ProZ.com global directory of translation services
 The translation workplace
Ideas
KudoZ home » French to English » History

haro / crier haro

English translation: hue and cry - why?

Login or register (free and only takes a few minutes) to participate in this question.

You will also have access to many other tools and opportunities designed for those who have language-related jobs
(or are passionate about them). Participation is free and the site has a strict confidentiality policy.
14:20 Nov 30, 2007
French to English translations [PRO]
Social Sciences - History
French term or phrase: haro / crier haro
De ce fait, le cri de haro peut devenir une preuve de culpabilité, parce qu’il formalise une sorte de flagrant délit. Ainsi lorsqu’il devient partie intégrante d’une procédure judiciaire, le haro possède la faculté de prolonger le crime dans un présent artificiel propice à l’arrestation du criminel.

I'm quite puzzled with both these words "cri de haro" et "haro". How would you translate them ?
Julie BEILLE - FOLTZ
France
Local time: 07:48
English translation:hue and cry - why?
Explanation:
haro (Dr. anc.) 1. Cri par lequel on ameutait la foule contre un coupable [that's the bit we all know about], ou anction en justice par laquelle on mettait opposition sur quelque chose.
[Larousse Lexis]

That second bit is what comes in in the second part of your quote. For the meaning of "opposition" (binding) above, you might want to do a ProZ Term Search: it has been much discussed and oft misunderstood.

Bref, once the hue-and-cry chase through the streets has ended, and if the culprit has succeeded in getting away, the "hue and cry" phenomenon can be extended into the courtroom so that if and when the culprit is caught, hue-and-cry rules will apply, not - I think - due legal process. At the very least, a courtroom "hue and cry" keeps the crime "alive" and punishable. That is what is meant by "le haro possède la faculté de prolonger le crime dans un présent artificiel propice à l’arrestation du criminel".

From Dave: “What does hue and cry mean?”
[A] This idiom, meaning a loud clamour or public outcry, contains the obsolete word hue, which people these days know only as a slightly formal or technical word for a colour or shade. As a result, you sometimes see the phrase written as hew and cry.
Our modern meaning goes back to part of English common law in the centuries after the Norman Conquest. There wasn’t an organised police force and the job of fighting crime fell mostly on ordinary people. If somebody robbed you, or you saw a murder or other crime of violence, it was up to you to raise the alarm, the hue and cry. Everybody in the neighbourhood was then obliged to drop what they were doing and help pursue and capture the supposed criminal. If the criminal was caught with stolen goods on him, he was summarily convicted (he wasn’t allowed to say anything in his defence, for example), while if he resisted arrest he could be killed. THE SAME TERM WAS USED FOR A PROCLAMATION RELATING TO THE CAPTURE OF A CRIMINAL OR THE FINDING OF STOLEN GOODS. The laws relating to hue and cry were repealed in Britain in 1827.
This mysterious word hue is from the first part of the Anglo-Norman French legal phrase hu e cri. This came from the Old French hu for an outcry, in turn from huer, to shout. It seems that hue could mean any cry, or even the sound of a horn or trumpet — the phrase hu e cri had a Latin equivalent, hutesium et clamor, “with horn and with voice”.
As an etymological footnote, the Old French huer survived in Cornwall right down to the early twentieth century. At that time an important part of local livelihoods in coastal communities came from the seasonal catch of fish called pilchards, which migrated past the coast in great shoals in early autumn. To be sure of not missing their arrival, fishermen posted lookouts on the cliffs. They were called huers, since they commonly alerted the waiting fishermen by shouting through speaking trumpets.
http://www.worldwidewords.org/qa/qa-hue1.htm

Anyone participating in hue-and-cry had the right to arrest a criminal. In this context the carrying of arms was permitted and a criminal violently resisting arrest might be killed with impunity, but not otherwise – lynchings were very rare, and even wounding or killing a criminal to hinder flight was unlawful. VICTIMS OF CONSPICUOUS CRIMES (E.G. RAPES OR ASSAULTS) MIGHT ALSO RAISE HUE-AND-CRY, EVEN IF THE CULPRIT HAD ESCAPED, IN ORDER TO SUMMON THOSE WHO COULD WITNESS THE EFFECTS OF THE CRIME
http://www.trytel.com/~tristan/towns/glossary.html

