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choeur à sept pans rayonnants

English translation: seven-faceted choir


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GLOSSARY ENTRY (DERIVED FROM QUESTION BELOW)
French term or phrase:choeur à sept pans rayonnants
English translation:seven-faceted choir
Entered by: kashew
Options:
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08:13 Aug 31, 2011
French to English translations [PRO]
Architecture / ecclesiatical architecture
French term or phrase: choeur à sept pans rayonnants
The complete sentence is : L'aspect fortifié de l'édifice attire vite l'attention avec sa tour carrée, ses échauguettes crénelées et son portail principal orné de mâchicoulis. L'intérieur est très représentatif du gothique méridional, grande nef unique et choeur à sept pans rayonnants.
How would one translate orné de mâchicoulis ?
Hilary2
seven-faceted choir
Explanation:
the rayonnants probably refers to suns rays thro' stained glass.
Choir or apse?

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Note added at 1 heure (2011-08-31 09:19:43 GMT)
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The style being gothique rayonnant?

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Note added at 1 heure (2011-08-31 09:43:32 GMT)
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A find:
Eglise à trois vaisseaux de cinq travées, sans transept. Le choeur est composé d’ une travée droite et d’ une abside à sept pans.

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Note added at 1 heure (2011-08-31 09:46:21 GMT)
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http://www.ville-serignan.fr/Culture-Collegiale.php - is that the one?
Why are these questions always so secretive?
Selected response from:

kashew
France
Local time: 18:03
Grading comment
Selected automatically based on peer agreement.
4 KudoZ points were awarded for this answer



Summary of answers provided
5 +3seven-faceted choir
kashew
3 +2choir with seven radiating buttresses
B D Finch
4choir with seven facets and radiating buttresses
Christopher Crockett
1seven-sided choir with radiating chapelsxxxBourth


Discussion entries: 22





  

Answers


1 hr   confidence: Answerer confidence 5/5 peer agreement (net): +3
seven-faceted choir


Explanation:
the rayonnants probably refers to suns rays thro' stained glass.
Choir or apse?

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 1 heure (2011-08-31 09:19:43 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

The style being gothique rayonnant?

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 1 heure (2011-08-31 09:43:32 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

A find:
Eglise à trois vaisseaux de cinq travées, sans transept. Le choeur est composé d’ une travée droite et d’ une abside à sept pans.

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 1 heure (2011-08-31 09:46:21 GMT)
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http://www.ville-serignan.fr/Culture-Collegiale.php - is that the one?
Why are these questions always so secretive?

kashew
France
Local time: 18:03
Specializes in field
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish
PRO pts in category: 57
Grading comment
Selected automatically based on peer agreement.
Notes to answerer
Asker: All the answers were so interesting but as I don't know the church or in fact anything about church architecture, I've decided to use your translation.


Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  xxxBourth: Assuming "rayonnant" is redundant. Disagree with your light transmission theory tho', Sunshine.//I slipped that in too, as the IMF man said to the soubrette.
24 mins
  -> Not redundant - as I slipped in above - The style being "gothique rayonnant" A better assumption.

agree  Christopher Crockett: I like "facets," though I can't recall seeing it in the literature and can't think, at present, what else to call it.
4 hrs
  -> Thanks. // Polygonal might serve?

agree  Tony M
7 hrs
  -> Thanks
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2 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 3/5Answerer confidence 3/5 peer agreement (net): +2
choir with seven radiating buttresses


Explanation:
The church of Saint-Geniès in Cesseras, Hérault is described as having an "abside à pans rayonnants" If you search for "Cesseras, Place Saint-Geniès" on Google-maps, and plonk yourself down by the church, you can see that it has substantial buttresses to the exterior of the apse. (The Wikipedia webpage picture is of a different church).


