English translation: non-funicular, not funicular etc.
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11:54 Dec 8, 2004
English to English translations [PRO] Tech/Engineering - Construction / Civil Engineering / Structural analysis
English term or phrase:opposite of funicular
Dear Proz,
I am translating a paper from Spanish on structural analysis involved with funiculars and catenaries. An important part of this revolves around, literally "anti-funiclar" or "non-funicular" nets/networks. The matter is that I just cannot seem to find an adequate opposite for "funicular". Here is an excerpt with the unstranslated term within context:
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The lack of references found (which include a couple in Kudoz), make me doubt the adequacy of the terms "non-funicular" and "antifunicular" and I am under the impression that the English equivalent might be a completely unrelated word.
I have copied and pasted some simple definitions from the web hoping they may be of help.
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If we make a uniform arch, it should also follow a funicular if we want it to stay up. If we make a rigid beam, and if we give it a shape which differs from the funicular, it will experience bending moments, in other words, competing internal forces, which it will have to be stiff enough to withstand. The word funicular is derived from the Latin word, funiculus, a small rope: funis meant a larger rope.>>
Thank you for your help and my apologies for the extended reading.
Explanation: The term you need is not an opposite term but a word which explains that your object is not funicular. Therefore, you may use "not funicular" if this appears rarely and even "non-funicular" if you DEFINE this concept somewhere within the paper's translation.
Please see:
Structural Idealisation: a PDF doc at http://emulava.fbe.unsw.edu.au:8080/ downloads/pdf/struct-ideal.pdf
also
shapingstructures.com/overview.html
courses.arch.hku.hk/bss/01-02/students/ IBM%20PAVILION%20web%20page/struc01.htm
Also some arguing on ProZ :)
muybueno.proz.com/kudoz/193747 (non-funicular/unbalanced loading, Nikki Graham)
and www.brantacan.co.uk/keystones.htm
Now: Funicular Compression Structures
... A loading that does not corrpespond to the arch's funicular profile will be called a non-funicular loading or unbalanced loading. ... www.arch.virginia.edu/~km6e/ arch324/content/lectures/lec-23/pres.html
Arch 324/524 Course Description ... Funicular compression structures. Three-hinged arches and 19th Century methods of analysis. Arch structures subjected to non-funicular loadings. ...
urban.arch.virginia.edu/~km6e/ arch324/content/course-desc.html
I am not saying about another way i.e., the applying if the term "non-catenary" (more close to purely mathematical terms): please see
_____ and David F. Anderson, "Non-catenary Factorial Domains", Communications in Algebra, Vol. 17, No. ...
>>> www.math.utk.edu/~mulay/cv.html
and
www.ams.org/proc/1999-127-12/ S0002-9939-99-04962-X/home.html
... Finally, we provide several examples to explain our assumptions as well as an example of a noncatenary, equidimensional local domain R with prime ideal p such ... www.math.utah.edu/~sather/mdium.ps (fine is in PostScript format which can be converted to a PDF)
Non-catenary pseudo-geometric normal rings. ... www.math.purdue.edu/~heinzer/preprints/cat26.ps
In Modern Algebra, these terms are usually related to specific rings with some additional properties (see also AMS site and the list of math topics there).
Conclusions: in mechanical and other papers they would use the term "non-funicular", while in math the term "noncatenary" or "non-catenary" is preferible for description of specific domains and sets with algebraic structures.
Yours,
Tagir.
-------------------------------------------------- Note added at 1 day 1 hr 19 mins (2004-12-09 13:13:58 GMT) --------------------------------------------------
A small note about Google results:): Typing \"Cetificate\" brings you some 11+ thousand links but all of them simply contain this mistyped word:) I think this is due to the fact that proper typing \"Certificate\" results in more than 44 million links... Ratio is funny!
Yours
T.
...actually what a lot of those sites (Spanish, Portugese, British and Australian) are calling an "antifunicular". So, if you don't like "antifunicular", you can always call it a funicular. I suspect our American friends must do this.
