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16:17 Feb 6, 2012
French to English translations [PRO] Cooking / Culinary / menu
French term or phrase:salaison du Val d’Aoste
Hello all,
I could use some help with this term. It's part of the name of a starter dish on a menu:
"Cromesquis de St Marcellin et salaison du Val d’Aoste, petite salade à l’huile de noix"
I didn't know the word salaison before I came across this sentence, so to me, at first glance it looked like a cromesquis made with Saint-Marcellin cheese and "salaison," a mystery ingredient from Val d'Aoste. However, after having looked into the term, it seems to me that it is much more often (if not exclusively) used to refer to the actual method/process of curing or salting. So what I am wondering is if you think this is referring to some Val d'Aoste method of curing, or if it is indeed a cured meat from Val d'Aoste, and if so, what are your suggestions for translating it? Mine all seem kind of off-putting for a fancy menu" Aosta Valley salt meat," "Aosta Valley cured meat," etc.
Explanation: For maximum cachet, revert to the Italian (in English word order).:-)
What English-speaker who eats at a restaurant in this class would expect to see a term like "cured meat" on the menu in place of words like salame, prosciutto, lardo, etc.?
Salumi is the category term.
-------------------------------------------------- Note added at 12 hrs (2012-02-07 05:01:08 GMT) --------------------------------------------------
'Salumi valdostani' is what Italians might say, but then they know the place-name adjectives for their country.
-------------------------------------------------- Note added at 17 hrs (2012-02-07 09:44:31 GMT) --------------------------------------------------
Not *everything* you can buy at a salumeria is salumi, because these shops will probably sell cheese, olives, wine, etc. to go with it. But isn't it the same at a charcuterie?;-)
-------------------------------------------------- Note added at 17 hrs (2012-02-07 10:09:51 GMT) --------------------------------------------------
As Tony says, salaison can mean the process (IT salatura, EN salting) or the result (IT salumi, EN ???).
Before we *assume* that the raw ingredient is pork, let me point out that the link above to salumi in Valle d'Aosta also features motsetta, which is essentially the same as bresaola -- and made from beef.
-------------------------------------------------- Note added at 17 hrs (2012-02-07 10:10:28 GMT) --------------------------------------------------
is technically correct. But this is going on a menu, where things are decribed in a less clinical way. I would suggest something like "Aosta cured delicacy" (I am just extemporating here.)
Explanation: It would be helpful if we knew whether this was for US or UK.
Americans know this kind of meat as Prosciutto, even though we all know that only comes from one region of Italy, but they mix it up in the US :)
Depends also if the restaurant is Italian, you can get away with using Italian words for cache as mentioned in another post.
But you can't say 'meat' doesnt sound elegant. Also I'd point out that in the interests of the large numbers of people who do not eat pork, it's important to mention specifically that it is ham...
Cynthia Johnson France Local time: 02:33 Specializes in field Native speaker of: English
4 mins confidence: peer agreement (net): +5
Aosta cured meat
Explanation: 'Salaison' is of course both the process, and the result; one often comes across it in the plural, 'salaisons', meaning 'a selection ofr cured meats'.
Aosta is of course famous for its ham; but without checking with your customer, you'd better not use that, or risk over-interpretation, as it does of course produce other meat products.
-------------------------------------------------- Note added at 5 minutes (2012-02-06 16:23:37 GMT) --------------------------------------------------
Also depends how you treat the Saint-Marcellin; you might find 'cured meat from the Aosta Valley' rings better
-------------------------------------------------- Note added at 17 heures (2012-02-07 09:37:01 GMT) --------------------------------------------------
As several other people have pointed out, the use of 'meat' like this really doesn't work for a menu item — but as I have also cautioned elsewhere, anything more specific risks creating a translation error. Your only real solution is to check with the customer; if you can't, then I insist on the fact that something non-committal like this is the safest solution.
Cynthia raises an important point about pork: again 'cured pork products' isn't really any more appetizing on a menu — and of course do let's remember too that it mightn't necessarily be pork — the Italians also do cured beef, for example, and here in France we have the 'viande de grisons'.
-------------------------------------------------- Note added at 17 heures (2012-02-07 09:55:14 GMT) --------------------------------------------------
Looking at this from a practical point of view, I ask myself why did the chef choose to express it this way in the source text?
1) They were trying to be pretentious, and get away from saying anything as ordinary as ham
2) They were seeking to be non-committal, as what they put in the plate will depend on their incoming supplies
3) It isn't ham, but they were unsure about calling it by its proper name in case people didn't recognize what it was
4) They like the cachet offered by RK's 'salumi', but were afraid to stick their neck out quite that far.
Personally, and knowing chefs and restaurant managers as I do, I strongly suspect it is indeed ham and that the reason is #1
However, it's not safe to make that assumption without at least attempting to clear up the ambiguity.
Tony M France Local time: 02:33 Specializes in field Native speaker of: English PRO pts in category: 319
The translation workplace 