    Reference: http://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cesseras
B D Finch
France
Local time: 18:03
Works in field
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish
PRO pts in category: 71

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  Yolanda Broad
1 hr
  -> Thanks Yolanda

agree  Christopher Crockett: I can't think of what else "pans" could be referring to --it's an unusual term.
2 hrs
  -> Thanks Christopher.
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33 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 1/5Answerer confidence 1/5
seven-sided choir with radiating chapels


Explanation:
Total guesswork based on Google word-hits!

https://www.msu.edu/~wursterj/architecture.htm - Cached
It is also considered the most splendid of all Rayonnant churches. The Rayonnant ... The CHOIR-END IS SEVEN SIDED, with ambulatory and seven radiating chapels. ...

www.archimon.nl/overijssel/lattropsimon.html - Cached
The church of Lattrop was built in 1925-1926 to replace a previous building dating from 1818 ... The CHOIR is narrower than the nave and HAS A SEVEN-SIDED APSE. ...

books.google.com/books?isbn=0824044444...William W. Kibler - 1995 - History - 1047 pages
In 1 1 19, Henry 1 of England burned the original church, dedicated in 1076-77. ... The four-bay 13th- 14th-century CHOIR TERMINATES IN A SEVEN-SIDED EAST END ...

books.google.com/books?isbn=0415173612...Adrian J. Boas - 1999 - History - 267 pages
The parish church of 'Atlit near the south-east corner of the faubourg is similar in layout, consisting of a single square nave with a SEVEN-SIDED CHOIR and ...

books.google.com/books?isbn=1860113540...Dana Facaros, Michael Pauls - 2007 - Travel - 472 pages
The church under the mighty stone steeple isSt-Jean Baptiste, endowed with an elegant SEVEN-SIDED CHOIR of 1470 and the Christ Monumental by Zadkine, ...

www.archive.org/stream/.../medievalarchitec092port_djvu.txt
It was above all the age of the degradation of the Church. ...... The SEVEN- SIDED CHOIR is without side aisles, but is supplied with NINE RADIATING CHAPELS. ...

Unless the architecture is deemed to be of the Rayonnant style.

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Note added at 6 hrs (2011-08-31 14:54:24 GMT)
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Might it not be this seven-bay/seven-panelled choir

http://www.culture.gouv.fr/Wave/image/memoire/2123/sap01_mh0...

identified here
http://www.culture.gouv.fr/public/mistral/memoire_fr?ACTION=...

as being in Sainte Eulalie Church, Cruzy.


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Note added at 7 hrs (2011-08-31 15:16:47 GMT)
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naturalstonespecialist.com/information/documents/Awards_RandR.pdf
File Format: PDF/Adobe Acrobat - Quick View
26 Nov 2010 – archaeological analysis carried out during the works. The current SEVEN-BAY CHOIR enlarged an earlier, smaller Choir with apsidal east ends.

www.archive.org/stream/.../americanecclesia46cathuoft_djvu....
Downside Abbey, possessing a SEVEN-BAY CHOIR, will, when finished, be replete with practically every appur- tenance advocated in this article; the more ...



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Note added at 7 hrs (2011-08-31 15:17:28 GMT)
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Choir composed of seven radial bays??

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Note added at 7 hrs (2011-08-31 15:22:17 GMT)
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Or "radiating bays" as here:

books.google.com/books?isbn=1900639270...Richard Barber - 1999 - Travel - 334 pages
The builders of the church left in position the old outer walls, with their uncut stones, ... The chapel is circular, with three RADIATING BAYS, ...

serdar-hizli-art.com/architecture.../gothic_architecture_france.htm - Cached
... outlined in the foregoing chapter the church builders of France led the way. ... The difficult vaulting over the RADIATING BAYS of the double ambulatory was here ...

