French to English translations [PRO]
Tech/Engineering - Aerospace / Aviation / Space | | French term or phrase: pale de l'aube | invention for jet turbine
I know that generally speaking "pale" and "aube" both translate as "vane" in this context. However, in this case the drafter uses both terms, and then uses both terms in the same phrases, where it is clear that she means different things by the two terms - examples:
"Du fait de l’orientation de la résultante des forces aérodynamiques s’exerçant sur l’aube, ces frottements sont localisés au niveau de la partie de la plateforme située du côté de l’intrados de la pale de l’aube, à savoir la partie de la plateforme en regard de la portion de l’orifice portant la référence numérique sur la figure 8..."
"Comme mentionné précédemment, chaque aube comprend une partie pale de part et d’autre de laquelle sont disposées une plateforme radialement interne et une plateforme radialement externe..." |
|  MpomaKudoZ activityQuestions: 383 ( 1 open) ( 4 without valid answers) ( 16 closed without grading) Answers: 45
| Local time: 16:50
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| | English translation:blade of the vane | Explanation:
In the documents that I translate from English to French (pumps, turbines, propellers), most glossaries specify:
blade=pale (for a propeller or a fan for example)
vane=aube (for a pump, turbine, wheel, etc)
even though Webster for example considers them synonyms (but dictionaries often have a larger definition of a synonym, technically ones word=one concept implies two words=2 concepts)
As your specific device seems to act both like a propeller and a turbine, it may have both parts, and it has indeed per the French description.
The other advantage is that a "blade" may have an "intrados" like the blade of a propeller.
If the source document is consistent, and it probably is, else should not be able to describe properly the device, you should be able to render it in English as clearly as it is in French.
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Note added at 3 heures (2011-06-13 17:00:09 GMT)
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If we look at the traditional "roue à aubes" then the most common occurrence of the "aube" is flat, but I am sure that this is not always true.
The blade is rather complex in shape in most occurrences: fans, propellers, etc, although there are fans with flat blades also, so nothing is really simple.
My idea was to match 2 English terms with 2 different French terms, and to use for that some common glossaries, because in French also one man's "pale" could be an other man's "aube".
The device described seems complex enough and could be described with "blade assembly" that could have a vane, because you are right tehre is no reason to have a vane inside a blade rather than a blade inside a vane, except that I mentioned the most common translation of "pale de l'aube", that may flawed in the French source |
| Selected response from:
 Didier Fourcot
Local time: 17:50
| Grading comment thanks... also see Bourth's remarks
3 KudoZ points were awarded for this answer |
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| Discussion entries: 0 |
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Automatic update in 00:
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15 mins confidence:   peer agreement (net): +1 blade of propeller
Explanation:
pale= [aviat.] Alignement des pales: sur un hélicoptère, contrôle et réglage au sol des pales du ou des rotors de manière qu'elles soient toutes contenues dans le plan de rotation.
(Anglais: tracking).
aube = Palette d'une roue de moulin à eau, d'une turbine, etc.
Difficultés orthographiques
une roue à aubes.
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2 hrs confidence: peer agreement (net): +1 blade of the vane
Explanation:
In the documents that I translate from English to French (pumps, turbines, propellers), most glossaries specify:
blade=pale (for a propeller or a fan for example)
vane=aube (for a pump, turbine, wheel, etc)
even though Webster for example considers them synonyms (but dictionaries often have a larger definition of a synonym, technically ones word=one concept implies two words=2 concepts)
As your specific device seems to act both like a propeller and a turbine, it may have both parts, and it has indeed per the French description.
The other advantage is that a "blade" may have an "intrados" like the blade of a propeller.
If the source document is consistent, and it probably is, else should not be able to describe properly the device, you should be able to render it in English as clearly as it is in French.
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Note added at 3 heures (2011-06-13 17:00:09 GMT)
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If we look at the traditional "roue à aubes" then the most common occurrence of the "aube" is flat, but I am sure that this is not always true.
The blade is rather complex in shape in most occurrences: fans, propellers, etc, although there are fans with flat blades also, so nothing is really simple.