Hello. As I have often said, one credible reference is worth more than hundreds of thousands you haven't checked. Anyway, you seem to be forgetting that even one of the definitions you quote refers to an arch following a "funicular"--but this is
Thank you Richard. I completely agree regarding magic numbers. But if you take a closer look, you will see that about 95% of those hits are Spanish or Portuguese websites, either written or translated from those languages. I have only spotted about 3 or 4 from the UK or Australia and frankly, given Spain, Portugal and Argentina's track record for research, it still seems hard to believe that British or US engineers to not use another term. :O)
Automatic update in 00:
Answers
10 mins confidence:
antifunicular
Explanation: I don't know what more you could want. There are only 62 Google hits, but at least a handful of them are entirely relevant and credible. So what's your problem? You don't think there's some magic minimum number of Googlies before you can use a term, do you?
Richard Benham France Local time: 07:53 Native speaker of: English
Explanation: unless there is a differentiation in your text between what is catenary and what is funicular - catenary curves are generally considered synonymous to funicular curves. (This was supposed to be Gaudi's structural plan for the Sagrada Familia.)
Parrot Spain Local time: 07:53 Works in field Native speaker of: English
Explanation: While this is similar to the other answer, Heyman used to put catenaries onto pictures of arches. When they coincided, the structures were sound. As the arches went low-high-low and catenaries (with rope) went high-low-high, you had to invert one to match it to the other.
This link states:
"By natural law, an inverted funicular tension geometry will automatically produce a pure funiclar compression shell geometry."
They are talking of concrete shells in the paper.
-------------------------------------------------- Note added at 3 hrs 48 mins (2004-12-08 15:42:45 GMT) --------------------------------------------------
Explanation: The term you need is not an opposite term but a word which explains that your object is not funicular. Therefore, you may use "not funicular" if this appears rarely and even "non-funicular" if you DEFINE this concept somewhere within the paper's translation.
Please see:
Structural Idealisation: a PDF doc at http://emulava.fbe.unsw.edu.au:8080/ downloads/pdf/struct-ideal.pdf
also
shapingstructures.com/overview.html
courses.arch.hku.hk/bss/01-02/students/ IBM%20PAVILION%20web%20page/struc01.htm
Also some arguing on ProZ :)
muybueno.proz.com/kudoz/193747 (non-funicular/unbalanced loading, Nikki Graham)
and www.brantacan.co.uk/keystones.htm
Now: Funicular Compression Structures
... A loading that does not corrpespond to the arch's funicular profile will be called a non-funicular loading or unbalanced loading. ... www.arch.virginia.edu/~km6e/ arch324/content/lectures/lec-23/pres.html
Arch 324/524 Course Description ... Funicular compression structures. Three-hinged arches and 19th Century methods of analysis. Arch structures subjected to non-funicular loadings. ...
urban.arch.virginia.edu/~km6e/ arch324/content/course-desc.html
I am not saying about another way i.e., the applying if the term "non-catenary" (more close to purely mathematical terms): please see
_____ and David F. Anderson, "Non-catenary Factorial Domains", Communications in Algebra, Vol. 17, No. ...
>>> www.math.utk.edu/~mulay/cv.html
and
www.ams.org/proc/1999-127-12/ S0002-9939-99-04962-X/home.html
... Finally, we provide several examples to explain our assumptions as well as an example of a noncatenary, equidimensional local domain R with prime ideal p such ... www.math.utah.edu/~sather/mdium.ps (fine is in PostScript format which can be converted to a PDF)
Non-catenary pseudo-geometric normal rings. ... www.math.purdue.edu/~heinzer/preprints/cat26.ps
In Modern Algebra, these terms are usually related to specific rings with some additional properties (see also AMS site and the list of math topics there).
Conclusions: in mechanical and other papers they would use the term "non-funicular", while in math the term "noncatenary" or "non-catenary" is preferible for description of specific domains and sets with algebraic structures.
Yours,
Tagir.
-------------------------------------------------- Note added at 1 day 1 hr 19 mins (2004-12-09 13:13:58 GMT) --------------------------------------------------
A small note about Google results:): Typing \"Cetificate\" brings you some 11+ thousand links but all of them simply contain this mistyped word:) I think this is due to the fact that proper typing \"Certificate\" results in more than 44 million links... Ratio is funny!
Yours
T.
ttagir Local time: 10:53 Specializes in field Native speaker of: Russian, Tatar PRO pts in category: 4
The translation workplace 