Although regulated from time to time by writs and statutes, the process of hue and cry continued to retain its summary method of procedure, and proof was not required of a culprit's guilt, but merely that he had been taken red-handed by hue and cry. The various statutes relating to hue and cry were repealed in 1827 (7 and 8 Geo. IV. c. 27). The Sheriffs Act 1887, reenacting 3 Edw. I. c. 9, provides that every person in a county must be ready and apparelled at the command of the sheriff and at the cry of the county to arrest a felon, and in default shall on conviction be liable to a fine.
"HUE AND CRY" HAS, FROM ITS ORIGINAL MEANING, COME TO BE APPLIED TO A PROCLAMATION FOR THE CAPTURE OF AN OFFENDER OR FOR THE FINDING OF STOLEN GOODS, AND TO AN OFFICIAL PUBLICATION, ISSUED FOR THE INFORMATION OF THE AUTHORITIES INTERESTED, IN WHICH PARTICULARS ARE GIVEN OF OFFENDERS "WANTED," OFFENCES COMMITTED, &c.
http://www.1911encyclopedia.org/Hue_And_Cry


--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 1 hr (2007-11-30 15:31:48 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

The French use of the historical present is misleading. As your title suggests, this is purely historical. I don't know if or when it was repealed in France, but in the UK it was in 1827.
Selected response from:

xxxBourth
Local time: 07:48
Grading comment
Thanks for all these information.
Julie
4 KudoZ points were awarded for this answer



Summary of answers provided
4 +8hue and cry/to clamorxxxmistahara
4 +1hue and cry - why?xxxBourth
4public outrage/inveigh against sb
Carol Gullidge
4condemn someone publiclyrufinus


Discussion entries: 4





  

Answers


8 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5
condemn someone publicly


Explanation:
rail against someone, inveigh against someone, accuse them publicly and demand punishment. Sounds like they are saying that when someone is first tried in the court of public opinion, i.e. in the press, this has the effect of keeping the matter alive, and setting the stage for arresting the suspect once the evidence permits.

rufinus
Local time: 07:48
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish
PRO pts in category: 4
Login to enter a peer comment (or grade)

10 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5 peer agreement (net): +8
hue and cry/to clamor


Explanation:
http://www.wordreference.com/definition/hue_and_cry

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 12 mins (2007-11-30 14:32:35 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

The New Dictionary of Cultural Literacy, Third Edition. 2002.

hue and cry


Any loud clamor or protest intended to incite others to action: “In the 1980s, there was a great hue and cry for educational reform.”


--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 14 mins (2007-11-30 14:34:31 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

hue and cry

Encyclopædia Britannica Article

Early English legal practice of pursuing a criminal with cries and sounds of alarm. It was the duty of any person wronged or discovering a felony to raise the hue and cry, and his neighbours were bound to come and assist him in the pursuit and apprehension of the offender. All those joining in the pursuit were justified in arresting the person pursued, even if it turned…

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 16 mins (2007-11-30 14:36:45 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

Crier haro (sur quelqu'un) = to raise a hue, to raise the hue and cry = to clamor

xxxmistahara
Local time: 08:48
Native speaker of: Native in RomanianRomanian

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  Martin Cassell: agree // prefer "(to raise a) hue and cry"
18 mins
  -> Thank you, Martin. Me too.

agree  Carol Gullidge: lovely illustration from Encyclopaedia Brit!
26 mins
  -> Indeed! Thanks, Carol

agree  Ingeborg Gowans: w/ Carol; interesting article and a bit of history to learn from
28 mins
  -> Thank you, Ingeborg!

agree  xxxBourth: Quite so. See why below.
49 mins
  -> Thanks, Bourth. And thank you for your comprehensive dissertation

agree  jean-jacques alexandre
57 mins
  -> Merci, jean-jacques!

agree  Euqinimod: Ok pour "Hue and cry". In the OED:" 1. Law. Outcry calling for the pursuit of a felon, raised by the party aggrieved, by a constable, etc." and in Grand Robert: (see my note to the asker)
1 hr
  -> Thank you, Euqinimod and thanks for your follow-up

agree  Arleene McFarlane
3 hrs
  -> Thanks, Arleene

agree  Anca Nitu: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clameur_de_haro
5 hrs
  -> Thanks, Anca!
Login to enter a peer comment (or grade)

35 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5
public outrage/inveigh against sb


Explanation:
or rail against (as in Collins Robert)



Carol Gullidge
United Kingdom
Local time: 06:48
Specializes in field
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish
PRO pts in category: 35
Login to enter a peer comment (or grade)

1 hr   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5 peer agreement (net): +1
hue and cry - why?


Explanation:
haro (Dr. anc.) 1. Cri par lequel on ameutait la foule contre un coupable [that's the bit we all know about], ou anction en justice par laquelle on mettait opposition sur quelque chose.
[Larousse Lexis]

That second bit is what comes in in the second part of your quote. For the meaning of "opposition" (binding) above, you might want to do a ProZ Term Search: it has been much discussed and oft misunderstood.

