English translation: that define status and profession/occupation
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13:08 Aug 30, 2011
French to English translations [PRO] Social Sciences - Government / Politics / Labour market discrimination
French term or phrase:qui élaborent des positions et des places
As part of my postgraduate studies in translation, I am translating a document about labour market discrimination towards migrant women in France. The document was published by the HALDE, the French anti-discrimination authority.
The phrase I am having difficulty with reads as follows:
"La discrimination se révèle et se démontre à travers des actes, des paroles, mais aussi au travers de procédures ; elle a pu s'installer de manière durable dans la succession d'orientations, de décisions, de propositions récurrents qui élaborent des positions et des places".
The phrase appears in a section about how migrant women may experience discrimination and how it may impact upon their lives.
My current translation reads:
"Discrimination becomes apparent and is visible not only through actions and words, but also through processes. It has become entrenched over time through the directions, decisions, and opportunities that determine people’s life chances."
I am happy adopting a fairly free approach to the translation, but would like to know if anyone else has any different interpretations of the phrase, particularly in relation to the last few words "des positions et des places". My understanding is that various series of events will determine where an individual ends up in the labour market, but I may have missed the point.
Explanation: I think that "elaborer" here is used in the sense of what gives form/shape to something, thus, "defines" in a sense; "position" can be an indication of status within an institution; "place" used here IMOP in the sense of job/ profession/ occupation
Points went to Timothy but thanks to both cc in nyc and Michael for their help as well.
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Answers
8 hrs confidence:
that define status and profession/occupation
Explanation: I think that "elaborer" here is used in the sense of what gives form/shape to something, thus, "defines" in a sense; "position" can be an indication of status within an institution; "place" used here IMOP in the sense of job/ profession/ occupation
Timothy Rake Local time: 09:09 Works in field Native speaker of: English PRO pts in category: 8
Grading comment
Thanks again Timothy - this got me thinking along different lines and although I didn't use your exact wording, I reworked the sentence as a result.
Notes to answerer
Asker: Thanks Timothy - the distinction between 'positions' and 'places' in this sense wasn't one I had considered. This would make sense in that not only the level to which people reach in their careers but also the particular occupations in which they reach that level are two different things. This is helpful, thanks!
Explanation: Or that lead to the creation of positions and openings.
IMO, the phrase is about the opportunities that are created ("positions and openings") rather than the effect they have on people ("people’s life chances").
Good luck with your course.
-------------------------------------------------- Note added at 10 hrs (2011-08-30 23:09:15 GMT) --------------------------------------------------
@ savtrad: How about "proposals" for "propositions"?
cc in nyc Local time: 12:09 Works in field Native speaker of: English PRO pts in category: 15
Notes to answerer
Asker: Thanks CC in NYC for your input - you may well be right! I may have to rework the sentence as I have already used the word 'opportunities' for 'propositions' earlier in the phrase. I'll wait to see if there any other comments, but thanks again!
Comme Tomithy, je ne suis pas sûr que la traduction littérale du terme "élaborer" propose la meilleure compréhension. A partir de là, nos deux suggestions sont assez proches...
Merci.
Michel F. Morin France Local time: 18:09 Specializes in field Native speaker of: French PRO pts in category: 42
The translation workplace 
