English translation: registered origin: [Lausanne & Sumiswald]
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The asker opted for community grading. The question was closed on 2011-10-27 14:54:09 based on peer agreement (or, if there were too few peer comments, asker preference.)
French to English translations [Non-PRO] Law/Patents - Certificates, Diplomas, Licenses, CVs / Swiss livret de famille
French term or phrase:originaire de
Children listed in this "family book" as follows:
xxx, originaire de Lausanne VD et Sumiswald BE
lieu et date de naissance: Lausanne [date]
The child was born in Lausanne, so I cannot say born at Lausanne and Sumiswald, and "native of" would seem equally clumsy.
The child's father has the same details: originaire de Lausanne VD et Sumiswald BE
whilst for the mother: originaire d'Italie
How can this be sensibly translated without a seeming contradiction? - I have never heard of a birth record saying that a person is from 2 different towns!
Explanation: I was faced with this conundrum a while ago. It is indeed a Swiss peculiarity: place of birth and place of origin are separate things or concepts and lead to you being able to be born one place and "originaire de" somewhere else.
(The mother's "originaire d'Italie" by contrast is just the normal "from".)
See Wikipedia entry on Swiss nationality:
"Each Swiss is a citizen of his place or community of origin, his canton of origin and the Confederation, in this order: a Swiss citizen is defined as someone who has the citizenship of a Swiss municipality (art. 37 of the Swiss Federal Constitution). He is entered in the family register of his place of origin. ***The place of origin is the place where the family (usually the father) comes from. It is not to be confused with the place of birth. The place of origin can be the same as the place of birth, but this is not necessarily the case.***" http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Swiss_nationality_law
What adds an additional layer of complexity here is that Lausanne and Sumiswald are two different municipalities/cantons. This might be due to a development whereby you can register with the community of origin of both your father and mother - just a guess. In any case, it's a civil notion different to the "natural" fact of where you were born.
(nb. I wouldn't call this a non-pro question)
-------------------------------------------------- Note added at 7 hrs (2011-10-23 22:21:50 GMT) --------------------------------------------------
Reading the discussion more closely, you say that the father is also "originaire de" Lausanne & Sumiswald, which means his dual origin is just being transferred to his son.
-------------------------------------------------- Note added at 7 hrs (2011-10-23 22:41:41 GMT) --------------------------------------------------
(PS: Since this is a peculiarly Swiss notion, there may be different ways you would want to put it in English, mine is just a suggestion - ie the 100% certainty is about what this means, not that there's only one way to translate it.)
Thanks, but it would not work - born in Lausanne and originally from Lausanne and Sumiswald in the case of the child. and born in France and originally from Lausanne and Sumiswald in the case of the father.....
I think the only option is "from"
That said, I suppose that in answer to your question, you cannot alter the fact of what is stated. You need to find a way of translating "originaire de" without it committing you to the ridiculous suggestion that the person was born oin two places at once! Further, the problem is soved later as it were when the palce of birth is specified.
Suggestion :
"xxx, FROM Lausanne VD and Sumiswald BE
place and date of birth : Lausanne [date]"
I suspect it means that the birth has been registered in both places, one being the actual birth place and the other perhaps the parents domicile. That's me repeating myself and who cares anyway as your next problem is the translation of "reçu". The idea will have to make sense as a whole. Grr, I hate little words like this, often tricky!!!
Note that Lausanne is in the Canton of Vaud and Sumiswald in the canton of Berne. Just a note to say that no longer referred to as ["livret" de famille] but "certificat" now.
Le livret ou certificat de famille sert à prouver l'état de famille (liens familiaux des membres de la famille, état civil des parents) de son ou sa titulaire à l'égard de certaines autorités (p.ex. le contrôle des habitants ou les autorités de l'état civil). Il est remis aux époux ou aux personnes seules lorsqu'ils fondent une famille (lors de la naissance ou de l'adoption d'un enfant).
Ce document peut être obtenu auprès de l'Office d'état civil de la commune d'origine.
the father was born in France, and the mother in Italy, but I have just noticed on the livret de famille it says:
reçue dans les droits de cité de Lausanne VD et Sumiswald BE
I have no other "clues"
Might this not be something to do with the actual birth place and the domicile of the parents at the date of birth being different?
Perhaps the child was born in Lausanne and parental domicile at that time was Sumiswald?
My children were born in Vannes but at the time I was living in a little village on the coast. If I need a borth certificate, then Vannes is given as the palce of birth. However, the Livret de Famille is drawn up by the Town Hall of the commune where I lived at the time.
My experience realtes to France, but it may be a starter.
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Answers
7 hrs confidence: peer agreement (net): +2
registered origin: [Lausanne & Sumiswald]
Explanation: I was faced with this conundrum a while ago. It is indeed a Swiss peculiarity: place of birth and place of origin are separate things or concepts and lead to you being able to be born one place and "originaire de" somewhere else.
(The mother's "originaire d'Italie" by contrast is just the normal "from".)
See Wikipedia entry on Swiss nationality:
"Each Swiss is a citizen of his place or community of origin, his canton of origin and the Confederation, in this order: a Swiss citizen is defined as someone who has the citizenship of a Swiss municipality (art. 37 of the Swiss Federal Constitution). He is entered in the family register of his place of origin. ***The place of origin is the place where the family (usually the father) comes from. It is not to be confused with the place of birth. The place of origin can be the same as the place of birth, but this is not necessarily the case.***" http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Swiss_nationality_law
What adds an additional layer of complexity here is that Lausanne and Sumiswald are two different municipalities/cantons. This might be due to a development whereby you can register with the community of origin of both your father and mother - just a guess. In any case, it's a civil notion different to the "natural" fact of where you were born.
(nb. I wouldn't call this a non-pro question)
-------------------------------------------------- Note added at 7 hrs (2011-10-23 22:21:50 GMT) --------------------------------------------------
Reading the discussion more closely, you say that the father is also "originaire de" Lausanne & Sumiswald, which means his dual origin is just being transferred to his son.
-------------------------------------------------- Note added at 7 hrs (2011-10-23 22:41:41 GMT) --------------------------------------------------
(PS: Since this is a peculiarly Swiss notion, there may be different ways you would want to put it in English, mine is just a suggestion - ie the 100% certainty is about what this means, not that there's only one way to translate it.)
Melissa McMahon Australia Local time: 17:33 Works in field Native speaker of: English PRO pts in category: 6
The translation workplace 
peer agreement (net): +2