The apse also is restrained in character. It consists of a decorative background of SEVEN RADIATING BAYS with an ascending carved screenwork of white Caen stone.
http://www.visit-newyork-online.com/points_of_interest_nyc.h...


xxxBourth
Local time: 18:03
Works in field
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish
PRO pts in category: 535

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
neutral  Tony M: Seven-sided, but probably not with chapels / Pretty sure it is; I supposed 'arranged in a semi-circle' precludes other possible, more bizarre layouts. As it has only a single nave, it can't be that big, and chapels would stick out ;-)
7 mins
  -> That's the difficulty. Unless "rayonnant" is simply pleonastic (anything seven-sided is likely to be of a radial disposition!)

neutral  B D Finch: That was my first thought, and it is difficult to think what could radiate from the choir other than chapels. However, one would not usually refer to chapels as "pans".
24 mins
  -> Wasn't suggesting that "pans" means "chapels". Maybe "rayonnant" is simply redundant as I said to Tony.

neutral  Christopher Crockett: Except that Capestang doesn't have "radiating chapels": http://3.bp.blogspot.com/__rS3lt4A9Xs/SfW3oogNVeI/AAAAAAAAAf...
4 hrs
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5 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5
choir with seven facets and radiating buttresses


Explanation:
"L'intérieur est très représentatif du gothique méridional, grande nef unique et choeur à sept pans rayonnants."

"The interior (or, technically, the ground plan) is a typical example of southern Gothic: a wide nave without side aisles and an apse with seven facets and radiating buttresses."

"nef" here is not the "nave" as such, but something like "vessel" and could refer to both the "nave" and the "side aisles" --the latter not being present, so "nef unique" means something like "a large central vessel (or nave), without side aisles."

The only thing wrong with this brilliant theory is that there *do* appear, at first glance, to be side aisles at Capestang:

http://unexcusedabsenses.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/05/Pan_...

Unless those are lateral chapels which open onto the nave.

Which, indeed, appears to be the case.

Here

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-lGg3uzXU7js/TcXCAjUDIKI/AAAAAAAAAw...

is an exterior shot taken of the north side of the church --the square tower is on the south side, the apse is on the left, the nave is wide, but quite short (only two bays).

I *think* that there are two chapels on the north side --they do not, strictly speaking, constitute a side aisle, because there is an intervening buttress between (and separating) them. I.e., one cannot pass from one chapel to the other (through the buttress), so we don't have a "side aisle" as such.

I don't think that "facets" is the right term --but I can't think of anything else at present, except for a simple "seven-sided apse."

The fortress-like appearance of the church (and its actually fortifications) is also quite typically of 13th c. Gothic in Languedoc --the "Albigensian Crusade" of the early decades of the 13th c. was just winding down, and the region was still in the process of being "pacified" by the "orthodox" "crusaders" from the North. Many (most?) 13th c. churches in this region have this formidable, "militant" aspect to them (most clearly seen at Albi itself: http://toulouseaccomodation.com/images/albi1.jpg

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Note added at 5 hrs (2011-08-31 14:07:25 GMT)
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Another shot of the "fortress church" at Albi:

http://chscott.com/2001web/images/Albi - Cathedral.jpg

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Note added at 5 hrs (2011-08-31 14:11:42 GMT)
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I don't know what else to call "mâchicoulis" than the perfectly good (but not at all well known) English word, "machicolation" --you could say something like "crenelations and overhanging machicolations," which would be, strictly speaking, redundant, but might add a bit of clarity to an unusual term.

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Note added at 1 day9 hrs (2011-09-01 17:22:23 GMT)
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Since I have qualms about using the term "facets," I'll change my suggested answer to "a wide nave without side aisles and an heptagonal (7-sided) apse."

I still don't see any "choir" here.


    Reference: http://3.bp.blogspot.com/__rS3lt4A9Xs/SfW3oogNVeI/AAAAAAAAAf...
    Reference: http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-lGg3uzXU7js/TcXCAjUDIKI/AAAAAAAAAw...
Christopher Crockett
Local time: 12:03
Specializes in field
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish
PRO pts in category: 71
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Sep 14, 2011 - Changes made by kashew:
Created KOG entryKudoZ term => KOG term


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