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Q for nautical types

English translation: head into the seas

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08:30 Mar 8, 2004
English to English translations [PRO]
Ships, Sailing, Maritime
English term or phrase: Q for nautical types
In poor weather conditions (beyond sea swells), when at sea in a motorboat (about 10m), what advice would you give that implies a 'defensive' kind of sailing?

Two pieces of advice were given in my text, one to reduce speed, the other to 'stay tick over tack', but I cannot find any explanation of this latter expression.

I have also posted this Q in ES-EN, if you wish to refer to it: http://www.proz.com/?sp=h&id=656912
xxxLia Fail
Spain
Local time: 07:47
English translation:head into the seas
Explanation:
Hi Ailish, after seeing the Spanish I understand the problem. Tacking is sailing into the wind in a zigzag pattern shifting the sails from side to side [tack to tack] just OFF the wind. The waves usually form in the direction of the wind. In a powerboat, you don't have sails, and the strategy in heavy weather is to drop speed to that of a sailboat and basically "ride" the seas the way a sailboat would naturally do. You want to avoid lying ahull in a powerboat, esp. in a small one, because unlike a sailboat it does not have a significant keel for leverage from the water and will flip over.

So, what you do is you drive very slowly, head into the seas [and INTO the wind, NOT just off it as in a real tack, therefore this person thought of expressing it as "a tick [a little bit] over [higher than, closer to the wind than] tack[ing] ] and kinda "climb" over the waves taking care not to rush down too fast the other side or it will wash you over when it crashes and you are in the trough.

See also
http://www.setsail.com/dashew/dashew214.html
"Then there is the issue of heavy weather. When we did our powerboat
interviews for Surviving the Storm I was stunned by the fact that all the power yacht and commercial professional captains with whom I spoke told me the same thing. In heavy weather there is only one tactic--head into the seas. And if you happen to be running off when control becomes chancy, and need to turn into the waves, make your turn at the wrong time and it is the end of the story (due to wave-induced capsizes). This applies to 100,000-ton tankers as well as small yachts. "

HTH! In any event, never heard of "a tick over tack" and I don't think it actually exists other than as an idiosyncratic expression

Dee, former owner or co-owner of 26ft Donzi racer/cruiser, 48 ft Hatteras LRC, 60ft Hatteras Sportsfisherman, 44 ft Nautique Saintonge cutter rigged sloop, 30 ft C&C.

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 9 hrs 11 mins (2004-03-08 17:42:43 GMT) Post-grading
--------------------------------------------------

Ailish,

Thanks for the points and kind words.

Yes, he\'s creative but he\'s also a \"sailor\" or mariner ... in that you don\'t actually go \"straigth\" into the sea [i.e. at a 90 degree angle to the wave] because with any flattish bottomed boat you\'re gonna know all about it [our Donzi\'s baptized name was \"Green Flash\", more often referred to as \"Green Bash\" in rough seas!]. In fact you do take the wave a bit at an angle [i.e. \"a tick over tack\" but not quite \"on the nose\"], say to starboard, and correct in a sort of horizontal see-saw by steering to port when you are on the crest of the wave so you don\'t end up lying ahull in the trough, but, rather, can take the next wave the same way.

Feeling seasick already ... :)

Dee

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 9 hrs 13 mins (2004-03-08 17:43:51 GMT) Post-grading
--------------------------------------------------

OOps typo: \"straiGHt\" into the seas!
Selected response from:

Hermeneutica
Switzerland
Local time: 07:47
Grading comment
David had it too, but your explanation was superb, what's more you ingeniously untangled the Spanish sailor's thinking prcesses:-) The translation is in fact very good technically (very few problems of this type), just linguistically problematic:-) You may be interested in seeing the comment I made in the ES-EN question. Basically I feel I have to avoid purely sailing terminology, as this is a motorboat without sails, and 'amurado' only came up in sailboat contexts.

Thanks to all for being such a terrific help:-)
4 KudoZ points were awarded for this answer

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Summary of answers provided
5 +2head into the seas
Hermeneutica
1 +1stay head to the wind (or sea)David Moore
3 -1To move mechanically without changing directionCherepanov
1no answer but...
Jonathan MacKerron


  

Answers


30 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 3/5Answerer confidence 3/5 peer agreement (net): -1
To move mechanically without changing direction


Explanation:
tick over - is an auto term, that means “to move mechanically using momentum, inertia”

tack – is a nautical term for direction.
E.G., port tack - the course to the seaport


Cherepanov
Ukraine
Local time: 08:47
Native speaker of: Native in RussianRussian

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
disagree  Tony M: 'on a port tack' does NOT mean 'heading for port' but is a sailing term referring to the boat's direction wrt the wind.
21 mins
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28 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 1/5Answerer confidence 1/5
q for nautical types
no answer but...


