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prier de quelque chose

English translation: The text should read: semblent avoir tous décidé de n’en point parler

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18:56 Mar 28, 2004
French to English translations [PRO]
Bus/Financial - Economics
French term or phrase: prier de quelque chose
"Mais l’attitude la plus surprenante reste celle des politiques en général qui, face à des enjeux aussi décisifs, semblent avoir tous décidé DE N'EN POINT PRIER ou de camper sur des concepts dépassés tels que le plein emploi."

This is from a entrance exam for a translation training program. It is an excerpt from a 1995 French press article which deals with changes in employment. From the context, it is these changes, more specifically the stakes - enjeux - related to the changes, "dont les politiques ne prient pas." Couldn't find it in dictionaries or as an expression in internet searches. French friends consulted weren't familiar with it. From the context, I would guess that it means "to pay little or no attention to" but that is just a guess. Thanks for any ideas!
Anna Fitzgerald
France
Local time: 10:59
English translation:The text should read: semblent avoir tous décidé de n’en point parler
Explanation:
teh text has clarely suffered 'Chinese whispers'

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Note added at 14 hrs 41 mins (2004-03-29 09:37:35 GMT)
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Le Monde, 22 mars 1995!
Selected response from:

Richard Nice
Germany
Local time: 10:59
Grading comment
You are right, thank you. I verified by buying the archived "Le Monde" article. I apologize for sending the rest of you on a wild goose chase. Nonetheless, the error is in the exam extract for the Diploma of Translation prep program at Cardiff University, so it is either a test of how the candidates deal with errors in the source text, or simply an unfortunate oversight. Again, I apologize.
3 KudoZ points were awarded for this answer

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Summary of answers provided
5 +2The text should read: semblent avoir tous décidé de n’en point parler
Richard Nice
5 +1to rely on something OR to have faith in somethingJane Lamb-Ruiz
5see comment
Hacene
4 +1not to hear anything about it >>>
hduverle
3to preach
Iolanta Vlaykova Paneva
3 -1not to be gradedxxxsarahl
1 +1COMMENT
Tony M


  

Answers


14 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 3/5Answerer confidence 3/5 peer agreement (net): -1
not to be graded


Explanation:
this sentence is very strange. Could it be that they're testing people to see how they cope with poorly written material? camper is misused here, for instance, and the que is redundant.
prier itself doesn't make sense afaik, but I can guess the meaning.
my 2 eurocents worth.

xxxsarahl
Local time: 01:59
Native speaker of: Native in FrenchFrench

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
disagree  hduverle: This sentence is written in 18th century-like style... that is why it looks strange
5 hrs
  -> I don't recognize 18th century French here.
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1 hr   confidence: Answerer confidence 5/5
see comment


Explanation:
but the most surprising is the political class general behaviour who, confronted with issues so important, seems to have decided not to give any praise to it/them (the innovation referred before, so if this part is plural then adjust) or to keep defending/protecting outdated concepts such as full employment.

n'en point prier = to give no praise
se camper sur = to settle on an idea

Hacene
United Kingdom
Local time: 09:59
Native speaker of: Native in FrenchFrench
PRO pts in category: 12

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
neutral  xxxsarahl: where did you see praise?
3 hrs
  -> n'en point prier = not to praise (haven't heard it much outside Le Puy and its region)
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25 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 5/5 peer agreement (net): +1
to rely on something OR to have faith in something


Explanation:
prier SUR quelque chose: to rely on something with blind devotion...arrived at by reading all the meanings for PRIER in the MONOLINGUAL dictionary

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Note added at 26 mins (2004-03-28 19:23:11 GMT)
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n\'en point prier ou camper sur

both take SUR, so it appears only once for elegance, there is no DE...ergo, it is prier sur....to pray to something is to rely on it..toi take something as a matter of faith

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Note added at 35 mins (2004-03-28 19:31:40 GMT)
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May I suggest you first read definitions in monolingual dictionaries before using bilingual ones? It improves one\'s B language and helps with translation to get the real B language meaning first before attempting to translate.

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Note added at 1 hr 10 mins (2004-03-28 20:06:27 GMT)
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prier sur; in this context you could say

to pay lip service to

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Note added at 1 hr 13 mins (2004-03-28 20:09:29 GMT)
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FINAL FINAL: to no longer PAY LIP service to...it just came to me

when you pray you move your lips sometimes..so in this context...it\'s no longer PAY LIP SERVICE TO OR emphasize

camper sur is to go on and on about something

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Note added at 1 hr 16 mins (2004-03-28 20:12:45 GMT)
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Note to Hacene

Il s\'agit de penser pas de dictionnaire. Maintenant, j\'ai encore reflechi et j\'ai trouve...

prier sur...to pay lip service to...voilà, de ma tête....J\'avais trouvé s\'addresser à pour prier sur...cela peut vouloir dire rely on puisque derrière l\'idée de prier il y a la foi....c\'est a dire to rely on..je suis désolée de mal m\'expliquer....mais c\'en est une des traductions possibles...la tradution ne se fait pas par les dicos...cela transite par la tête du traducteur...:)

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Note added at 5 hrs 20 mins (2004-03-29 00:17:17 GMT)
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Note to Dusty:

It\'s \"no longer pay lip service to NOR focus ON or emphasize....

