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zoot suiters

Spanish translation: pachucos

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GLOSSARY ENTRY (DERIVED FROM QUESTION BELOW)
English term or phrase:zoot suiters
Spanish translation:pachucos
Entered by: xxxOso
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22:07 May 23, 2002
English to Spanish translations [PRO]
Art/Literary / language, linguistics, criticism
English term or phrase: zoot suiters
From kids and people my own age I picked up Pachuco. Pachuco (the language of the zoot suiters) is a language of rebelion, both against Standard Spanish and Standard English.
Erasmo Ramirez
Local time: 16:47
pachucos
Explanation:
Hola Erasmo,
Suena redundante ¿verdad? y es que "zoot suiters" y "pachucos" son sinónimos.
Mira este ejemplo:

"PACHUCOS. Pachucos are Mexican American adolescents, generally ages thirteen to twenty-two, who belonged to juvenile gangs from around the 1930s to the 1950s. Mainstream media referred to them in English as "zoot suiters." The Zoot-Suit Riots that had Los Angeles as their setting in June 1943 were so labeled because the press identified the confrontation as being between Mexican-American zoot suiters on the one hand, and United States servicemen and civilians on the other. Scholars speculate on the origins of pachuquismo (zoot suiterism). Some find connections between the pachucos and Spanish gypsies, between pachucos and the lower-class mixed-blood soldiers and civilians that settled the Borderlands during the late eighteenth and early nineteenth centuries, and between the pachucos and the poor and oppressed common folks that filled the ranks of armies such as those of Pancho (Francisco) Villaqv during the Mexican Revolutionqv of 1910. More immediate reasons advanced for the rise of pachuquismo include the social dislocation associated with the rapid process of urbanization experienced by Mexican Americansqv during the 1930s through the mid-twentieth century, youth hostility toward the traditions of an older generation, racism against Mexican Americans, the spread of drugs into Mexican-American enclaves, and the process of Americanization gone awry. The fact that the zoot-suit style prevailed among American youths at large and that the era of World War IIqv saw an increase in juvenile delinquency may also have contributed to the emergence of pachuquismo. "

Buena suerte y saludos del Oso ¶:^)
Selected response from:

xxxOso
Grading comment
Thank you very much Dear Oso! I always thought both terms meant the same, but one never knows. I decided not to translate it, though it seems redundant, I preferred to keep the different connotations both words have, as to make the difference between the borderlands (Mexico and USA). Besides I have learnt a great deal...
4 KudoZ points were awarded for this answer

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Summary of answers provided
5 +10pachucosxxxOso
4 +2seguidores/partidarios/creyentes de Zoot Suit
Terry Burgess
4 +1zoot suiters
Fernando Muela
4To the whole mexican-american tribe...
Ramón Solá


  

Answers


3 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5 peer agreement (net): +2
seguidores/partidarios/creyentes de Zoot Suit


Explanation:
No tengo información sobre "Zoot Suit" (creo que fue una película de cine)..pero la buscaré. Mientras tanto, esta sería mi sugerencia Erasmo.
Suerte!
terry

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 2002-05-23 22:20:45 (GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

Aún que sea en inglés Erasmo, aquí te pongo más información:

http://members.tripod.com/~noemigarcia/lapaint/zootsuit.htm

ZOOT SUIT

The culture and language of Mexican immigrants labeled them as outsiders by the dominant society (Dieppa, 7). Most of the new arrivals respected the boundaries that existed, but the second generation found them hard to abide. Attracted by the downtown shopping districts, beaches, and glamour of Hollywood, many of the members of the second generation broke the unwritten rules that forbade their presence in these places. This pachuco generation attracted the negative attention of the Anglo-American population (McWilliams, 103). During the Second World War and after the Japanese were placed in internment camps, the Chicano in his Zoot Suit became a visible foe. The newspapers helped perpetuate this negative view of Mexican Americans.
Newspapers in the Los Angeles area had depicted Mexican Americans negatively months prior to the riots. A 1957 study showed that there was a shift in usage of the term \"Mexican\" to \"zoot-suiter\" in Los Angles papers in the months before and after the riots (Turner and Surace, 19). This change was made because an \"unambiguously unfavorable symbol is required as the rallying point for hostile crowd behavior\" (Turner and Surace, 19). The press used the term ‘zoot suit’ to attack Mexican Americans because the term evoked the image of a devious person without blatantly attacking this racial group. This type of journalism helped instigate the riots.

