| Pages in topic: < [1 2 3 4 5 6] > | The impact of touch typing on words per day productivty Thread poster: John Moran
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Graeme Walle (X) 
Finland
Local time: 03:04
Finnish to English
+ ...
| yes; well worth the tedium | Jan 19, 2014 |
I spent over 25 years of my professional life using the hunt and peck method and never really got down to learning typing systematically. I only really started to learn properly about seven years ago (around 30 minutes a day, which was all I could spare). It is definitely something I wish I had learned earlier. My speed is not great and I have a few keys left to learn but it definitely helps in the translation process. One can concentrate on content rather than on your typing.
Becau... See more I spent over 25 years of my professional life using the hunt and peck method and never really got down to learning typing systematically. I only really started to learn properly about seven years ago (around 30 minutes a day, which was all I could spare). It is definitely something I wish I had learned earlier. My speed is not great and I have a few keys left to learn but it definitely helps in the translation process. One can concentrate on content rather than on your typing.
Because it will take me a few more years to get to the speed I desire, I have started using Dragon as well. However, the programme is by no means perfect and it is also good to have a fallback position if your microphone goes bust or something. Dragon is usually reasonable for dictation but requires a lot of training the software, especially if you have a west Scottish accent like mine.
Also you have to be a very careful proofreader. Yesterday I was trying to dictate " tended green areas". It came out as "tended clean idiots"!
I do not think the client would have been amused is that had remained in the text
Graeme ▲ Collapse
| | | | Mark Benson (X)
English to Swedish
+ ...
| Doesn't have to matter | Jan 19, 2014 |
Tom in London wrote: Emma Goldsmith wrote:s
Go for it!
OK I'll have another go because if there's one thing that would improve my efficiency it would be touch typing. Just typing this message involved a great deal of backtracking to correct my typing errors. And a lot of looking up and down. Ouch - my neck ! Is there a good website that will help me to learn touch typing with an Italian keyboard? [Edited at 2014-01-19 10:40 GMT]
There are two aspects that you coordinate when you learn this. One is how you move your fingers. The other is how signs are associated with the keys.
Thanks to learning how to touch type you can get a split keyboard or make use of other ergonomics.
It doesn't matter if you or your software use an Italian layout. You can learn to touch type on any keyboard, at least initially as you only type the letters.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Keyboard_layout
About the question, I don't know how touch typing has affected my productivity. I type about 80 words per minute and it's been that way for ages. The question is rather if typing faster would improve my productivity. I doubt it, but it's been years now that I'm considering getting a split keyboard to see if that might help.
I think using commands and keyboard shortcuts are fundamental to my productivity. I'm not so sure about the touch typing, because I keep noticing that others who use a keyboard professionally, as it were, are quite high-speed in their own right, even though not touch typing.
| | | | Tom in London
United Kingdom
Local time: 01:04
Member (2008)
Italian to English
| It should be easy for me..... | Jan 19, 2014 |
...because I'm a pianist and I don't look at the piano keys !
| | | | Tom in London
United Kingdom
Local time: 01:04
Member (2008)
Italian to English
FarkasAndras wrote: Jenny Forbes wrote:
Well worth the tedium, I'd say. Fully agree. And it doesn't even have to be that tedious. You just read up a bit on the basic technique and start practicing with games like this one: http://www.typingmaster.com/individuals/bubbles.asp and this one: http://www.shockwave.com/gamelanding/typershark.jsp and doing timed typing tests on sites like this one: http://play.typeracer.com/ ... and you'll eventually get the hang of it. I was a 30-40wpm hunt and peck typist and got up to 70-80 wpm touch typing this way quite easily. Of course you can also take a course or follow a programme of some sort but those are bound to bore the pants off you.
Hey - I can have FUN !
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| If it doesn't work, don't despair | Jan 19, 2014 |
I gave up on touch typing more than forty years ago, having already given up on musical instruments - I'm left handed and don't have the coordination. Danish has three extra letters for my very weakest finger, at the right of the keyboard, although I don't use those so much when translating into English.
I still do the best approximation I can, and take advantage of the predictive function - AutoSuggest - with my CAT. I have always used term recognition creatively, adding my worst t... See more I gave up on touch typing more than forty years ago, having already given up on musical instruments - I'm left handed and don't have the coordination. Danish has three extra letters for my very weakest finger, at the right of the keyboard, although I don't use those so much when translating into English.
I still do the best approximation I can, and take advantage of the predictive function - AutoSuggest - with my CAT. I have always used term recognition creatively, adding my worst typos, correctly spelled... to avoid COtober and the like. Likewise AutoCorrect in Word.
