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Transit XV or Transit Satellite PE and multiple 100% matches
Thread poster: Jerzy Czopik

Jerzy Czopik  Identity Verified
Germany
Local time: 22:59
Member (2003)
Polish to German
+ ...
Jul 13, 2008

Is it possible to tell Transit, that I need multiple 100% matches?
And how to tell the program, that what I modified is not a modified translation for same segment, but a different one for the same segment?
When I work with Transit and mark a segment as translated (ALT+INS), Transit starts "translate to fuzzy" and does not ask me, if the matches in between do fit. Does Transit als know the command "set/close next open/get", or in other words a command to go to the next segment and show me the match, even if it is a 100% one, before it automatically uses it without asking for permission?

Thank you very much
Best regards
Jerzy


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Antoní­n Otáhal
Local time: 22:59
Member (2005)
English to Czech
+ ...
Referring to XV Jul 13, 2008

Hi Jerzy,

I cannot say which of the advice below is applicable to Transit PE since I have not opened it for years.


Is it possible to tell Transit, that I need multiple 100% matches?


This is the default


And how to tell the program, that what I modified is not a modified translation for same segment, but a different one for the same segment?


Again, this is default behaviour - on the other hand, you cannot have it the other way around - as long as a language pair with a translation of your sentence is included in the project, it is always taken as an option for translating it. If you do not want this translation to be used at all, you have to change it in its original position (or exclude the respective language pair from your project, if it is a reference pair).

If there are multiple translations of the same source, and your cursor is in the "fuzzy" window, hitting "numeric plus" sweeps through all 100% matches available for the same source.


or in other words a command to go to the next segment and show me the match, even if it is a 100% one, before it automatically uses it without asking for permission?


AFAIK, Transit never asks you about 100% matches. This is what Transit manual says:

In the project settings, you can specify how Transit carries out the pretranslation (see Section 4.5.14 "Pretranslation project setting - quality and translation extract").

Independent of these project settings, the following basic rules always apply:

Segments that are identical in the reference material are automatically pretranslated.

When Transit finds a source-language segment in the reference material that exactly matches the segment to be translated, the segment is automatically translated.

Whether Transit also translates such segments if there are several translation versions in the reference material, depends on your project settings (see Section 4.5.14 "Pretranslation project setting - quality and translation extract").


I have never found it a real problem - I mean, in situations in which variants of translation do exist, the last-mentioned setting could be applied - that is, you can forbid the pretranslation of 100% matches if there are multiple translations.

HTH
Antonin


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Jerzy Czopik  Identity Verified
Germany
Local time: 22:59
Member (2003)
Polish to German
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
Thanks Jul 13, 2008

Thank you very much - I found the setting in my profile.
My proble is, that I never do create projects with Transit.
What I do is translating projects setu up by my clients. Usually I do that in Satellite by exporting the files to Word with Arkady Vysotsky's macro and translating them with Trados.
However, for my current project I need to use full version of Transit (Satellite won't work for that) and I cannot use the macro, as it destroys codes...
So I'm forced to work with Transit and thus to learn more about it.

Thanks for your help
Best regards
Jerzy


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Antoní­n Otáhal
Local time: 22:59
Member (2005)
English to Czech
+ ...
Good luck then Jul 13, 2008

In a similar situation a few years ago, I had to learn about Transit and was able to fully appreciate all its advantages.

Might as well happen to you...

Antonin


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Jerzy Czopik  Identity Verified
Germany
Local time: 22:59
Member (2003)
Polish to German
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
Does not look so Jul 13, 2008

Antoní­n Otáhal wrote:

In a similar situation a few years ago, I had to learn about Transit and was able to fully appreciate all its advantages.

Might as well happen to you...

Antonin


Not really, I see to many points, where Transit does not work intuitive for me.
This is really a personal thing - this does not mean at all, Transit is not intuitive (or intuitive), but just that I do not find it intuitive for me

Thanks again and happy translating
Jerzy


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xxxBrandis
Local time: 22:59
English to German
+ ...
why not stick to trados... Jul 13, 2008

Hallo Jerzy, when you are so good in trados, try everything in trados, I am sure there are certainly other tools like Déjà Vu as well, that do not precisely demarcate issues as you pose them. I would rather be a professional in one area and not look around. BR Brandis

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Katalin Horváth McClure  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 16:59
Member (2002)
English to Hungarian
+ ...
You can disable the automatic translation of 100% matches Jul 13, 2008

Jerzy Czopik wrote:


When I work with Transit and mark a segment as translated (ALT+INS), Transit starts "translate to fuzzy" and does not ask me, if the matches in between do fit. Does Transit als know the command "set/close next open/get", or in other words a command to go to the next segment and show me the match, even if it is a 100% one, before it automatically uses it without asking for permission?


