Masters or Master's (degree)?

English translation: Master's degree

GLOSSARY ENTRY (DERIVED FROM QUESTION BELOW)

English term or phrase:	Masters degree or Master's degree
Selected answer:	Master's degree
Entered by:	Roddy Stegemann

10:43 Feb 4, 2004

English language (monolingual) [PRO]
Art/Literary / grammar, university degrees

English term or phrase: Masters or Master's (degree)?

I'm having a brain block here.

Does one say:
I have my Master's degree
I have my Masters degree
(or even: I have a Master degree)

And what about with the noun "program"? Master's Program or Masters Program?

Michele Johnson KudoZ activity Questions: 92 (none open) Answers: 407 Germany
Local time: 03:44

Master's degree

Explanation:
Better yet Master of Arts or Master of Science degree.

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Note added at 2004-02-05 01:29:47 (GMT)
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Note to Nancy Arrowsmith:

The people who grant the Master of Arts or Science degrees are doctors -- not masters.

Not to everyone:

This discussion has proven somewhat interesting and has caused me to think a little harder. I suspect the tendency to drop the apostrophe has occurred, because of the following confusion. There are many different kinds of Master of Arts and Science degrees, and it is thus common to speak of more than one. How does one go about it, though?

Consider the phrases \"I have two Master\'s degrees\" or that institution awards many different Master\'s degrees in the visual arts. In the first sentence there is only one master with two degrees. In the second there are many masters each with one or more degrees. Should one not then write Masters\' degrees? Is it not this potential toggling back and forth with regard to the position of the apostrophe that has led many people to drop it altogether?

Then too, since it is doctors who award the degree, one can easily imagine some degree (pun intended) of condescension (coming down) and disdain (going up) for lack of precision (coming down) or over precision (going up) with regard to the presence or absence of an elevated comma.

No, Rowan, I would not promote the absence of the apostrophe, no more than I would promote dropping the dot over the i. One has to draw the line somewhere (pun intended)!

Selected response from:

Roddy Stegemann
United States
Local time: 18:44

Grading comment

Interesting how a simple question turns out to be so complex! I don't think we concluded anything absolutely, but am now personally leaning towards "Master's", although I do agree with Rowan's point that everyday usage practically makes both possible. Alaa also makes a valid point. Thank you also to John and Mihaela for your comments.
4 KudoZ points were awarded for this answer

SUMMARY OF ALL EXPLANATIONS PROVIDED

4 +9

Master's degree

Roddy Stegemann

4 +5

In your specific examples

John Bowden

4 +5

Master's or Masters

Rowan Morrell

4 +1

master's degree program

Mihaela Sinca

3 +1

I have a ... degree

Alaa Zeineldine

Answers

5 mins confidence:

peer agreement (net): +9

Master's degree

Roddy Stegemann
United States
Local time: 18:44
Native speaker of:

English
PRO pts in pair: 132

Grading comment

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)

agree

Jörgen Slet

4 mins

agree

Enza Longo

6 mins

agree

Empty Whiskey Glass

17 mins

agree

Armorel Young: let's hear it for the proper use of the apostrophe!

24 mins

-> Yeah, me too!

agree

Nado2002

35 mins

agree

hookmv: Definitely Master's

6 hrs

-> OK!

agree

mdesestret

7 hrs

agree

pike

7 hrs

agree

Eva Olsson: I have always used and seen Master's, but I am not very surprised at the occurrence of Masters.

9 hrs

-> I am not surprised either, but like you I am not encouraging its use.

disagree

Rowan Morrell: That Master's with the apostrophe is the only option. "Masters degree" appears too often in search engine hits for it to be considered an anomaly. Many standard English words started out as "mistakes". And the it's in your response should be its!

13 hrs

-> I see no reason to promote error. The apostrophe is an important part of the English, as well as many other languages of our world. It's proper use should be encouraged. War also exists, does this mean we should promote it?

agree

Margarita

13 hrs

7 mins confidence:

peer agreement (net): +1

masters or master's (degree)? master's degree program

Explanation:
www.cs.washington.edu/masters/
Directory of Professional Master's Degree Programs in the Mathematical Sciences
http://www.ams.org/tools/masters.html

Mihaela Sinca
Local time: 04:44
Native speaker of:

Romanian
PRO pts in pair: 12

23 mins confidence:

peer agreement (net): +5

In your specific examples

Explanation:
I'd say "I have an MA" - but the degree is called a Masters degree. THe apostrophe would imply it belonged to someone who was "a master" in a non-academic sense.
THe quote is from teh University of Sheffield, but all the other UK universities I've checked also refer to "Masters degrees" and "masters degree programmes"

"This Masters Degree programme in the School of Architecture allows the opportunity to study a range of subjects at an advanced level in an academic unit with a distinguished reputation in both teaching and research"

Reference: http://www.shef.ac.uk/uni/academic/A-C/archst/main/courses/m...

