Danish to English translations [PRO] Tech/Engineering - Electronics / Elect Eng / of railways
Danish term or phrase:stærkstrøm
There seem to be several translations of this, which makes it rather confusing - also some sound very literal - I would be grateful if anyone could tell me the technically correct term-
power current, heavy current, strong power, high-voltage...or other? Thanks
I know you didn't want to be a know-it-all, in any case, you'd meet fierce competition in me, 'cause I've had a 'black belt' in that for some 60 years... ;)
As for the weather, you may count on us (West Norway) getting the same as you, only some 6 hours later...
Good standadization will always be a daunting task, in particular in terminology!
What one trade would call 'a spade', could very well be 'a shovel' in the next one...
Anyway, I'm happy no to be on *that* committee...!
Listen, ye all, I'm *not* pointing fingers here, but I'd wish more translators would be aware of their own limitations and not take for granted that all technical terms follow some sort of logic, 'cuz it doesn't! :)
OK, sorry for ranting along - good night to ye all!
that when something is established as a defined wording or accepted standard, one is not assuming expert-knowledge by passing it on.
If I appeared a know-all, it was probably just a reflection og an ingrained habit, that comes from living in a cosmopolitan part of the world where one always has to explain and define to avoid misunderstandings. So, I do apologise :-)
The greatest mistake in communication, I believe, is to believe that anything is set in stone. Even standards are just guidelines.
Anyway, enough pondering from London. I hope you have better weather than we do!
Well, excuse me for saying so, but yoy're doing exactly that when you try to explain to me the difference between "voltage" and "volts" :)
But I do 'forgive' you - I know exactly how difficult it can be, assessing a person's technical knowledge from just a forum entry or an e-mail!
Standards would be great, but at the end of the day you'll need to have some basic understanding of the field in which you are translating or otherwise working. There's no exception from that rule, I'm afraid.
In particular it gets difficult when the term in question is 'reeking' of a technical term, but in fact it is nothing of the kind.
I get the same kind of trouble when I try to dabble in legalese, like warranties in manuals - I clearly do not have sufficient knowledge of the practices behind the terminology, so I'm forced to rely on more or less dubious Web searches or dictionaries. I mean, there's no shame in that - we can't all know everything! :)
The harsh fact that we all have to face, is that we can't resort to guesswork based upon etymology, grammar rules or similar. Each trade/technology have their own terminology, and we have to know it to make sense to the end user.
Sorry, out of spac
Roald, I claim no expert knowledge in your field whatsoever. The discussion that has taken place here was a steep learning curve for me. I can fully understand Sandra's (and everyone's - including my own) confusion over terminology. I think that the important lesson to be learnt from this is :
how crucially important it is to petition for agreement on international standards in the field of engineering.
With the workforce travelling more freely between countries than ever before, it seems that setting standards would greatly improve the safety of the individual.
Also, non-experts (such as myself) are more likely than ever to dip their feet in waters that are too deep and consequently land themselves in more trouble than bargained for.
I have learnt enough from this conversation, that in the future, I will call for an electrician to change my lightbulbs!
It might be that I was less than accurate in my posting there, but please let's agree that voltage and current as different physical entities as pressure and flow rate...!
Being educated as an electronics engineer, with some 30 years of relevant experience, my entrails clench when I see phrases like "a current of
X megawatts" or "a current of hundres of kilovolts".
Fair enough, "current" has become sort of the layman's term for "electricity", I understand that, but still we need to avoid mixing the physical entities, in my view!
Like I said, "sterkstrøm" and "svakstrøm" are terms for different technology disciplines, *not* any physical entites!
Roald, voltage = spaending ikke volt
Michael: har du proevet at google "High Voltage Power" og laest mit indslag vedroerende internationale standarder?
In my understanding, Roald, this is exactly the same as in Danish - which was exactly the point, I was trying (somewhat unsuccessfully it seems) to make during the discussion earlier in the week. The only difference, as far as I can see, is that the Danish Stærkstrømreglement differentiates between 'stærkstrøm' and 'svagstrøm' at a voltage level of 48 volts (apparently half of the level which applies in Norway). Having a background in electronics / electronic engineering, I quite agree with your comments about 'constructions' like "high voltage current/power"!