Yes, it is possible.
Go to Options -> Profile settings -> Fuzzy Index
There you will find the checkboxes to do exactly what you want. The bottom textbox gives you an explanation for each option.
From your question, I guess you need to Disable (uncheck) "Translate 100% matches automatically".
Or, if you only want to stop where multiple 100% matches exist, you Enable (check) "Translate 100% matches automatically", and also Enable (check) "No automatic replacement if variants exists".

By the way, the first time, I had to use Transit for a client I was getting the goosebumps, too, and thought it would be difficult to get used to it, having used Trados for so many years and got used to it. However, I must tell you, within a couple of days I was just as productive with it as I was before with Trados.
I am pretty sure you will find it yourself, too.
I have to admit, that while working on this client's projects, I revisited my opinion about Trados vs. Transit.
I honestly wish, more of my clients would pick Transit as their tool, especially those that handle large size (100,000+ words) projects. Especially for those, Transit seems to be far better, than Trados. The dictionary part of Transit is outstanding. I have yet to come across a CAT tool that offers the same simplicity for word input, the same quick and accurate word matching and ease of inserting the offered entry as Transit.

I know that the topic is not about this, and I don't want to start a sidetrack discussion, I am just telling you this Jerzy, because I had the exact same feelings at the beginning as you do, but at the end, I was happy with the tool. So, hang in there, try to have an open mind, and you may be surprised of the outcome.


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Jerzy Czopik  Identity Verified
Germany
Local time: 22:59
Member (2003)
Polish to German
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
Trados is not an option here Jul 13, 2008

Brandis wrote:

Hallo Jerzy, when you are so good in trados, try everything in trados, I am sure there are certainly other tools like Déjà Vu as well, that do not precisely demarcate issues as you pose them. I would rather be a professional in one area and not look around. BR Brandis


What you say, is what I would do, when it would be feasible.
But you, as many many users here, seem to forget, that there is no 100% compatbility between the tools. Sometimes you can get things to work compatible without any loss for the customer, so than the processes are nearly compatible. In this case changing the tool would damage customers work - and this is the last thing I would like to do. So by all devotion to Trados, it is not an option here. And believe me, my customer and me did check this thoroughly.


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Vito Smolej
Germany
Local time: 22:59
Member (2004)
English to Slovenian
+ ...
"xact same feelings at the beginning as you do, but at the end, I was happy with the tool." Jul 13, 2008

+

"If women could be more like men":

meaning in the current context "If TRANSIT keyboard shortcuts could be more like TRADOS' "
vito


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Jerzy Czopik  Identity Verified
Germany
Local time: 22:59
Member (2003)
Polish to German
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
Different feeling about things you write Jul 13, 2008

Katalin Horvath McClure wrote:
...
By the way, the first time, I had to use Transit for a client I was getting the goosebumps, too, and thought it would be difficult to get used to it, having used Trados for so many years and got used to it. However, I must tell you, within a couple of days I was just as productive with it as I was before with Trados.
I am pretty sure you will find it yourself, too.
I have to admit, that while working on this client's projects, I revisited my opinion about Trados vs. Transit.
I honestly wish, more of my clients would pick Transit as their tool, especially those that handle large size (100,000+ words) projects. Especially for those, Transit seems to be far better, than Trados. The dictionary part of Transit is outstanding. I have yet to come across a CAT tool that offers the same simplicity for word input, the same quick and accurate word matching and ease of inserting the offered entry as Transit.

I know that the topic is not about this, and I don't want to start a sidetrack discussion, I am just telling you this Jerzy, because I had the exact same feelings at the beginning as you do, but at the end, I was happy with the tool. So, hang in there, try to have an open mind, and you may be surprised of the outcome.