I used to find Trados Workbench a hindrance to my efforts, because of the short cut to move from segment to segment, which involved moving over to the number keyboard and losing contact with the home keys every time. This has been addressed in the Studio versions.
I would definitely learn to touch type faster and better if I could, but it need not be a hindrance to translating - you just translate in your head first and then type afterwards. But it does call for careful proofreading and concentration when runing the spell checker, to catch all the typos...
Only to add that it would be worth a a try at touch typing - which is undoubtedly useful in all sorts of other contexts in life anyway. ▲ Collapse
| | | | Emma Goldsmith
Spain
Local time: 02:04
Member (2004)
Spanish to English
| Warning for pianists | Jan 19, 2014 |
Tom in London wrote:
...because I'm a pianist and I don't look at the piano keys !
Sorry to hear you're a pianist, Tom, because actually one of the hardest things I find is to come away from the piano and start typing. As soon as my fingers move up to the top row I have this weird problem when I need to use q, w, e, r, t or y but can only picture piano black keys in my mind.
Luckily this only happens if I switch straight from the piano to the computer (or vice versa!), but not if I have a 10-minute break.
It's very strange because I'm normally quite good at doing two things at once. If someone walks into the room when I'm working, I can finish off writing the sentence I'm in the middle of while looking at the other person and listening to what they're saying!
[Edited at 2014-01-19 12:16 GMT]
| | | | John Moran
Ireland
Local time: 01:04
German to English
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER | My observations so far | Jan 19, 2014 |
A few years ago I asked the head of a well-established translation school in Copenhagen who is also an expert in translation process research using software that records keystrokes why touch-typing was not taught to trainee translators in his institute. His answer was that it was in the past but it went out of fashion. Translators didn't want to be thought of as a "bilingual secretary". In fact I am unaware of any third-level translator training school in Europe that teaches touch typing. I can'... See more A few years ago I asked the head of a well-established translation school in Copenhagen who is also an expert in translation process research using software that records keystrokes why touch-typing was not taught to trainee translators in his institute. His answer was that it was in the past but it went out of fashion. Translators didn't want to be thought of as a "bilingual secretary". In fact I am unaware of any third-level translator training school in Europe that teaches touch typing. I can't help wondering how many Euros this fashion change cost their students over their working lifetime.
In a similar conversation with a former operations manager at an agency in Ireland with many in-house translators he told me they recorded per day productivity as a matter of course and once they also ran a test to measure typing speed for their in-house translators to see if teaching touch-typing would be worth the training investment. They could not find a correlation so they concluded that teaching touch typing would not help.
My feeling is that experience on an account or years of translation experience would mask the effect of touch typing on productivity across the translators in the office. A better approach would have been to teach a few volunteers to touch type and measure their daily word count before and a few months after in the intervention on a regular account.
ASR (Dragon Dictate) and predictive typing technology like autosuggest/muses are interesting. I gather from talking to many translators about these technologies that they can make a big difference. A number of translators I know break the 4,000 words per day barrier using them.
However, all these technologies do is reduce the number of keystrokes a translator types per day so I suspect being able to touch type will remain an advantage for the time being. ▲ Collapse
| | | | John Moran
Ireland
Local time: 01:04
German to English
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER | Using games to learn touch typing | Jan 19, 2014 |
FarkasAndras wrote:
I was a 30-40wpm hunt and peck typist and got up to 70-80 wpm touch typing this way quite easily. Of course you can also take a course or follow a programme of some sort but those are bound to bore the pants off you.
Can you give us an idea of how long this took you to achieve?
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| Touch typing makes it harder to type in more than one language, | Jan 19, 2014 |
in my experience. I can only type fast in English. Although I can write in Russian, Polish and some other languages without any problem, I type very slowly using the Cyrillic. After I type for half an hour, or so, my typing in English becomes temporarily affected, that's why I try not to type in other languages at all. I cannot type properly in Polish at all because I have never learned and there are various dicritics there, which require the use of multiple keys.
[Edited at 2014-01-... See more in my experience. I can only type fast in English. Although I can write in Russian, Polish and some other languages without any problem, I type very slowly using the Cyrillic. After I type for half an hour, or so, my typing in English becomes temporarily affected, that's why I try not to type in other languages at all. I cannot type properly in Polish at all because I have never learned and there are various dicritics there, which require the use of multiple keys.
[Edited at 2014-01-19 13:24 GMT] ▲ Collapse
| | | | Mark Benson (X)
English to Swedish
+ ...
| Better options than games | Jan 19, 2014 |
Even if you're going to translate 500 words per hour, that's not even 10 words you would be typing per minute.
