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mise en crise (des images)

English translation: staging a crisis

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GLOSSARY ENTRY (DERIVED FROM QUESTION BELOW)
French term or phrase:mise en crise (des images)
English translation:staging a crisis
Entered by: Cath St Clair
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11:56 Feb 15, 2008
French to English translations [PRO]
Art/Literary - Cinema, Film, TV, Drama
French term or phrase: mise en crise (des images)
I need some creative input here!

This is a key phrase - used only once in the article but also in the title: 'Le Mariage des Bénis - Du « trop plein de sens » à la *mise en crise* des images'.

This is a play on words, as the main character of Mohsen Makhmalbaf's film is mentally disturbed from being on the front line, so he has occasional 'crises (de folie)'. I am trying to translate these in a respectful manner as 'bouts of mental illness' or something similar, so the play on words will most likely not exist in English.

The meaning of this phrase lies in this sentence:
'Hyper-signifiant, devenant presque « trop plein de sens », et singulièrement courageux, Le Mariage des Bénis est aussi une subtile *mise en crise* du statut et de la fonction des images dans le contexte post-révolutionnaire et porte plus généralement une réflexion sur le cinéma, ouverte et sans réponse définitive.'

Any creative ideas?
Cath St Clair
Spain
Local time: 16:36
is also a subtle staging of a crisis, that of the status and function of images
Explanation:
The play on words is also with "mise en scène"-"mise en crise".

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Note added at 19 hrs (2008-02-16 07:15:58 GMT)
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...although one may wonder how a crisis of images may be subtely staged...

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Note added at 1 day2 hrs (2008-02-16 14:33:01 GMT)
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Hi Cath. I love this interaction between asker and all of us...
Selected response from:

Najib Aloui
Local time: 16:36
Grading comment
What a wonderful example of translator collaboration - I gained ideas and insight from every one of the answers proposed for this question. Thank you everyone. I used Najib's translation for the phrase in question, but special thanks is also due to Ormiston, whose 'undermining' I used later in the article to translate the same term.
4 KudoZ points were awarded for this answer

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Summary of answers provided
4 +1From excess meaning to the disordering of imagesFranck Le Gac
3 +1is also a subtle staging of a crisis, that of the status and function of imagesNajib Aloui
3 +1derangement
B D Finch
3images in revolt
ormiston
3(something along the lines of) feverish focus on
ormiston
2overloaded to breaking point
fourth
2to go from hyper-sanity to insanity because of the imagesMatthewLaSon
2from clarity to hallucination
fourth


Discussion entries: 3





  

Answers


3 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 2/5Answerer confidence 2/5
from clarity to hallucination


Explanation:
Cath
This is offered only in the hope that your own thought process is jogged a little, on the basis that nothing is impossible.
Other thoughts...whole/fractured,
a glass darkly, broken mirror, breakdown, shell-shocked, unmanned, foundering, split. "Sense and Over sensibility" (sorry!)

fourth
France
Local time: 17:36
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish
PRO pts in category: 4
Notes to answerer
Asker: Thanks, Fourth - I've got a whole bunch of ideas to work with - I'm going to sit down with pen and paper and see if I can make something work!

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37 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 3/5Answerer confidence 3/5
(something along the lines of) feverish focus on


Explanation:
Very hard ! almost impossible to slip in a reference to his moments of insanity!
do you think is there an idea of 'jeopardising' the role of images
and do you feel his 'almost too heavily charged with meaning' is even slightly critical ?


--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 6 hrs (2008-02-15 18:06:23 GMT)
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depends how much you can move away from the film critic's choice of words (some snappy ideas from Forth!). Are the quotations marks simply you drawing our attention to the phrases ?
To balance the ideas & the contrast, maybe "over(loaded with significance) vs under(mining) images ?

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 6 hrs (2008-02-15 18:18:06 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

and later "Although at times too heavily laden with meaning,...[the film also] subtly undermines the role of the images

ormiston
Local time: 17:36
Works in field
Native speaker of: English
PRO pts in category: 12
Notes to answerer
Asker: Hi Ormiston. I think 'trop plein des sens' is definitely critical - saying that the director is making his point a little too obviously at times (the point being that those who supported the Islamic revolution have now betrayed it). As for the images, 'jeopardising' is an interesting word to use. The director shows images (photos) being devalued. The main character is a photographer whose gritty reality shots are not printed in the papers, only decorative (meaningless) images.

Asker: I like your 'overloaded/undermining' combination - I'm going to play around with this for a while!

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19 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 2/5Answerer confidence 2/5
to go from hyper-sanity to insanity because of the images


Explanation:
Hello,

Is this person going from hyper-sanity (too much sanity/sense) to craziness (mise en crise) on account of the images he saw?


I hope this helps.