I did find the setting - thanks. Still, what I miss in Transit is going through the translation sentence by sentence (segment by segment), as I would do this in Trados, using the function "set/close next open/get", means simply marking the current segment as translated and moving to the next segment, stopping there regardless of match value found.

As for the dictionary - how do you see, that there are synonyms in the dictionary? When I see a word marked red (in my layout red words are in the dictionary), I press ALT+T and the word is inserted. However, a lot of customers (or in fact our fellow translators) have the habit to enter words in dictionary in their declensed form, sometimes even starting with capital letter. This disturbs a lot (I'm working with Polish, so this makes things a bit more complicated than western languages). And what when the dictionary does contain a wrong word? I have to edit in the dictionary I assume. This would be fine, but in this particular project the dictionary somehow does not appear to be accessible for editing. It is working, words can be entered, but not edited.
You also mention the ease how words can be added into Transits dictionary. Do you know, that nearly the same method is possible in Tados? Here you have to select the words, than click a button. In Trados this is only one operation more - copy the target word into the clipboard, than select the source word and press the corresponding button. Not a difference of that dimension one would assume after reading your posting... And on top, you can add words to Multiterm in Trados from all places - editor, Workbench and concordance search.
Also the function for enlarging or shrinking segments is not that good in Transit - you have to do a lot more operations for that as I need in Trados.

Another question: can I influence the segmentation rules in Transit? By default it does segment after semicolon, and no one (among my customers) seems to pay attention to that, so files I get are sometimes horrible segmented...

Thanks for your inputs - I would like to enlarge this topic to some kind "Transit manual for a lost Trados user"

Best regards
Jerzy


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Jerzy Czopik  Identity Verified
Germany
Local time: 22:59
Member (2003)
Polish to German
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
Another question than Jul 13, 2008

Is it possible to check spelling when I write?
I mean not at the end, when all is already written, but when moving from segment to segment.
For now I have only found the possibility of spellchecking as global option.


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xxxBrandis
Local time: 22:59
English to German
+ ...
@jerzy.. Jul 13, 2008

Hi! I do not thing it is all that problematic. Few years ago I had done large localisation projects in environment technology for Transit HU, it was done in Trados. I come from Trados Walhallah and donot need much ad here, that project was regulated. If you needed cross-bridging TM communication or TM conversions just post in transit forums there are also other wizards there that may be willing to help. Initially I would suggest that you study the transit product. TMX today is a cross-platform portable solution and almost most products offer this facility. If you wish to opt then go for XV and not PE, there is a great difference here. When I am with trados I will not look around, well certainly not transit. BR Brandis

[Edited at 2008-07-13 18:59]

[Edited at 2008-07-13 19:07]


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Antoní­n Otáhal
Local time: 22:59
Member (2005)
English to Czech
+ ...
Segment spellcheck Jul 13, 2008

Transit macro: <SHIFT_CTRL_F10><s> runs spellcheck of the current segment (What Transit version do you have, btw? I know that Smart can run them and Pro can create them.)

Other questions of yours: quite a few answers can be found in the manual, as usual.


Coming to some of them:

Of course, you can influence the segmentation (Project-Settings-Segmentation)

Alt+Shift+T enters a dictionary entry starting with a capital latter as starting with a lower-case (and vice versa).

Multiple translations of the same term in the dictionary can be seen in the dictionary window. In the manual, there are shortcuts for choosing among them.

Antonin


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Jerzy Czopik  Identity Verified
Germany
Local time: 22:59
Member (2003)
Polish to German
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
RTFM - of course Jul 13, 2008

This is what I will probably do, when this projects keep continuing.
This is the first big project I am forced to do with Transit since long time. Until now I always used Satellite and my way round it with the macro from Arkady.
Now here this is not an option, neither is anything else an option. The customer does use the complete Star tools palette, so I have to stick to Transit.

The version I use in the moment is Transit XV Workstation 3.1 SP 23 Build 655.1
If the project continues, I will surely work more with Transit.

Thanks for your kind advices and having mercy with me, not forcing me to read the manual now.

Jerzy


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Jerzy Czopik  Identity Verified
Germany
Local time: 22:59
Member (2003)
Polish to German
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
Sorry - another question Jul 13, 2008

Somehow the dictionary in my project will not work properly.
So I decided to receive the project once again, deleting the dictionary.
But I do not find where to delete it completly...


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