is preceded by its style tag.

This is a standard option in PM\'s export dialog box.

When the text is then placed back into PM with the Read Tags option selected in the Place dialog box, the style tags are read and the paragraphs get formatted with the matching style.



Roberta

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Jerzy Czopik  Identity Verified
Germany
Local time: 01:21
Member (2003)
Polish to German
+ ...
Tagged text Apr 17, 2002

Quote:


What I think DV means by \"PageMaker Tagged Text\" is the text format with which you can export PageMaker text, where each paragraph is preceded by its style tag.

This is a standard option in PM\'s export dialog box.

When the text is then placed back into PM with the Read Tags option selected in the Place dialog box, the style tags are read and the paragraphs get formatted with the matching style.



Roberta





You are quite right, it is the text export option from PageMaker. What I meant, was the \"save as\" option.

DeJaVu needs exported, tagged text from PM, without using an extra tool. So you need to export each particular story from each PM document - it is not easy, since as you mentioned the stories are not connected with each other.

Trados offers a special tool, which exports the stories for you - all at once! It is easier, because you don´t need to pay attentiion if all stories have been exported.

But nevertheless - you can work with the tagged text files without having PM actually on your PC. The problem is, that I can´t imagine somebody will do all the exporting and importing work for you. If he does so, then you´re lucky, otherwise you must buy PM...

The exporting and importing procedure using Trados Story Collector for Pagemaker works not bad, but not 100%. After importing there is some work to do - changing fonts to match the special foreign language (it´s Polish in my case, so PM cannot handle it properly without manual help).



But you are right - tagged text is a standard option for exporting text stories from PM.

There are better solutions as direct manual exporting text from PM - IMO.



Kind regards

J.Czopik

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Roberta Anderson  Identity Verified
Italy
Local time: 01:21
Member (2001)
English to Italian
+ ...
A little trick to export all unconnected stories from PM at once Apr 20, 2002

A little trick that not many people know about, but can sometimes be useful:



1. Open a new, empty PM file.

2. File > Place and select the file you need to export all the text from.

3. In the Story Importer dialog box, specify that you want to export all stories with more than 1 character.

4. Place the text in the PM file. It comes in all as 1 story.

5. Export the text from here, as 1 RTF or doc file.



Roberta


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