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Is Trados a vital tool for translating?
Thread poster: Austy
Austy
English to Spanish
Aug 6, 2002

--What\'s your experience with Trados?

--Is Trados required more often than not?

--Does Trados help, or does it hinder your translating?

--How does Trados compare to its competing products? Better? Same? Worst?

--Are there discounted prices available for Trados?



--How do you express your happiness?



__Austy__


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Ralf Lemster  Identity Verified
Germany
Local time: 01:51
English to German
+ ...
Check the "Comparison Shopping" forum... Aug 6, 2002

...there have been quite a lot of threads dealing with your questions.

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Maria Eugenia Farre  Identity Verified
Brazil
Local time: 20:51
English to Portuguese
+ ...
Trados vs CAT Tools Aug 6, 2002

I wouldn\'t say that Trados is essential for translators, but I would prefer somebody shot me in the head to living without a CAT tool.







ME

[ This Message was edited by: on 2002-08-06 12:49 ]


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CLS Lexi-tech
Local time: 19:51
Member (2004)
English to Italian
+ ...
totally agree with Maria Eugenia Aug 7, 2002





paola l m



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Hans-Henning Judek  Identity Verified
Local time: 08:51
German to English
+ ...
Shop around Aug 7, 2002

Trados is quite unhandy, though it became just by market power the \"standard\" for CATs. In the meantime there are quite a lot of more reasonable CAT tools on the market, which are discussed at the CAT tool center of PROZ.



I personally use SDLX and it does everything I need at a fraction of TRADOS prices, while maintaining compatibility (I can export and import TRADOS TMs without problems).



Just forgot soemething: CAT tools have two sides - on one hand they facilitate your work, but on the other hand are customers and agencies using this argument to push down prices. FOr car service manuals, for example, you get 100% translation price only for completely new translations and less for full and partly \"hits\".



In the long you will not get around purchasing a CAT tool, but you definitely don\'t have to churn out hundreds of dollars for TRADOS.

[ This Message was edited by: on 2002-08-07 02:13 ]


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Tudor Soiman  Identity Verified
Local time: 02:51
Member (2005)
English to Romanian
+ ...
no Aug 7, 2002

try Deja Vu or Wordfast (this one works diretly in Word, and what\'s more, it\'s still free)

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Mario Cerutti  Identity Verified
Japan
Local time: 08:51
Italian to Japanese
+ ...
Nor Trados nor others Aug 8, 2002

I think CAT - any CAT - is the super killer of the writing style. When you make a translation using Trados, Wordfast, Deja Vu and other similar programs, therefore concentrating on a single sentence at the time, at the end you often realize that all sentences do not tie up together well. Then, if you really want to make a good translation (even technical ones, althouh very often technical translations are completely negletted a reasonable writing style), you have to go back and revise these sentences so that they flow more naturally. This takes the time that you were expected to save with CAT tools. One more nonsense is that what is really needed is word consistency, not sentence consistency, and CAT tools provide the latter one only. Then you need to be sure that the original text is written by a real mother tongue (and this is often not the case), otherwise the following updates do not match well. Finally, you have to pray that the original translator has done a good translation job, because nobody will let you modify the translation memory you have to refer to instead.



I was forced to buy Trados by a translation agency, but they do not know how to handle it well. Then I started to use it on my own just to see whether there was any way to retrieve such amount of money I spent. Well, I found two: first, I do not risk anymore to skip sentences, as CAT tools serve you sentences for translation one by one in their original order. Second, I can keep the original format of the source text, without wasting time on it. To achieve these benefits Wordfast, which is free, is more than enough.



I do hope that newer CAT tools be developped to help more the translators\' job. We translators do not care if those companies are spending billions of dollars to be first in the market; we do not want to be their sponsors!



Mario Cerutti
[addsig]


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Ralf Lemster  Identity Verified
Germany
Local time: 01:51
English to German
+ ...
Response to Mario Aug 8, 2002

With all due respect, but I think you\'re missing a few vital points here. I\'m using Trados, therefore my remarks refer to Trados only.



Quote:


On 2002-08-08 00:54, aliseo wrote:

I think CAT - any CAT - is the super killer of the writing style. When you make a translation using Trados, Wordfast, Deja Vu and other similar programs, therefore concentrating on a single sentence at the time, at the end you often realize that all sentences do not tie up together well.

Then, if you really want to make a good translation (even technical ones, althouh very often technical translations are completely negletted a reasonable writing style), you have to go back and revise these sentences so that they flow more naturally. This takes the time that you were expected to save with CAT tools.



It\'s possible (and simple) to adjust the sentence structure while translating.



Quote:
One more nonsense is that what is really needed is word consistency, not sentence consistency, and CAT tools provide the latter one only.



Looks like you haven\'t used the \'Concordance\' function that lets you retrieve phrases from your memory - IMO that function is the strongest benefit.



[quote]

Then you need to be sure that the original text is written by a real mother tongue (and this is often not the case), otherwise the following updates do not match well.

[/update]

True to a point, but good CAT tools have fuzzy search capabilities and are thus able to retrieve previous translations even if there is no perfect match.



Quote:
Finally, you have to pray that the original translator has done a good translation job, because nobody will let you modify the translation memory you have to refer to instead.



Now that would be a problem of the people handling things rather than a generic CAT issue - I fully expect translators to check if a previous translation still fits the context, and to make changes as appropriate.





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Mario Cerutti  Identity Verified
Japan
Local time: 08:51
Italian to Japanese
+ ...
Reply to Ralf who replied to Mario (myself) Aug 8, 2002

I see your points. However, to do all you said takes time and this ends up undoing the time you are expected to save with CAT tools. For instance, for technical translations as well I find myself much more confortable with a good (and fast) text searching utility, which can display in a fraction of time all the sentences that contain the desired key words.



However I did not say that CAT tools should be avoided entirely; I just meant that they are still too expensive and \"stupid\" compared to what they can really do to ease the translators\' burden.



I appreciated your comments, anyway.


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Austy
English to Spanish
TOPIC STARTER
sad CAT tools Aug 9, 2002

Quote:


On 2002-08-08 00:54, aliseo wrote:

, , ,

concentrating on a single sentence at the time, at the end you often realize that all sentences do not tie up together well.





Yes, that would be the natural result of attempting to translate sequentially by sentences, especially when the source and target languages have \"reversed\" syntaxes. A CAT tool blind to such issues would be an unacceptable hindrance.



Quote:


, , ,

you have to go back and revise these sentences so that they flow more naturally. This takes the time that you were expected to save with CAT tools.





That\'s unfortunate.



Quote:


One more nonsense is that what is really needed is word consistency, not sentence consistency, and CAT tools provide the latter one only.





I agree about the need for vocabulary tagging. It\'s weird that CAT tools would even attempt to maintain a sentence database: I could understand a database of phrases, or of headers/titles; but, sentences?



Quote:


, , ,

I do not risk anymore to skip sentences, as CAT tools serve you sentences for translation one by one in their original order.





Such feature of a CAT tool would hinder my maintaining inter-sentence and inter-paragraph consistency and coherence; even worse for the inter-chapter case. I need to be able to \"fast forward\" and \"rewind,\" as it were, at will all over the original text: to constantly check on what coheres with what, and consistencies throughout the text.



Thank you for courageously posting your unsubjugated opinion on CAT tools. ;>



__Austy__

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