Suerte!
terry


    Exp.
Terry Burgess
Mexico
Local time: 15:47
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish
PRO pts in pair: 3315

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  Thierry LOTTE: I am learning many things on this site
51 mins
  -> me too Thierry!!!---thank you:-)))

agree  Esther Hermida
55 mins
  -> Muchas gracias Esther:-)))
Login to enter a peer comment (or grade)

4 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 5/5 peer agreement (net): +10
pachucos


Explanation:
Hola Erasmo,
Suena redundante ¿verdad? y es que "zoot suiters" y "pachucos" son sinónimos.
Mira este ejemplo:

"PACHUCOS. Pachucos are Mexican American adolescents, generally ages thirteen to twenty-two, who belonged to juvenile gangs from around the 1930s to the 1950s. Mainstream media referred to them in English as "zoot suiters." The Zoot-Suit Riots that had Los Angeles as their setting in June 1943 were so labeled because the press identified the confrontation as being between Mexican-American zoot suiters on the one hand, and United States servicemen and civilians on the other. Scholars speculate on the origins of pachuquismo (zoot suiterism). Some find connections between the pachucos and Spanish gypsies, between pachucos and the lower-class mixed-blood soldiers and civilians that settled the Borderlands during the late eighteenth and early nineteenth centuries, and between the pachucos and the poor and oppressed common folks that filled the ranks of armies such as those of Pancho (Francisco) Villaqv during the Mexican Revolutionqv of 1910. More immediate reasons advanced for the rise of pachuquismo include the social dislocation associated with the rapid process of urbanization experienced by Mexican Americansqv during the 1930s through the mid-twentieth century, youth hostility toward the traditions of an older generation, racism against Mexican Americans, the spread of drugs into Mexican-American enclaves, and the process of Americanization gone awry. The fact that the zoot-suit style prevailed among American youths at large and that the era of World War IIqv saw an increase in juvenile delinquency may also have contributed to the emergence of pachuquismo. "

Buena suerte y saludos del Oso ¶:^)


    Reference: http://www.tsha.utexas.edu/handbook/online/articles/view/PP/...
xxxOso
Native speaker of: Native in SpanishSpanish
PRO pts in pair: 9863
Grading comment
Thank you very much Dear Oso! I always thought both terms meant the same, but one never knows. I decided not to translate it, though it seems redundant, I preferred to keep the different connotations both words have, as to make the difference between the borderlands (Mexico and USA). Besides I have learnt a great deal...

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  Henry Hinds: Precisamente.
4 mins
  -> Graaaacias compa ¶:^))

agree  ROLANDO A. HERNANDEZ: Tal, cual, aunque quizas "pachuco" tambien necesite una explicacion posterior.
38 mins
  -> Muchas gracias Rolando ¶:^))

agree  Terry Burgess: y pensar que yo siempre creía que "los pachucos" eran oriundos de Pachuca, Hidalgo:-)))
47 mins
  -> JAAA!!! ¶:^D!! ¡Ese mi Terry! ¶:^D!!!

agree  Thierry LOTTE: Enhorabuena Oso ! me aprendes muchas cosas ! Gracias.
51 mins
  -> ¡Qué amable Thierry! ¡Muchas gracias! ¶:^))

agree  Esther Hermida
53 mins
  -> Mil gracias Esther ¶:^))

agree  Carlos Moreno
1 hr
  -> Muy agradecido Carlos ¶:^))

agree  Virgilio Chavez-De la Torre
1 hr
  -> Gracias mil Virgilio ¶:^))

agree  Haydée González
1 hr
  -> Muchas gracias Haydée ¶:^))

agree  Baruch Avidar: 100% right
6 hrs
  -> ¡Mil gracias Bar! ¶:^))

agree  ritchi
1 day5 mins
  -> Mil gracias ritchi ¶:^))
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5 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5 peer agreement (net): +1
zoot suiters


Explanation:
No he encontrado ninguna traducción. En la página de abajo tienes una explicación del término.
Suerte.


    Reference: http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/amex/zoot/esp_filmmore/fd.html
Fernando Muela
Spain
Local time: 22:47
Native speaker of: Native in SpanishSpanish
PRO pts in pair: 922

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  Thierry LOTTE: Peux tu me dire si le musicien (de Jazz et noir américain) dont le nom est "Zoot Sims" a qqchose à voir avec les "pachucos" ou si "zoot" est simplement "a jiving term".
53 mins
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11 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5
To the whole mexican-american tribe...


Explanation:
If you want to learn more about "pachucos", you may benefit from reading "El laberinto de la soledad" by the Mexican Nobel Prize winner Octavio Paz... and by watching old Tin-tan films.

Ramón Solá
Local time: 15:47
Native speaker of: Native in SpanishSpanish
PRO pts in pair: 3952
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