I actually had the ne point above....see?? :)

Jane Lamb-Ruiz
Works in field
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish, Native in PortuguesePortuguese
PRO pts in category: 30

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  Vicky Papaprodromou
11 mins

neutral  Hacene: am sorry, but this is not what is meant here; have done some search on the word, canot find any reference anywhere to that meaning. Could you tell me which dictionary you are using?
29 mins
  -> mais oui prier sur quelque chose veut dire avoir une confiance aveugle dans le truc....

neutral  Tony M: I can't quite see your logic, Jane? For one thing, the construction with 'prier' is in the negative, contrasting with the positive 'camper sur'; and also, surely the 'de' comes from the 'en'? Please see my longer comment...
1 hr
  -> I forgot to add the no longer ne point faire quelque chose
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6 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 3/5Answerer confidence 3/5
to preach


Explanation:
to preach,to pronounce on...

Iolanta Vlaykova Paneva
Canada
Local time: 04:59
Works in field
Native speaker of: Bulgarian
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6 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5 peer agreement (net): +1
not to hear anything about it >>>


Explanation:
The meaning is not "pray for" or "praise". I remain puzzled by this expression that comes from 17th/18th classical French and takes here a fuzzy meaning...
Let's forget the prayers, and use the meaning "politely ask" as in "je vous prie d'agréer..." at the end of a letter.
I understand the point as if all the politicians agree not to think of the problem, simply ignore it and not look at the reality; They won't even include this question in their prayers to ask for a miracle (though the term does not imply - here - a religious meaning at all. Now, how to translate it.. "not even (dare) think of..." and don't speak to them about it.

Camper sur des concepts may look strange, as it is not recommended to put your tent on such moving grounds. However, the use of the word has moved from "camper sur des positions" (military idea) to "camper sur des idées" or "son point de vue" (political;... or personal ideas), to "concepts...!". Just hold it.
and try to stand firm on them!
in any case, this is not a real problem.

Unfortunately, I am not at home and cannot give any rock solid reference for that... pity...

hduverle
Local time: 04:59
Native speaker of: Native in FrenchFrench

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  Monique Laville: This seems to be the most interesting and logical answer. To note the contrast between decisive stakes and political class unconcern. Seems to be a twentieth century true story?
7 hrs
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2 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 1/5Answerer confidence 1/5 peer agreement (net): +1
COMMENT


Explanation:
I just wanted to use the space to comment at greater length on Jane's very interesting suggestion. I too thought of 'pay lip service too', but surely the logic of the sentence is that "it is surprising.. given the high stakes...that all the politicians have decided NOT to [prier de] or to [camper sur] outmoded concepts..."
I'm not convinced that the two verbs BOTH refer to the 'concepts dépassés', I rather feel the 'n'en point prier' ought to stand alone?
Anyone got any further thoughts?

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Note added at 2 hrs 10 mins (2004-03-28 21:06:48 GMT)
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Sorry: \"pay lip service TO...\"

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Note added at 2 hrs 26 mins (2004-03-28 21:22:50 GMT)
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Sorry: \"pay lip service TO...\"

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Note added at 11 hrs 59 mins (2004-03-29 06:55:27 GMT)
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In response to Jane\'s response (!), I\'m a little puzzled by your interpretation of \'ne..point\' as \'no LONGER\' (as if it were ne...plus) Is this usual, as I\'ve never personally come across this before --- I always thought \'ne...point\' was just an emphatic way of saying \'en aucune manière\' etc.
Any further enlightenment would be much appreciated --- gosh, I learn SO MUCH every day on KudoZ!

Tony M
France
Local time: 10:59
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish
PRO pts in category: 19

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  Jane Lamb-Ruiz: to NO LONGER pay lip service to..n'en point prier sur...it's in my final Dustry..I was just trying to sort out the PRIER SUR
3 hrs
  -> Thanks, Jane! Please see added further comment...
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2 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 5/5 peer agreement (net): +2
The text should read: semblent avoir tous décidé de n’en point parler


Explanation:
teh text has clarely suffered 'Chinese whispers'

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 14 hrs 41 mins (2004-03-29 09:37:35 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

Le Monde, 22 mars 1995!

Richard Nice
Germany
Local time: 10:59
Works in field
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish
PRO pts in category: 11
Grading comment
You are right, thank you. I verified by buying the archived "Le Monde" article. I apologize for sending the rest of you on a wild goose chase. Nonetheless, the error is in the exam extract for the Diploma of Translation prep program at Cardiff University, so it is either a test of how the candidates deal with errors in the source text, or simply an unfortunate oversight. Again, I apologize.

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  xxxsarahl: interesting idea. how about camper sur des concepts? we say camper sur ses positions, usually.
1 hr

agree  Jane Lamb-Ruiz: yes why not
2 hrs
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