Bref, once the hue-and-cry chase through the streets has ended, and if the culprit has succeeded in getting away, the "hue and cry" phenomenon can be extended into the courtroom so that if and when the culprit is caught, hue-and-cry rules will apply, not - I think - due legal process. At the very least, a courtroom "hue and cry" keeps the crime "alive" and punishable. That is what is meant by "le haro possède la faculté de prolonger le crime dans un présent artificiel propice à l’arrestation du criminel".

From Dave: “What does hue and cry mean?”
[A] This idiom, meaning a loud clamour or public outcry, contains the obsolete word hue, which people these days know only as a slightly formal or technical word for a colour or shade. As a result, you sometimes see the phrase written as hew and cry.
Our modern meaning goes back to part of English common law in the centuries after the Norman Conquest. There wasn’t an organised police force and the job of fighting crime fell mostly on ordinary people. If somebody robbed you, or you saw a murder or other crime of violence, it was up to you to raise the alarm, the hue and cry. Everybody in the neighbourhood was then obliged to drop what they were doing and help pursue and capture the supposed criminal. If the criminal was caught with stolen goods on him, he was summarily convicted (he wasn’t allowed to say anything in his defence, for example), while if he resisted arrest he could be killed. THE SAME TERM WAS USED FOR A PROCLAMATION RELATING TO THE CAPTURE OF A CRIMINAL OR THE FINDING OF STOLEN GOODS. The laws relating to hue and cry were repealed in Britain in 1827.
This mysterious word hue is from the first part of the Anglo-Norman French legal phrase hu e cri. This came from the Old French hu for an outcry, in turn from huer, to shout. It seems that hue could mean any cry, or even the sound of a horn or trumpet — the phrase hu e cri had a Latin equivalent, hutesium et clamor, “with horn and with voice”.
As an etymological footnote, the Old French huer survived in Cornwall right down to the early twentieth century. At that time an important part of local livelihoods in coastal communities came from the seasonal catch of fish called pilchards, which migrated past the coast in great shoals in early autumn. To be sure of not missing their arrival, fishermen posted lookouts on the cliffs. They were called huers, since they commonly alerted the waiting fishermen by shouting through speaking trumpets.
http://www.worldwidewords.org/qa/qa-hue1.htm

Anyone participating in hue-and-cry had the right to arrest a criminal. In this context the carrying of arms was permitted and a criminal violently resisting arrest might be killed with impunity, but not otherwise – lynchings were very rare, and even wounding or killing a criminal to hinder flight was unlawful. VICTIMS OF CONSPICUOUS CRIMES (E.G. RAPES OR ASSAULTS) MIGHT ALSO RAISE HUE-AND-CRY, EVEN IF THE CULPRIT HAD ESCAPED, IN ORDER TO SUMMON THOSE WHO COULD WITNESS THE EFFECTS OF THE CRIME
http://www.trytel.com/~tristan/towns/glossary.html

Although regulated from time to time by writs and statutes, the process of hue and cry continued to retain its summary method of procedure, and proof was not required of a culprit's guilt, but merely that he had been taken red-handed by hue and cry. The various statutes relating to hue and cry were repealed in 1827 (7 and 8 Geo. IV. c. 27). The Sheriffs Act 1887, reenacting 3 Edw. I. c. 9, provides that every person in a county must be ready and apparelled at the command of the sheriff and at the cry of the county to arrest a felon, and in default shall on conviction be liable to a fine.
"HUE AND CRY" HAS, FROM ITS ORIGINAL MEANING, COME TO BE APPLIED TO A PROCLAMATION FOR THE CAPTURE OF AN OFFENDER OR FOR THE FINDING OF STOLEN GOODS, AND TO AN OFFICIAL PUBLICATION, ISSUED FOR THE INFORMATION OF THE AUTHORITIES INTERESTED, IN WHICH PARTICULARS ARE GIVEN OF OFFENDERS "WANTED," OFFENCES COMMITTED, &c.
http://www.1911encyclopedia.org/Hue_And_Cry


--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 1 hr (2007-11-30 15:31:48 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

The French use of the historical present is misleading. As your title suggests, this is purely historical. I don't know if or when it was repealed in France, but in the UK it was in 1827.

xxxBourth
Local time: 07:48
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish
PRO pts in category: 154
Grading comment
Thanks for all these information.
Julie

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  emiledgar
6 hrs
Login to enter a peer comment (or grade)




Return to KudoZ list


KudoZ™ translation help
The KudoZ network provides a framework for translators and others to assist each other with translations or explanations of terms and short phrases.



See also: