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abound in/with?

English translation: in or with - need more context

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20:33 Mar 15, 2002
English to English translations [Non-PRO]
English term or phrase: abound in/with?
I would appreciate if someone cound tell me if there is any difference in meaning between the use of "in" and "with" in this case
Vesna Zivcic
Local time: 13:56
English translation:in or with - need more context
Explanation:
. . . according to Oxford. "Fish abound in the river; the river abounds in/with fish."

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Note added at 2002-03-15 21:05:33 (GMT)
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Here\'s the full citation:

abound - verb - 1. be plentiful; \"fish abound in the river.\" 2. (followed by \"in\" or \"with\") have in great quantities; \"the river abounds in/with fish.\"

So, in the first case \"abound\" refers to the fish, and you have to use \"in.\" For the second case, \"abounds\" refers to the river, and you may use \"in\" or \"with.\"

Have fun!


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Note added at 2002-03-15 22:48:19 (GMT)
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Given your note, either will do.

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Note added at 2002-03-15 23:33:14 (GMT)
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You might also consider \"teems\" - \"the hunting ground teems(is teeming) with deer (wildlife, game, etc.)
Other possibilities at this link:
http://www.bartleby.com/61/12/T0081200.html

BTW, I can\'t find or imagine a circumstance where abound(s) is used as an adjective. Every reference I\'ve seen indicates that it\'s a verb only:
http://www.bartleby.com/61/12/A0021200.html
http://www.bartleby.com/68/25/25.html
If you perchance want an adjective, then (as has been mentioned) it would be \"abundant,\" as in \"I would guess that this entire discussion has made the issue abundantly clear.\" (Oops - I guess it\'s an adverb there . . .)
;-)
Selected response from:

Michael Sebold
Canada
Local time: 07:56
Grading comment
Thank you all very much for the enlightening commentaries. I feel reassured in thinking that it is possible to use both prepositions without any nuances in meaning.
Althogh I posted an addition to my question as soon as somebody had asked for it, it did't appear immediatelly. I appologize if it has caused a problem.
4 KudoZ points were awarded for this answer

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Summary of answers provided
4 +7in or with - need more contextMichael Sebold
4 +3No difference
Kim Metzger
5 +1abound in/ withxxxOso
4 +1some justificationKlaus Dorn
4http://www.dictionary.com/search?q=aboundTAGALOG PRO
4bound to abound :-)xxxAnneM
4 -2there is a differenceKlaus Dorn


Discussion entries: 1





  

Answers


3 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5 peer agreement (net): +3
No difference


Explanation:
According to my references there is no difference in meaning and both prepositions are used acceptably.


    OED, The Careful Writer - Theodore Bernstein
Kim Metzger
Mexico
Local time: 06:56
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish
PRO pts in pair: 2249

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  Margaret Lagoyianni
2 mins

agree  Yana
6 mins

disagree  Klaus Dorn: it's which object you are referring to! see below
14 mins
  -> I pity your poor students.

agree  Werner George Patels, M.A., C.Tran.(ATIO)
18 mins

agree  Barbara Østergaard: Confirmed by Longman's Dictionary of English Language and Culture and BBI Dictionary of English Word Combinations.
2 hrs

neutral  Michael Deliso: to abound with in this sentence is more apprpriate
9 hrs
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5 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5 peer agreement (net): +7
in or with - need more context


Explanation:
. . . according to Oxford. "Fish abound in the river; the river abounds in/with fish."

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 2002-03-15 21:05:33 (GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

Here\'s the full citation:

abound - verb - 1. be plentiful; \"fish abound in the river.\" 2. (followed by \"in\" or \"with\") have in great quantities; \"the river abounds in/with fish.\"

So, in the first case \"abound\" refers to the fish, and you have to use \"in.\" For the second case, \"abounds\" refers to the river, and you may use \"in\" or \"with.\"

Have fun!


--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 2002-03-15 22:48:19 (GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

Given your note, either will do.

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 2002-03-15 23:33:14 (GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

You might also consider \"teems\" - \"the hunting ground teems(is teeming) with deer (wildlife, game, etc.)
Other possibilities at this link:
http://www.bartleby.com/61/12/T0081200.html

BTW, I can\'t find or imagine a circumstance where abound(s) is used as an adjective. Every reference I\'ve seen indicates that it\'s a verb only:
http://www.bartleby.com/61/12/A0021200.html
http://www.bartleby.com/68/25/25.html
If you perchance want an adjective, then (as has been mentioned) it would be \"abundant,\" as in \"I would guess that this entire discussion has made the issue abundantly clear.\" (Oops - I guess it\'s an adverb there . . .)
;-)

Michael Sebold
Canada
Local time: 07:56
PRO pts in pair: 10
Grading comment
Thank you all very much for the enlightening commentaries. I feel reassured in thinking that it is possible to use both prepositions without any nuances in meaning.
Althogh I posted an addition to my question as soon as somebody had asked for it, it did't appear immediatelly. I appologize if it has caused a problem.

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  Margaret Lagoyianni: I found same reference
1 min
  -> Thank you.

agree  Theodore Fink
5 mins
  -> Thanks, Theodore.

disagree  Klaus Dorn: see below
12 mins
  -> Not sure why you disagreed, Klaus - did ask for more context. Besides, see my note . . .

agree  Chris Rowson: I don´t believe they are the same, or not always, and I think this quote shows it well. ´"Fish abound with the river" is nonsense, but "in" makes sense.
20 mins
  -> Yup - see my note.

agree  Antoinette Verburg: Yes, you are right. This is the correct answer.
32 mins
  -> Thank you.

agree  Kim Metzger
33 mins
  -> Thanks, Kim - I still can't get over how fast you are . . .

agree  Werner George Patels, M.A., C.Tran.(ATIO)
41 mins
  -> Thanks, Werner.

agree  John Kinory: Exactly. (BTW: please email me, I am unable to email you for some reason)
2 hrs
  -> Thanks, John.

agree  Barbara Østergaard
2 hrs
  -> Thanks, Barbara.
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6 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 5/5 peer agreement (net): +1
abound in/ with


Explanation:
Hi Vesna,
Both of them have the same meaning.

Two examples:

1.Life abounded in mysteries -- Norman Mailer.

2.Institutions abound with evidence of his success -- Johns Hopkins Magazine

Good luck from Oso ¶:^)


    Webster's
xxxOso
Native speaker of: Native in SpanishSpanish
PRO pts in pair: 138

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  John Kinory
4 hrs
  -> Thanks, John ¶:^))
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11 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5 peer agreement (net): -2
there is a difference


Explanation:
I explain it to my students like this:

If there were plenty of flowers on a hill, we could say "the hill is abound with flowers", in which case we are talking about the hill or we could say "the flowers are abound in numbers", in which case we refer to the flowers themselves. So, it's about which object you're talking about. Personally, I always recommend to use "there is an abundance of (flowers)", to stay out of trouble. And then, of course, this is where the adjective abound comes from in the first place.

Klaus Dorn
Local time: 14:56
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish, Native in GermanGerman
PRO pts in pair: 35

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
disagree  Kim Metzger: The hill is abound with flowers?
9 mins
  -> see below, your other comment was quite unnecessary

disagree  Werner George Patels, M.A., C.Tran.(ATIO): It MUST be "the hill abounds with/in flowers" - if at all!
10 mins
  -> no, it mustn't...see below

agree  Chris Rowson: Sorry, but these "abound" sentences are not English as I know it. "Abound" is not an adjective.
12 mins
  -> abound (Adjektiv) = zahlreich, im Überfluss

neutral  Antoinette Verburg: this is true for the adjective, but not for the verb. There is no difference between 'to abound in' and 'to abound with'.
14 mins
  -> and at the time of my posting there was no indication the verb was being asked for

neutral  Yuri Geifman: I know... this is a practical joke, right?
53 mins

disagree  John Kinory: It's all been said, I am afraid.
1 hr

neutral  Michael Sebold: I took your advice, Klaus, and checked 16 dictionaries: every last one says that "abound" is a verb only. The closest you can get in terms of an adjective is "abounding," and that was given in only one.
4 hrs
  -> well, for example, go to http://www.dicdata.de/
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1 hr   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5
http://www.dictionary.com/search?q=abound


Explanation:
Abound = To be copiously supplied; -- followed by in or with.

To abound in, to possess in such abundance as to be characterized by.

To abound with, to be filled with; to possess in great numbers.

Men abounding in natural courage. --Macaulay.

A faithful man shall abound with blessings. --Prov. xxviii. 20.

It abounds with cabinets of curiosities. --Addison.
Source: Webster's Revised Unabridged Dictionary, © 1996, 1998 MICRA, Inc.



TAGALOG PRO
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2 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5 peer agreement (net): +1
some justification


Explanation:
abound (Adjektiv) zahlreich, im Überfluss

I started writing my answer at 08:36 website time and at that time there was no further context. The question was left open and I clicked the "send" button at 08:44.

I find it quite unnecessary for

some of you to comment in the way you did ("poor" students and similar comments) as I used abound correctly in my examples, since, I repeat, there was no indication that the asker was after the verb in the source and my use of "abound" as an adjective is quite correct. For actually someone who claims to be an English native to say
that "abound is not an adjective" is quite rich.


