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Thread poster: LegalTransform

LegalTransform  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 03:01
Member (2002)
Spanish to English
+ ...
Mar 28, 2005

I saw the following in a recent job posting:

"ATA members are not invited to participate in any of our biddings."

Why would someone view being an ATA member as a bad thing? They may dislike the organization or even believe that membership has no merit, but how does BELONGING to this organization make you automatically undesirable? How is simple membership in the ATA a negative thing for an agency?

This makes no sense to me.
Am I missing something?



[Edited at 2005-03-28 04:40]


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lefoque
United States
Local time: 03:01
French to English
+ ...
I wondered too Mar 28, 2005

I mean why would they specifically name the ATA? The wording itself belies a negative tone. I'm not a member of the ATA but have considered taking the exam. It could be as simple as this: they have a particular beef with the ATA or some member and are retaliating in what some might consider to be a childish manner. It would be more professional to just simply ignore submissions from ATA members without comment. Perhaps a bit unfair but a more mature approach in my humble opinion.

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Alex Lane  Identity Verified
Local time: 01:01
Russian to English
+ ...
Policy possibly due to a Blue Board entry ... Mar 28, 2005

I have had clients jokingly tell me, for example, "we won't hold your ATA membership against you" (at least, I *assume* it was said jokingly :^), but you do point to a strange requirement.

Based on your language pairs, I looked at some recent job posts and found the agency involved straightaway. A look at the outsourcer's Blue Board entries shows that last November, the outsourcer got a poor rating from a translator who took her case to the ATA (although to the best of my knowledge, arbitration between translators and agencies is not something the ATA does, per se). Perhaps that's the reason for this requirement?

Still, it's strange that an outsourcer would state such a requirement.

Stranger still that they'd care about native French proficiency (and not mention anything about English proficiency) for a translation into English.

Cheers...

[Edited at 2005-03-28 05:47]


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Russell Gillis  Identity Verified
Local time: 01:01
Spanish to English
Bottom feeders Mar 28, 2005

Note that this agency came up recently under another forum thread:

http://www.proz.com/topic/29479

Here is a quote from the agency's website, which may shed some light on why they don't want ATA members (i.e. rates):

----------------------------------------------------------------
Please note: We work on a small margin and try to make it up on quantity. In order not to waste your time or ours, please do not fill in the form unless you have been working for 1 to 3 cents per word and are content with that price. That is the price we are working with at the present time.

Kindly do not fill out this form if you are associated in any way with ATA.
----------------------------------------------------------------

Need I say more?



Russell


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xxxPaul Roige
Spain
Local time: 09:01
English to Spanish
+ ...
Crystal clear Mar 28, 2005

Russell Gillis wrote:
Note that this agency came up recently under another forum thread:
http://www.proz.com/topic/29479
Here is a quote from the agency's website, which may shed some light on why they don't want ATA members (i.e. rates):
----------------------------------------------------------------
Please note: We work on a small margin and try to make it up on quantity. In order not to waste your time or ours, please do not fill in the form unless you have been working for 1 to 3 cents per word and are content with that price. That is the price we are working with at the present time.

Kindly do not fill out this form if you are associated in any way with ATA.
----------------------------------------------------------------
Need I say more?

Russell


No-bull bully ad. Fair enough. Next!
P


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Rosa Maria Duenas Rios  Identity Verified
Local time: 03:01
I wrote them, got no answer... Mar 28, 2005

Jeff Whittaker wrote:

I saw the following in a recent job posting:

"ATA members are not invited to participate in any of our biddings."

Why would someone view being an ATA member as a bad thing? They may dislike the organization or even believe that membership has no merit, but how does BELONGING to this organization make you automatically undesirable? How is simple membership in the ATA a negative thing for an agency?

This makes no sense to me.
Am I missing something?



[Edited at 2005-03-28 04:40]


I am an ATA-certified member, I saw a similar ad a while ago (I am not sure if it was the same agency), and I was puzzled. I really wanted to find out why they disliked ATA so much, in order to determine whether this was a widespread feeling, and may be consider the possibility of not renewing my membership. So I sent a polite message asking if they could explain why ATA was not a good reference for them. I never got an answer. The topic also made it to Proz forums at that time.

After exchanging thoughts with several collagues, I concluded that there is probably much room for improvement in ATA, but that it has good things to offer to its members. I am much more suspicious of anyone who would disqualify the organization without providing a reason, than of the organization itself, which has been around since 1959. Just a thought.