MatthewLaSon
Local time: 11:36
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish
PRO pts in category: 16
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20 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 3/5Answerer confidence 3/5
images in revolt


Explanation:
this sort of challenge becomes obsessive ! Cath to me the problem is that the invented title consists of two citations drawn from the text, so the 'de' and 'à' is misleading. Do you have to feature the 'heavy-handed' criticism bit in the title ?

ormiston
Local time: 17:36
Works in field
Native speaker of: English
PRO pts in category: 12
Notes to answerer
Asker: I agree that it becomes obsessive! I keep bouncing new suggestions off my husband, who has been laughing at me for expending so much energy 'trying to crack it' ;) However, it is to be included in an official publication for a film festival, so I want a solution I am happy with...

Asker: Btw, I quite agree with your comment - the title may work in French but might well be awkward in translation. It might be an option to alter the title depending on how I translate this key sentence - good suggestion.

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1 day0 min   confidence: Answerer confidence 3/5Answerer confidence 3/5 peer agreement (net): +1
derangement


Explanation:
Looking at the thesaurus, this seemed to me to be the best alternative; though I also wondered about "unbalancing".

" ... est aussi une subtile *mise en crise* du statut et de la fonction des images dans le contexte post-révolutionnaire ...":

"... is also a subtle derangement of the status and function of images/imagery ... ".



B D Finch
France
Local time: 17:36
Works in field
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish
PRO pts in category: 36

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  Najib Aloui: This should work, although it favors the subtle side and tempers the crisis
2 hrs
  -> Thanks. My intention was that the allusion to insanity (otherwise known as derangement) would be understood. As you note, it is milder than "crise", but us Brits are terribly phlegmatic.
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19 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 3/5Answerer confidence 3/5 peer agreement (net): +1
is also a subtle staging of a crisis, that of the status and function of images


Explanation:
The play on words is also with "mise en scène"-"mise en crise".

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 19 hrs (2008-02-16 07:15:58 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

...although one may wonder how a crisis of images may be subtely staged...

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 1 day2 hrs (2008-02-16 14:33:01 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

Hi Cath. I love this interaction between asker and all of us...

Najib Aloui
Local time: 16:36
Works in field
Native speaker of: Native in FrenchFrench
PRO pts in category: 4
Grading comment
What a wonderful example of translator collaboration - I gained ideas and insight from every one of the answers proposed for this question. Thank you everyone. I used Najib's translation for the phrase in question, but special thanks is also due to Ormiston, whose 'undermining' I used later in the article to translate the same term.
Notes to answerer
Asker: Hi Najib. 'one may wonder how a crisis of images may be subtely staged' I quite agree! My translation at one point was simply 'Marriage of the Blessed calls into question the status and function of images' - I thought this might be a simple middle ground between 'subtle' and 'crisis'! I like your suggestion though - I am going to play with it in context. Thanks.

Asker: Hi Najib - I have also enjoyed the interaction! I am extremely grateful for the rich and varied food for thought that has been served up here ;) I am currently working through the rest of the article before I make a final decision on the working of the title, as the subsequent discussion naturally adds much to the issue. A bientôt...


Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  Franck Le Gac: This reads quite well -I don't see such a contradiction bet. 'subtle' and 'crisis'. Makhmalbaf has done just that previously: creating the conditions (actors, events narrated…) that end up destabilizing the spectator's sense of what s/he is attending to.
1 day5 hrs
  -> Thank you, Franck. "Crisis" entails torment and agitation, a strong manifestation of pain and uneasiness, it's not a vague "malaise" which a subtle approach may tell...
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1 day4 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 2/5Answerer confidence 2/5
overloaded to breaking point


Explanation:
It's good to see the impossible attempted. Good for the soul

fourth
France
Local time: 17:36
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish
PRO pts in category: 4
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2 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5 peer agreement (net): +1
From excess meaning to the disordering of images


Explanation:
If you would like to have a play on words, but avoid making it too blatant on a subject matter such as this, I would suggest "disordering". "Mise en crise" is typical French film critic dialect, difficult to translate in English (and heavily dependent on the context), but it seems to me that disordering, which means "disturbing the regular or normal functions of" if I follow the Webster's, could work. It also echoes the "post-traumatic stress disorder" many soldiers experience returning from the front.

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 2 days2 hrs (2008-02-17 14:40:45 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

You're welcome, Cath - you did open Pandora's box with this question! My latest idea is that 'mise en' could also be translated as the initiation of a process, and therefore by the suffix '-ing', should you choose for a nominalized verb form (be it 'disordering' or another one). Good luck!

Franck Le Gac
Local time: 17:36
Specializes in field
Native speaker of: Native in FrenchFrench
PRO pts in category: 11
Notes to answerer
Asker: Hi Frank. Thanks for your comments - I'm glad I'm not the only one that has problems translating 'mise en crise' - it baffled me for quite a while. It helps to know that it has multiple possible translations - in that case, I can probably be quite free with it. Indeed, I will need to, in order to make it sound natural in English - I think anything too literal just won't work.


Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  Najib Aloui: It's not just disorder, it's also and mainly intense questioning ...Your proposal also could work since there is intent and thus questioning....
5 hrs
  -> Yes Najib, and that's why I suggested disordering, stronger than disorder (a state possibly devoid of active intention). I was also concerned that this is about the filmmaker's perspective, regardless of whether the viewers take up the questioning or not.
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