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Note added at 2002-03-15 23:50:20 (GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

so, these people are all speaking bad English???

We are within close proximity to Hidden Valley Ski area, the Great Gorge Golf Reserve, consisting of four individual golf courses, all of which are only minutes away. Each season is abound with its own activities; biking and hiking in the spring; fishing and swimming in the summer; apple picking and foliage touring in the Fall; and, of course, skiing in the Winter. (http://www.alpinehausbb.com)

The literature is abound with classification algorithms, and in recent years with algorithms for time sequence analysis, but relatively little has been published on extracting meaningful information from problems involving continuous classes (regression).
(http://www.cs.waikato.ac.nz/~ml/publications.html)

Brussels is abound with speciality shops. The immense cultural diversity of its inhabitants truly caters to each taste. (http://www.ebrusselshotels.com/pages/shopping.htm)

Frank Pianka is abound with experience, raw knowledge (ask him about knots!), expertise, and information about anything that obeys the laws of physics. He has been a member of the Alpine Club of Canada (Thunder Bay Section) (http://www.norlink.net/~mtjoseph/contact.html)

The Bethpage location is abound with Alabaster and Tiffany fixtures, as well as warm Fireplaces, all of the kind you would expect in a Classic Fine American Steakhouse. (http://www.hrsingletons.com/locations.htm)

Klaus Dorn
Local time: 14:56
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish, Native in GermanGerman
PRO pts in pair: 35

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
disagree  Theodore Fink: I'm sorry, Klaus, but your colleagues are correct on this one. "Abound" cannot be used the way you used it in either of the examples you gave. If anything, it should be "abundant". Have a great weekend.
14 mins
  -> would you then please give an example with "abound" as an adjective?

agree  Barbara Østergaard: I agree as to the unnecessary comments... ;-)
23 mins
  -> thanks, at least something positive here

disagree  Werner George Patels, M.A., C.Tran.(ATIO): there is no adjective; the adjective is "abundant" Isn't that abundantly clear?
29 mins
  -> please look at the dictionaries - they clearly list both adjective and even adverb!

agree  xxxAnneM: An unfortunate argument has arisen. There are 467 google hits with 'is abound with'. As a native speaker this first jarred with me but checking it out, it seems that the structure does exist but I would opt for 'abounds with', sounds less strained.
34 mins
  -> thank you very, very much, I did a similar search!

neutral  Michael Sebold: I suppose absence of evidence is not evidence of absence, but the above-mentioned Google hits must be put into context: 35,900 for "abounds with" and 48,800 for "abounds in." :)
55 mins
  -> I didn't argue about what's used more, I argued about that the adjective exists and is used

neutral  John Kinory: 467 hits on the Internet? There can easily be 467 people who can't write contemporary good English. Collins does not list the adj. - that must mean something.
2 hrs

neutral  Kim Metzger: Klaus, the comment about the students was only in reference to those archaic (14th century) sentences you used as examples.
4 hrs
  -> I teach English literature at a college.

agree  Chris Rowson: Not all the Google hits are non-native, or plain bad. Like AnneM I found it jarring at first. I have to think of "a-bound" to grasp it. Not a normal adjective ("the abound meadows"?), I don´t know what this is.
8 hrs
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17 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5
bound to abound :-)


Explanation:
First of all Vesna, I hope you got the answer to your question!!
The structure Klaus suggested for me is interesting as I like to understand the ins and outs of language and I agree with what Chris when he says it's not a 'normal' adjective and he doesn't know quite what it is!
I think it falls into the category of postpositive adjectives/participle. Other examples I can think of which would be similar would be: adrift, abaft, astray, aboard, ahead.
What can't be argued is that many of the 467 examples of 'is abound with'(another 200 or so in plural), as Chris says are examples of good usage of 'native' origin.
Anyway, I don't think we should let this get out of hand. It makes for an interesting linguistic discussion and it would be nice to discover exactly what type of structure this is. I don't have any grammar books at hand so will limit my opinion to this :-).

xxxAnneM
Local time: 13:56
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish
PRO pts in pair: 4

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
neutral  Michael Sebold: Hi Anne - after the point, but for clarity's sake... your examples, though interesting, are all adjectives and/or adverbs; none is a verb. Klaus' reference is a German translation website (www.dicdata.de) - abound is a verb in ALL sample sentences. :-)
3 hrs
  -> Hi Michael :-) I'm sorry but I don't understand ??. I know they are adjs/advs. - that was my point, the interest for me was if they all originate from vbs ie. adrift from drift, astray from stray, etc. Have a nice weekend :-)
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