Maybe I shouldn't meddle in Danish, but in Norwegian at least, "sterkstrøm" and "svakstrøm" are not technical terms, rather traditional denominations for different disciplines within electrical engineering, where "sterkstrøm" is referring to work/equipment for voltages above 96 volts, and "svakstrøm" below 96 V.
Accordingly, I'd say that "sterkstrøm" would be close to "Utility Power" in English.
Above all, 'constructions' like "high voltage current/power" are technically downright wrong, as current or power cannot be measured in volts!
A rather unusual interpretation of the word "stærkstrøm" as I have seen and heard it used over the past 20+ years (at least). "high-voltage" in English would usually be translated as "højspænding" in Danish!
So I just heard back from the client.They said their particular term for "stærkstrøm" is "high-voltage". I had provided them with a list of the options discussed and they very kindly added that they appreciated that this is a fairly "ambiguous" term and hadn't expected me to know it ( they know it is not my area of expertise!). They also said it is a very specific to them and does not necessarily correspond with how others may translate it. It is not what I would have put initially I have to say - but to be fair I will select the answer that put this one first. Thanks to all of you for all your hard work in trying to solve this one - It has certainly sparked an interesting debate!
It would appear that Michael made the best out of context guess. Please don't close this thread too quickly, I am sure we would all like to see his in context translation.
***High output power / high voltage technology*** (the heading)
We specialize in maintenance of ***high output power / high voltage systems***.
Since early 2007 we have completed assignments for the ***railways high output power sector / high voltage market / in the railways high output power / high voltage market***.
Sure - It's quite simply:
Stærkstrømsteknik (the heading)
Vi vedligeholder stærkstrømssystemerne.
Siden starten af 2007 har vi udført opgaver indenfor bane-/stærkstrømsområdet.
I would agree, Sandra, that højspænding should be translated as high voltage. Could you, perhaps let us have the original sentence in the source text language, where the word stærkstrøm is used? This might help to clarify the translation while you are waiting for a reply from your client.
Dear all - thanks for all your comments - apologies for causing such heated discussion over this word - but you can see my dilemma! It doesn't look like my addendum to this appeared in this thread last night, re "high voltage"-There are other references in the text to "højspænding"-which in my dictionary is "high-voltage"-which then makes me reluctant to use it for "stærkstrøm" . To give you some context, the text is for a brochure for a company that supplies electrical and telecoms solutions to railways - and one of their services is provision and maintenance of "stærkstrøm"- I am now waiting for some feedback from the client, to see if they can explain it in more detail - don't know whether this helps any further?
I absolutely agree with you that it must be a matter of providing Sandra with the correct translation of the word she posted. This is the very reason why I am not able to accept incorrect proposals - especially from people who do not have the particular background, which is relevant to answering the question but who insist that their proposal is the correct one (and I do not include you in this category) and that I am mistaken, which I am 100% sure I am not! Incidentally, concensus does not always lead to the correct answer to a question. With all due respect, I would claim that this particular case would be one of those exceptions to the general rule. I leave it up to Sandra now to decide which translation she considers the most appropriate in the context of the source text she is translating. Over and out.
Michael, with all respect, it must be a matter of reaching consensus on the correct translation and not about being right or wrong. I will still maintain, within my experience, that it is necessary to specify whether a current is high or low i.e. High Current Power as opposed to Low Current Power but as Sven correctly argues, it will be down to Sandra to put suggestions (and hopefully share) into the context of her translation.
Is communication the greatest challenge facing man
10:30 Nov 11
No, I didn't see your posting last night - probably it was posted with reference to a field, which is not on my list of 'interest+working' fields - I filter my Kudoz questions in relation to areas I know sowmthing about. (In contrast to some others, I venture to say).
I assume you mean your discussion comment? Yes - and I responded to it!
Well folks, hasn't this been fun? Nothing like a heated on-line discussion to clear the cob-webs this bleak (Denmark) Wednesday morning. Unfortunately, I do not have more time to devote to this fascinating discussion. I think an important lesson to be learned is that there is a fairly obvious 'cultural difference' between people having a basically language training background and those (like myself) having a technical background but who are also linguists (I am fluent in 3 languages and have a good grasp of a 4th as well as some knowledge of several more). Another lesson to be learned (for some of us, at least) is that, perhaps, people involved in a particular field do (sometimes, at least!) have a good chance of knowing what they are talking about!