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Marsel de Souza  Identity Verified
Brazil
Local time: 04:01
English to Portuguese
+ ...
Own an agency Mar 28, 2005

Hi there,

I found this agency's website and stumbled into a very strange offer while browsing through it:

QUOTE

Own an Agency

Great Business Opportunity

(...)
MY PARTNER AND I HAVE BUILT THIS SUCCESSFUL BUSINESS OVER A NUMBER OF YEARS AND CAN TEACH YOU EVERY INTRICATE DETAIL OF IT AT A FAR, FAR LOWER PRICE THAN IT WOULD COST TO BUY THIS BUSINESS OR ANY SUCCESSFUL ONE LIKE IT.
(...)

YOU WOULD PAY AT LEAST 20 TIMES OUR ASKING PRICE FOR ANY OTHER BUSINESS WORTH BUYING. IT S A FASCINATING AND INTERESTING BUSINESS, CHALLENGING BUT EASY TO MANAGE.

(...)
We will teach you EVERYTHING YOU WILL NEED TO KNOW HOW TO BECOME AN INDEPENDENT AGENCY AND BROKER FOR TRANSLATORS AND INTERPRETERS JUST LIKE US

WE WILL TEACH YOU HOW TO GET CLIENTS, TRANSLATORS AND INTERPRETERS.

(...)
THE PRICE: $3500.00. YOU CAN'T COME CLOSE TO BUYING A GREAT AND LEGITIMATE HOME BASED BUSINESS FOR 20 TIMES THAT AMOUNT. IT IS INEXPENSIVE BECAUSE YOU ARE NOT BUYING THE BUSINESS. HOWEVER, YOU WILL END UP WITH A CLONE OF THE BUSINESS.

END OF QUOTE

No comments.

Best regards,
Marsel.


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RHELLER
United States
Local time: 01:01
French to English
+ ...
what about translators with blue eyes? Mar 28, 2005

are they allowed to apply?

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Kevin Fulton
United States
Local time: 03:01
German to English
They want inexperienced translators Mar 28, 2005

Although membership in the ATA (or other professional association) and / or certification is not a guarantee of a translator's skills, membership does indicate a certain awareness of, and commitment to, the translation profession (and this does not imply that non-members aren't committed!!). Many agencies prefer to use ATA members because, in their eyes, membership in a professional association provides a form of screening, a simple alternative to grading test translations, contacting references or reviewing sample texts provided by the translator.

Specifically excluding members of a professional association, in my mind, is a sign that the agency in question has little interest in quality. Their ostensible rates also indicate that they're not terribly interested in getting European or American translators, either. The rate alone would provide a disincentive for queries by ATA members, so why go through the effort of excluding them?
Kevin


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Eva Gerkrath  Identity Verified
Netherlands
Local time: 09:01
English to German
+ ...
Low rates Mar 28, 2005

Low rates indeed: "FOR A SINGLE WORD OR PHRASE, WE WILL CHARGE YOU $20.00 FOR A MACHINE TRANSLATION."

Couldn't get this cheaper anywhere else.


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Lisa Laplante  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 03:01
Member (2004)
French to English
Posting? Mar 28, 2005

I saw this posting yesterday, and thought it was indeed bizarre. Today I tried to go back to it and found that all trace of it has mysteriously disappeared. Imagine that!

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Natalie  Identity Verified
Poland
Local time: 09:01
Member (2002)
English to Russian
+ ...
Job ad squashed Mar 28, 2005

Hi all,

The job in question was posted by a Platinum member, so it
didn't require vetting. It has been squashed on the basis of Job
Posting rule #3: "Jobs posted should respect the principle of equal opportunity." Excluding members of a group violates the principle of equal opportunity."

Natalia


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Ralf Lemster  Identity Verified
Germany
Local time: 09:01
English to German
+ ...
Contact jobs moderators Mar 28, 2005

Thanks for pointing this out, Natalia.

We (=Jobs moderators) removed the posting as soon as we were notified. As I've noted before in the forums, notifying a Jobs moderator (one at a time, please...) will get results more quickly than a forum posting - particularly outside the Job Systems forum.

Best regards,
Ralf


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Edward Potter  Identity Verified
Spain
Local time: 09:01
Member (2003)
Spanish to English
+ ...
Food for thought Mar 29, 2005

Why shouldn't this poster be allowed to exclude ATA members from working for him (her)? I can think of several legitimate reasons for the poster not wanting to work with ATA members. I would like to hear what the reason given is. It would make for an interesting discussion.

That said, I do agree with the general attitude of this thread. It seems that the job poster has a bee in his bonnet. It seems that he is going against the spirit of the site.

The reason for quashing the post ought to be that a moderator deemed it detrimental to the site. End of story.


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Alex Lane  Identity Verified
Local time: 01:01
Russian to English
+ ...
Legitimate reasons? Mar 30, 2005

Edward Potter wrote:

can think of several legitimate reasons for the poster not wanting to work with ATA members. [...][/quote]

I'm curious to learn what kind of reasons you have in mind, Ed. Care to share?

Cheers...


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