I have a much better suggestion than downloading games etc. in that case: Learn the principles that govern how you should be moving your fingers on the keyboard, and try to apply them inasmuch as possible. That's it.
The basic principle is really very simple. The thumbs are on the space key while the other four fingers on both hands are placed one per key with ... See more Even if you're going to translate 500 words per hour, that's not even 10 words you would be typing per minute.
I have a much better suggestion than downloading games etc. in that case: Learn the principles that govern how you should be moving your fingers on the keyboard, and try to apply them inasmuch as possible. That's it.
The basic principle is really very simple. The thumbs are on the space key while the other four fingers on both hands are placed one per key with the pointing fingers placed on the keys that have small marks on them, which you can feel clearly. Notice that you can move each finger one step up or one step down to reach other keys.
I'll stop there. I'm sure someone else is better at explaining and teaching this. Besides, I have work to do! But it should be noted that just studying the theory behind touch typing can lead to hours and hours of 'practice' every day, even if it's of a different nature than the kind you do with games.
Just keeping it in mind as you work should be sufficient in order to have any possible improvements in productivity per day. I think that those who are reaching >4,000 words per day, do so not least with the help of CAT tools, but please correct me if I'm wrong! ▲ Collapse
| | | | John Moran
Ireland
Local time: 01:04
German to English
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER | Slightly off topic | Jan 19, 2014 |
Mark Benson wrote:
Just keeping it in mind as you work should be sufficient in order to have any possible improvements in productivity per day. I think that those who are reaching >4,000 words per day, do so not least with the help of CAT tools, but please correct me if I'm wrong!
The >4000 number does not account for translation memory matches. It is what would some people would called the leveraged word count.
From speaking to other translators who are sophisticated users of Trados or MemoQ, where autosuggest or muses are used heavily in a CAT tool >4000 words per day is easier to achieve. The problem is that most translators do not take the time to manually add terms and phrases to their dictionary. They get too many false positives from the statistically generated list of proposals so the technology seems to be an annoyance. Also, it takes a while to see a benefit from the manual approach. It might take over a year but according to anecdotal evidence a doubling of throughput is possible. Logically the technique works best on very technical text on a regular account or if you are very specialized in a particular domain. That is my analysis anyway. I think this might be a good subject for another discussion.
| | | | | Worthwhile in my experience | Jan 19, 2014 |
I am lucky that touch typing was taught in high school. We even had blank keys on some of the typewriters (and yes - they were literally typewriters in the late 1960's, early 70's). On average, if I were to speak the words that I write, I would sound like somebody talking rather slowly. When I translate ordinary, simpler text, then my eyes are on the French or German text, and my fingers are typing out English words at about the same speed as if I were copying English text. I can't imagine l... See more I am lucky that touch typing was taught in high school. We even had blank keys on some of the typewriters (and yes - they were literally typewriters in the late 1960's, early 70's). On average, if I were to speak the words that I write, I would sound like somebody talking rather slowly. When I translate ordinary, simpler text, then my eyes are on the French or German text, and my fingers are typing out English words at about the same speed as if I were copying English text. I can't imagine looking back and forth being as fast.
You do want to be careful to have your copy (paper, or a second monitor) well placed, because you will be in the same position for a long time without needing to move your head. Poor alignment will create posture problems in the long run, and a cramped neck or headache. ▲ Collapse
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Erik Freitag
Germany
Local time: 02:04
Member (2006)
Dutch to German
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| Piano? No problems here | Jan 19, 2014 |
Emma Goldsmith wrote: Tom in London wrote:
...because I'm a pianist and I don't look at the piano keys ! Sorry to hear you're a pianist, Tom, because actually one of the hardest things I find is to come away from the piano and start typing. As soon as my fingers move up to the top row I have this weird problem when I need to use q, w, e, r, t or y but can only picture piano black keys in my mind. Luckily this only happens if I switch straight from the piano to the computer (or vice versa!), but not if I have a 10-minute break.
This sounds strange! I'm not experiencing this kind of problems at all, even directly after spending two or three hours playing the piano, typing doesn't feel any different for me.
I'm touch typing as well, but with my own system developed unconsciously during the years. I'm pretty fast and accurate, but usually not much faster than I can think while I'm translating. I can't imagine translating if I had to wait for my fingers.
So I'd say yes: Touch typing will improve your productivity drastically, unless you're translating slowly anyway.