Sandra, I hope that you at least have got the answer you were looking for - you were certainly right about 1 thing: "There seem to be several translations of this, which makes it rather confusing ..."
A divergent view from the first 2 responses I received but I venture to suggest that we are, here, reaching a technical level, which is somewhat beyond that at which Sandra is working! / M. Davies ------------ Response C:
Well, contrary to my esteemed colleagues . . . or maybe not!
It is a _used_ term. Not a _commonly_ used term, but perhaps in some places or situations it could become common, so depending on where your correspondents are coming from it could be common to them.
I've seen and heard it used as meaning current x power factor: that is, the current which when multiplied by voltage gives true power. Is that the usage that your correspondents are using? It's arguable whether it's a very good way of dealing with issues around power and reactive power, but can make sense in some situations.
Subject: 'Power current' - is this a commonly used term in
English?
A question to all members of the forum: is the term 'power current' a normally used term within the context of electrical engineering?
My own opinion is that it is not. However, I have become involved in a discussion (another forum) where it is maintained that this is a
commonly used term and that I am mistaken.
Response A:
I have never come across the term 'power current' in an engineering or any other context, although I can imagine some novelist doing it. I would not expect any physicist, engineer or teacher (in their right mind) to give credibility to such a term. I have however come across the following in
books:
Light current
Heavy current
Low current
High current
Low power
High power
Sven, I have had a quick skim through the text you refer to. I also had a look at your web site (which looks quite impressive, I must say!). I note that you specialise in medical and pharamceutical translations. I think this is probably the reason why we have diverging views on the correct translation of 'stærkstrøm'. However, since the terms is (in the source text) used in an electrical / electronic engineering context (a field is much closer to my own field of interest / experience than yours), I maintain that the translation should be in relation to this field rather than to other fields where terms such as 'hazardous', 'dangerous', or whatever might be used with different meanings. Another aspect, which you might like to take into account is that my mother tongue is English (the target language for the translation of this term) and that I have been resident in Denmark for almost 30 years, I am fully fluent in Danish (as well as English) and have been actively involved in the engineering profession in this country (Denmark) for almost the same duration. I would, therefore, maintain that I know what I am talking about.
In fact, my Google shows 445 million hits for power current. However, try putting the words between inverted commas ("power current" and it comes down to 259,000). Next, try looking at some of the hits in more detail. If you find one where the 2 words are used in juxatposition with a meaning, which corresponds to 'stærsktrøm', then please do let me know - I would be most interested to look at the reference myself. So far, I have not found one which appears to be relevant. I have now submitted a question regarding the term 'power current' to the forum, which I mentioned, and await a response. I will keep you posted on whatever feedback I get from that quarter.
Sven, have you tried looking more closely at some of the Google hits? I have and I have not changed my mind. I will, however, put the question to an on-line forum for engineers in which I participate and ask the members there whether the term 'power current' is generally used within the profession.
In response to the comment from English-Danish: both 'power' and 'current' (as well as voltage) exist as terms, yes. However, in over 30 years of involvement in the electrical / electronics engineering profession, I have never - and I repeat never ever encountered the term 'power current' in any context.
Sven, stand in the middle of a busy highway. Dangerous location? Yes certainly. Hazardous location? Well actually not in the engineering sense of the word (see i.a. wikipedia).
A hazardous location is, in electrical engineering terms, defined as a place where concentrations of flammable gases, vapors, or dusts may occur and where, consequently, there is a high risk of explosion.
I assume that the original text (stærkstrøm) was a technical text and that, therefore, the technical / engineering definitions of words apply rather than the layman interpretations?
Fill two buckets with salt water, stick your right foot in one bucket and your left hand in the other, tell your spouse to post the result of the experiment, and apply 48 volt between the buckets!
Sven, in Denmark the 'stærkstrømsreglement' (or electrical regulations) apply from 48 volts upwards. 49 volts would hardly be termed 'a hazardous voltage'.
The translation depends on the context; please study the reference above.