Explanation:
there is no nautical entry in Webster for tick, however for tack there are two "3 a : a rope to hold in place the forward lower corner of a course on a sailing ship compare SHEET b : a rope for hauling the outer lower corner of a studding sail to the end of the boom c : the lower forward corner of a fore-and-aft sail d : the corner of a sail to which a tack is fastened (as the weather clew of a square sail)
4 a : the direction of a ship with respect to the trim of her sails *the starboard tack* *the port tack* b : the run of a sailing ship on one tack *the ship sailed well on that last tack* c : a change when close-hauled from the starboard to the port tack or vice versa *made two tacks in rounding the point*"

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 31 mins (2004-03-08 09:02:28 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

perhaps simply to \"stay on course\"?

Jonathan MacKerron
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish
PRO pts in category: 8
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48 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 1/5Answerer confidence 1/5 peer agreement (net): +1
q for nautical types
stay head to the wind (or sea)


Explanation:
I'll admit I am not a nautical type, but I have travelled on many a ferry, and the principles are likely to be similar. If possible, a ferry-captain will always reduce speed and head into the wind (or sea) in extremes of bad weather. This reduces roll, although pitch is unlikely to be much improved; here, for a smaller vessel, the roll (over) would be the greatest danger. So I think "tick-over" from the first posting may well be on the right lines.

David Moore
Local time: 07:47
Works in field
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish
PRO pts in category: 4

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  Tony M: I'm not familiar with the term, but certainly 'heading into the wind' would be good advice, and since this is not a sailing boat, they might be trying to imply the same thing.
5 mins
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56 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 5/5 peer agreement (net): +2
q for nautical types
head into the seas


Explanation:
Hi Ailish, after seeing the Spanish I understand the problem. Tacking is sailing into the wind in a zigzag pattern shifting the sails from side to side [tack to tack] just OFF the wind. The waves usually form in the direction of the wind. In a powerboat, you don't have sails, and the strategy in heavy weather is to drop speed to that of a sailboat and basically "ride" the seas the way a sailboat would naturally do. You want to avoid lying ahull in a powerboat, esp. in a small one, because unlike a sailboat it does not have a significant keel for leverage from the water and will flip over.

So, what you do is you drive very slowly, head into the seas [and INTO the wind, NOT just off it as in a real tack, therefore this person thought of expressing it as "a tick [a little bit] over [higher than, closer to the wind than] tack[ing] ] and kinda "climb" over the waves taking care not to rush down too fast the other side or it will wash you over when it crashes and you are in the trough.

See also
http://www.setsail.com/dashew/dashew214.html
"Then there is the issue of heavy weather. When we did our powerboat
interviews for Surviving the Storm I was stunned by the fact that all the power yacht and commercial professional captains with whom I spoke told me the same thing. In heavy weather there is only one tactic--head into the seas. And if you happen to be running off when control becomes chancy, and need to turn into the waves, make your turn at the wrong time and it is the end of the story (due to wave-induced capsizes). This applies to 100,000-ton tankers as well as small yachts. "

HTH! In any event, never heard of "a tick over tack" and I don't think it actually exists other than as an idiosyncratic expression

Dee, former owner or co-owner of 26ft Donzi racer/cruiser, 48 ft Hatteras LRC, 60ft Hatteras Sportsfisherman, 44 ft Nautique Saintonge cutter rigged sloop, 30 ft C&C.

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 9 hrs 11 mins (2004-03-08 17:42:43 GMT) Post-grading
--------------------------------------------------

Ailish,

Thanks for the points and kind words.

Yes, he\'s creative but he\'s also a \"sailor\" or mariner ... in that you don\'t actually go \"straigth\" into the sea [i.e. at a 90 degree angle to the wave] because with any flattish bottomed boat you\'re gonna know all about it [our Donzi\'s baptized name was \"Green Flash\", more often referred to as \"Green Bash\" in rough seas!]. In fact you do take the wave a bit at an angle [i.e. \"a tick over tack\" but not quite \"on the nose\"], say to starboard, and correct in a sort of horizontal see-saw by steering to port when you are on the crest of the wave so you don\'t end up lying ahull in the trough, but, rather, can take the next wave the same way.

Feeling seasick already ... :)

Dee

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 9 hrs 13 mins (2004-03-08 17:43:51 GMT) Post-grading
--------------------------------------------------

OOps typo: \"straiGHt\" into the seas!

Hermeneutica
Switzerland
Local time: 07:47
Specializes in field
Native speaker of: Native in SpanishSpanish, Native in EnglishEnglish
PRO pts in category: 4
Grading comment
David had it too, but your explanation was superb, what's more you ingeniously untangled the Spanish sailor's thinking prcesses:-) The translation is in fact very good technically (very few problems of this type), just linguistically problematic:-) You may be interested in seeing the comment I made in the ES-EN question. Basically I feel I have to avoid purely sailing terminology, as this is a motorboat without sails, and 'amurado' only came up in sailboat contexts.

Thanks to all for being such a terrific help:-)

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  Anjo Sterringa: YES see my explanation of the Spanish in the Sp-Eng question. I love the Dashew's sailing encyclopedia! Never heard of tick over tack - very creative translating that was, no wonder it has to be revised...
46 mins
  -> Thanks! Yes, I had seen it ...

agree  Vicky Papaprodromou
1 hr
  -> Thanks Vicky!
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