[Bearbeitet am 2014-01-20 08:28 GMT]
| | | | Mark Benson (X)
English to Swedish
+ ...
| Not at all 'off topic' | Jan 20, 2014 |
John Moran wrote: Mark Benson wrote:
Just keeping it in mind as you work should be sufficient in order to have any possible improvements in productivity per day. I think that those who are reaching >4,000 words per day, do so not least with the help of CAT tools, but please correct me if I'm wrong! The >4000 number does not account for translation memory matches. It is what would some people would called the leveraged word count. From speaking to other translators who are sophisticated users of Trados or MemoQ, where autosuggest or muses are used heavily in a CAT tool >4000 words per day is easier to achieve. The problem is that most translators do not take the time to manually add terms and phrases to their dictionary. They get too many false positives from the statistically generated list of proposals so the technology seems to be an annoyance. Also, it takes a while to see a benefit from the manual approach. It might take over a year but according to anecdotal evidence a doubling of throughput is possible. Logically the technique works best on very technical text on a regular account or if you are very specialized in a particular domain. That is my analysis anyway. I think this might be a good subject for another discussion.
You simply missed my point. I was just saying that if you're wondering how you reach 4,000 (leveraged if you will) words per day, please don't think that it has anything to do with touch typing or typing speed! That was all and sorry if that wasn't clear!
I can type 4,000 words in less than 1 hour. I'm presently looking into auto-correction software to increase my speed, but also comfort. Obviously, this is by no means necessary. I am just working in the way that I find most comfortable and desirable personally.
And I mean, if it takes less than 10 words per minute to type 4,000 words in an 8 hour day, and that's what you need, then what exactly would you need to learn touch typing for? I think it's very difficult for most people who are otherwise capable of using a computer to type that slow.
So that's what it is more than anything at the end of the day; just a matter of personal taste and convenience. And obviously, if you can touch type, you get any typing you need to do done quicker. But I understand there's speech recognition software that's capable of reducing any typing to a bare minimum.
In conclusion I think that anybody who feels like this should go for it; it's easy and takes very, very little time to learn and even become good at.
I decided to learn when I was in high school, because I noticed that I was writing a lot on the computer at the time and expected to continue doing so. So I started practicing with some software a friend passed on to me on a CD-R.
I now consistently type at no less than 80 in periods when I'm not typing so much, and up above 90 if I'm really typing a lot, and it's been like this forever.
How long did it take for me to reach this level? I honestly don't know, but not too long.
Like I mentioned before, learning the principles, how to move your fingers on the keyboard and where each letter is, depending on your layout, that's the big thing to take in. I would say that after about a year of continuing to go back to my mental map of what it's actually about (finger movements + keyboard layouts), things changed to what it's like today, and has been forever as it seems - the keyboard is, for my use, just an extension of my fingers.
One way of practicing that I have used is to 'type in my head', simply by imagining the sequence of keys and how I would have to move my fingers in order to complete it.
| | | | John Moran
Ireland
Local time: 01:04
German to English
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER | Thanks for the clarification | Jan 20, 2014 |
Thanks for clarifying Tom. I see what you are saying. It makes a lot of sense. To take myself as an example, I normally translate around 2,500 words per day in around five hours of active translation. I type at between 50 and 60 words per minute (WPM) so presumably touch typing at 90 WPM would only make a fractional difference to my per day earnings as I am typing at 20% of my full speed on average when I translate. Conversely, the slowdown prior to 80 WPM touch-typing mastery might only impact ... See more Thanks for clarifying Tom. I see what you are saying. It makes a lot of sense. To take myself as an example, I normally translate around 2,500 words per day in around five hours of active translation. I type at between 50 and 60 words per minute (WPM) so presumably touch typing at 90 WPM would only make a fractional difference to my per day earnings as I am typing at 20% of my full speed on average when I translate. Conversely, the slowdown prior to 80 WPM touch-typing mastery might only impact fractionally too though. However, small numbers can accumulate over time.
Numerically, we don't know what difference touch typing makes on words per day productivity so lets postulate on the basis of round numbers. Some people in this discussion who can touch type feel it is an aid to productivity. Let's start with +100 words per day and assume I earn €.10 per word.
Over the course of a year with 200 working days the difference is €2,000. That is a holiday. Over a working lifetime, say 50 years, that is the price of a small holiday home. This assumes, of course, that I didn't take that holiday - which is a hell of an assumption.
My agenda here is that where I work, a research institute in Ireland called the Centre for Next Generation Localisation, we have developed a piece of software called iOmegaT that can record User Activity Data including keystroke data in OmegaT. It works well on live translation projects. Think of it as software that can replay how you typed a translation and you will get the picture.
I would really like to use our software to build a case for bringing touch-typing back into translator education. Some of our industrial partners are translation companies so I plan to pitch it to them. ▲ Collapse
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