-------------------------------------------------- Note added at 13 hrs (2009-11-11 06:52:54 GMT) --------------------------------------------------
Leo proffers:
heavy current [elec.] der Starkstrom
high-power current [tech.] der Starkstrom
high-tension current [tech.] der Starkstrom
high voltage current [elec.] der Starkstrom
high-voltage current [tech.] der Starkstrom
power current [elec.] der Starkstrom
-------------------------------------------------- Note added at 21 hrs (2009-11-11 15:36:23 GMT) --------------------------------------------------
My in context suggestion:
Stærkstrømsteknik (the heading)
Vi vedligeholder stærkstrømssystemerne.
Siden starten af 2007 har vi udført opgaver indenfor bane-/stærkstrømsområdet.
=>
Electrical Power Technology
We maintain the electrical power systems.
We have carried out assignments in the field of railway power since the beginning of 2007.
:o)
Sven Petersson Sweden Local time: 04:32 Native speaker of: Swedish, English PRO pts in category: 24
14 hrs confidence:
(electrical) power
Explanation: I was employed for some years in a major Danish consulting engineering department where most of my colleagues were 'stærkstrømsingeniører' or what would be termed in English 'electrical engineers' (as opposed to my own qualification as 'svagstrømsingeniør' - electronics engineer in English). Their work concerned, to a very large extent, what in English would be termed 'power engineering'.
-------------------------------------------------- Note added at 21 hrs (2009-11-11 15:46:23 GMT) --------------------------------------------------
Stærkstrømsteknik Electrical power (distribution) systems
Vi vedligeholder stærkstrømssystemerne. We maintain electrical power (distribution) systems
Siden starten af 2007 har vi udført opgaver indenfor bane-/stærkstrømsområdet. We have undertaken projects in the field of railway-/electrical power (distribution) since 2007.
Example sentence(s):
Han er stærkstrømsingeniør: He is a(n electrical) power engineer.
Stærkstrømskablerne løber i denne tracé : The power cables are laid in this line.
Michael J.H. Davies Denmark Local time: 04:32 Specializes in field Native speaker of: Danish, English PRO pts in category: 2
[PDF] Microsoft Photo Editor - Artikel om HJ....jpg - : PDF/Adobe Acrobat - HTML
inden for ***både stærkstrøm og svagstrøm. H.J. Valeur, VS Automatic ... both high-voltage current and low current***. H.J. Valeur, VS Automatic and ... www.vs-automatic.dk/ref.aspx?id=1046 -
Rail High Voltage Competent Person - VGC is looking for Rail High Voltage Competent people in the London area. Applicants must be a HV Competent Person and hold PTS and COSS competencies. ... www.railwaypeople.com/rail.../rail-high-voltage-competent-p... -
High Voltage Cable Jointer - Rail / Electrical - London | Jobs ... - High Voltage Cable Jointer - Rail / Electrical High Voltage (HV) Cable Jointer required to join one of the UK's largest energy companies involved in high ... www.resourcing-solutions.com/.../rail/high-voltage...rail-/... -
Electric power transmission - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia - Single phase AC current is sometimes used in a railway electrification system. High-voltage direct current systems are used for long distance transmission, ...
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electric_power_transmission -
New Year reveller, 16, killed after fall on high-voltage railway ... - 3 Jan 2009 ... A public schoolboy was killed when he tripped on a high-voltage railway line just after ringing in the New Year with friends. www.dailymail.co.uk/.../New-Year-reveller-16-killed-fall-hi... -
Siemens AG - Railway Arresters - High Voltage Arresters with Silicone Housing · High Voltage Arresters with Porcelain Housing · High Voltage ... 3EB2 for railway DC application up to 2 kV ... www.energy.siemens.com/.../high-voltage.../railway-arrester... -
Site Engineer- Rail High Voltage Substations job in Sydney Metro ... - Two HV Distribution Site Engineers are sought for a leading rail infrastructure contractor in the Sydney metro area. With two positions currently...
mycareer.com.au/consumer/find/job/view.aspx?s_rid...s... -
-------------------------------------------------- Note added at 22 hrs (2009-11-11 16:18:10 GMT) --------------------------------------------------
***High output power / high voltage technology*** (the heading)
We specialize in maintenance of ***high output power / high voltage systems***.
Since early 2007 we have completed assignments for the ***railways high output power sector / high voltage market / in the railways high output power / high voltage market***.
sources:
Cables, Hoses and Connectors Gallery - Railway TechnologyOne of HUBER+SUHNER's railway market innovations is the CAT5 RADOX RAILCAT5 data bus cable ... We supply high-voltage 26kV and 45kV cables for connections to roof-mounted ... We have a vast stock holding of railway coaxial, fibre optic, ... www.railway-technology.com/contractors/cables/gallery.html -
FDEA -A pragmatic approach towards a successful future!From the very early days, the development of the railways had a strong impact on the ... was one of the main catalysts behind the creation of a common internal market, ... Not least for that reason, we have to strive to further improve the ... That is why a year ago Switzerland and Italy brought a new high-voltage ... www.evd.admin.ch/aktuell/00120/index.html?lang=en... -
Expertise | Railways | Mott MacDonaldWe have a broad range of expertise in economics, railway and public transport modelling and ... DC, high and low voltage, overhead line and conductor rail. ... www.railways.mottmac.com/skillsservices/ -
[PDF] RAILWAY CATENARY SYSTEMS: PDF/Adobe Acrobat - HTML
We have extended this line to include a broad range of silicon and section ... railway networks. PFISTERER runs its own laboratories for high voltage testing and material .... market and makes high-quality safety equipment possible. ...
pfisterer.com/download_download/d_8463.pdf -
China Begins Its Transition to a Clean-Energy EconomyWe have sketched this claim before, but let's run though the numbers in more detail. ... of those solar panels have been exported, but China's domestic solar market is on the ... China is an emerging world leader in ultra-high-voltage, ... China is embarking on the largest railway expansion in history and plans to ... www.americanprogress.org/.../china_energy_numbers.html -
[PDF] Legislative Council Panel on Transport Subcommittee on matters ...: PDF/Adobe Acrobat - Quick View
21 Dec 2004 ... regard, we have reminded the railway corporations again to follow ... using higher-standard components newly available in the market, ... good progress, with one-third of them completed. All initiatives are ..... technology to check the insulation integrity of refurbished trains' high voltage ... www.legco.gov.hk/yr04-05/english/.../tp_rdp0107cb1-609-3e.p... -
TOSHIBA REVIEW 2009 Vol.64 NO.9We have delivered these high-output-power electric locomotive systems to China and ... To suppress feeder voltage drops, Central Japan Railway Company and Toshiba have developed ... This substation was completed and put into commercial operation in ... To fulfill these requirements in the Chinese market, Toshiba, ... www.toshiba.co.jp/tech/review/2009/09/index.htm -
andres-larsen Venezuela Local time: 23:02 Native speaker of: English PRO pts in category: 11
Notes to answerer
Asker: Hi- But there are other references in the text to "højspænding anlæg og systemer" - which in my dictionary is also high-voltage - are they therefore one and the same in this case?
1 day13 hrs confidence: peer agreement (net): -1
high-power electrical current
Explanation: stærkstrøm = high-power electrical current
in contrast to
svagstrøm = low-power electrical current
Michele Fauble United States Local time: 20:32 Native speaker of: English
Explanation: According to L&H, it's either heavy current , mains current, power current (these are the most likely-sounding options)
Helen Johnson United Kingdom Local time: 03:32 Native speaker of: English
2 days6 hrs confidence:
High Voltage Power
Explanation: High voltage = staerk
Power = stroem
British Standard BS 7671:2008 defines high voltage as any voltage difference between conductors that is higher than 1000 V AC or 1500 V ripple-free DC, or any voltage difference between a conductor and Earth that is higher than 600 V AC or 900 V ripple-free DC
And for interest:
British Standard BS 7671:2008 defines low voltage as
50–1000 V AC or 120–1500 V ripple-free DC between conductors;
50–600 V AC or 120–900 V ripple-free DC between conductors and Earth
And Sandra, I just felt it was important to make sure that everyone involved in this discussion knows why we disagreed.
It is a matter of definition of the ranges of what is "high" and what is "low. These ranges not standardised internationally.
English-Danish United Kingdom Local time: 03:32 Native speaker of: Danish
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