John Bowden
Local time: 02:44
Native speaker of:

English
PRO pts in pair: 140

2 hrs confidence:

peer agreement (net): +1

masters or master's (degree)? I have a ... degree

Explanation:
Apostrophe politics aside, I think you should replace "my" with "a": "I have a Master's degree in ...", or as John suggests "I have an MA/MS ...".

It is also not uncommon to say "I have a Master's in ..."

While you can say "I took my Master's ...", saying "I have my Master's" is either redundant, or indicates that you are carrying it with you.

Alaa Zeineldine
Egypt
Local time: 03:44
Native speaker of:

Arabic,

English
PRO pts in pair: 198

9 mins confidence:

peer agreement (net): +5

masters or master's (degree)? Master's or Masters

Explanation:
I think both "Masters" or "Master's" are OK. A quick search on Yahoo revealed 775,000 hits for "Master's degree" and 784,000 hits for "Masters degree". However, I don't really like "Master degree".

But certainly, "Masters degree" and "Master's degree" are both in such frequent use as to be considered standard. If you still can't decide, toss a coin! :-) The apostrophe is a rather endangered species these days anyway, and this is one instance where you can insert ir or leave it out without any dire consequences either way.

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Note added at 15 mins (2004-02-04 10:59:16 GMT)
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The same applies to \"Masters program\" or \"Master\'s program\". 131,000 Yahoo hits for the former, 136,000 for the latter. Not a lot of difference. Again, you could use either just as safely.

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Note added at 13 hrs 54 mins (2004-02-05 00:38:29 GMT)
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Regarding the apostrophe issue: I\'m following a DEscriptive rather than a PREscriptive approach here. If I wanted to be PREscriptive, I\'d probably be agree with Hamo, but the fact is that, whether Masters without the apostrophe is right or wrong, it is used so frequently that it really has to be considered standard, however much the more pedantic among us (and I count myself as one of those) may dislike it. Therefore, I think you really can\'t impose a \"hard and fast\" rule in this instance. However much we may like to regulate the English language, the fact is that it regulates itself to a large extent. Popular usage, rather than the decrees of grammarians, contributes very significantly to the \"standardising\" of a word or phrase that may be considered wrong when it first appears.

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Note added at 18 hrs 52 mins (2004-02-05 05:36:31 GMT)
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Note to Hamo: It\'s = it is; its = belonging to it.

If you want to encourage correct use of the apostrophe, begin by using it correctly yourself!

You should say \"Its proper use should be encouraged\", not \"It\'s proper use should be encouraged\".

Having said that, people mix up \"it\'s\" and \"its\" so often that the rule may end up becoming irrelevant. I repeat my point that a number of standard words and phrases used today were considered errors when they were first written. I don\'t wish to promote error, but popular usage can eventually make \"error\" redundant in some cases. Maybe Master\'s/Masters is one such case.

Rowan Morrell
New Zealand
Local time: 13:44
Native speaker of:

English
PRO pts in pair: 227

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)

agree

awilliams: yes, you can use either.

1 min

-> Thanks Amy.

agree

James Calder: Poor old apostrophe. Have a read of 'Eats, Shoots & Leaves' by Lynne Truss. It devotes a whole chapter to apostrophes.

5 mins

-> I've sometimes considered forming an SPCA - Society for the Prevention of Cruelty to Apostrophes! The poor things do suffer most dreadfully. It's sad to see.

agree

Empty Whiskey Glass

13 mins

-> Thanks Svetozar.

agree

Nado2002

33 mins

-> Thanks Nado2002.

agree

melayujati

37 mins

-> Thanks melayujati.

disagree

Roddy Stegemann: I strongly disagree. A Master of Arts or Science degree is the degree of someone who has mastered a certain set of coursework. Thus, the degree is that of the master -- a Master's degree!

1 hr

-> "Master's" may be more "correct" (and I follow your argument as to why), but "Masters" occurs too frequently for it to be discounted as wrong. I therefore maintain that the terms are interchangeable, but maybe "Master's" is more desirable.

agree

Iolanta Vlaykova Paneva

1 hr

-> Thanks Yolanta.

neutral

Eva Olsson: I like your comment, Hamo, but I'm afraid that a lot of apostrophes are being dropped whether we like it or not...

9 hrs

-> Indeed Eva. Changes to the English language are governed by popular usage as much as anything else. Many words and phrases we consider standard today were "mistakes" when they first appeared.

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