My idea was to match 2 English terms with 2 different French terms, and to use for that some common glossaries, because in French also one man's "pale" could be an other man's "aube".
The device described seems complex enough and could be described with "blade assembly" that could have a vane, because you are right tehre is no reason to have a vane inside a blade rather than a blade inside a vane, except that I mentioned the most common translation of "pale de l'aube", that may flawed in the French source
| Didier Fourcot
Local time: 17:50
Works in field
Native speaker of:  French
PRO pts in category: 3
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| | Grading comment | thanks... also see Bourth's remarks |
| Notes to answerer
Asker: thanks for your answer and I note that you are French mother tongue and work in the field... but I don't get a good conception of what picture this expression "pale de l'aube" conjures up for you, or what the difference between the two terms is... I'm not convinced, for example, that in English a "vane" cannot have a concave side and convex side. Are you saying that for you an "aube" cannot have a concave side and convex side? For my part I am beginning to suspect that the drafting is using one of these terms in an unorthodox way: it could be that "aube" = "ensemble aube"/"blade assembly" or some such. What do you think?
Asker: ... or rather "vane assembly"... one could then possibly talk of "the blade of the vane assembly", etc.
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| Reference: Jet engine?
Reference information:
or something similar?
In the days when I worked for SNECMA, manufacturer of military jet engines and also the CFM engine for civilian aircraft, pale generally referred to the vane/blade of a rotor (like a propellor) in the engines while aube referred to the static or stator vane, the "guide vane" which restabilizes the turbulent flow downstream of the rotor vane.
However, a vane is a complex beast, and as your text says has these plateformes at either end which, presumably, play no role in the air effect. Consequently the aube can be said to have an "active" part, referred to as pale and a couple of non-active parts constituting the rest of the aube.
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Note added at 7 hrs (2011-06-13 20:49:49 GMT)
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Now the ROTOR BLADE EXIT AND STATOR VANE inlet angles (Fig. ... Thus, the downstream stator vane inlet incidence angle without stator turning is shown in ...
books.google.com/books?isbn=0521819830...
as in a wing, or a ROTOR BLADE OR STATOR VANE of an axial compressor (US ... be burned to increase jet velocity and thus boost thrust for short periods. ...
articles.janes.com/extracts/indepth/jae.html
pulsejet engines to the ROTOR BLADE tips, and emergency ...... ROTOR VANE AND STATOR VANE system. 2. Inlet guide vane and STATOR VANE system ...
www.globalsecurity.org/military/library/policy/navy/nrtc/14...
is made up of a series of ALTERNATING ROTOR BLADE AND STATOR VANE stages. ... was necessary to eliminate compressor stall in turbojet engines. ...
www.tpub.com/content/aviation/14014/css/14014_131.ht
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Note added at 17 hrs (2011-06-14 06:53:03 GMT)
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Oops, sorry, missed your first line (too eager to get down to the nitty-gritty, obviously).
Didier has given an in-my-opinion correct/helpful answer. I just gave a long-winded explanation/corroboration!
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Note added at 1 day19 hrs (2011-06-15 08:29:16 GMT)
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Well, a blade is or can be a complex bit of engineering too, and it consists not just of the "blade" part in contact with the airflow but the "root" which secures it in the rotor hub. Depending whether compressor or turbine blades, they may have to withstand high temperatures, so they can be complex.
But yes, there is room for distinction between "blade" and "vane", though they are often used for the same thing (some of my refs above refer to "rotor vane and stator vane" where, theoretically and puristically they should probably say "rotor blade and stator vane".
| xxxBourth
France
Native speaker of:  English
PRO pts in category: 147
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| Note to reference poster
Asker: Excellent - Bourth to the rescue again. Yes, I did say at the start "jet turbine"... would you care to submit some sort of answer so I can give the points?
Asker: OK, so what I conclude from your last note is that "blade of the vane" is satisfactory for you, and I understand therefore that the terms "vane" and "blade" are distinct, in that a "vane" can conceivably be, as you put it, a complex beast, whereas a "blade" probably can't.
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