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appartenances et dépendances

English translation: premises and outbuildings

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GLOSSARY ENTRY (DERIVED FROM QUESTION BELOW)
French term or phrase:appartenances et dépendances
English translation:premises and outbuildings
Entered by: French2English
Options:
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18:55 Sep 11, 2007
French to English translations [PRO]
Law/Patents - Law: Contract(s) / Reservation agreement/contract
French term or phrase: appartenances et dépendances
Yes, this is two terms - and they appear independently in the Kudoz glossaries. However, to me they mean the same (appurtenances) in this context so unless it is simply a question of French overstatement, I am looking for a context-specific and apt English translation for both both terms. This is taken from a contract between two parties for the purchase of a building not yet built:

La totalité de la propriété « X » d’une superficie 7HA 30A environ située à Y, consistant en un terrain nu à bâtir et faisant l’objet du titre foncier dérivé à moceller du titre foncier mère n° XX.XXX/07 telle qu’elle s’étend se poursuit et se comporte avec toutes ses ***appartenances et dépendances ***et tous les droit qui y sont rattachés sans aucune exception ni réserve.

Que la société envisage de réaliser sur un lot nu du dit lotissement une villa à usage d’habitation avec toutes ses appartenances et dépendances et tous les droits qui y sont attachés sans aucune exception ni réserve.

Cette construction qui constituera une villa fera l’objet d’un état descriptif dont une copie sera remise au RESERVATAIRE
French2English
United Kingdom
Local time: 06:41
premises and outbuildings
Explanation:
This is a term commonly used in English prooperty deeds, although appartenances really means outbuildings just as déepdances
GH-5574-Houses_Devon.htm - 29k - Cached
AskOxford: premises
ASK THE EXPERTS BETTER WRITING WORLD OF WORGLOBAL ENGLISH FOREIGN LANGUAGES ... house or building, together
with its land and outbuildings, occupied by a ...www.askoxford.com/concise_oed/premises?view=uk - 30k

Selected response from:

AllegroTrans
United Kingdom
Local time: 06:41
Grading comment
As Tony didn't want the points here (although, as usually he earned them!) I am choosing the most suitable and pertinent answer for the context. Thanks to all contributors.
4 KudoZ points were awarded for this answer

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Summary of answers provided
3 +3COMMENT ONLY, NFG
Tony M
5appurtenances
Michael Lotz
3 +1premises and outbuildings
AllegroTrans
3all its land and messuagexxxAdrian MM.
2appurtenances and appendagesxvsy


  

Answers


14 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 3/5Answerer confidence 3/5 peer agreement (net): +1
premises and outbuildings


Explanation:
This is a term commonly used in English prooperty deeds, although appartenances really means outbuildings just as déepdances
GH-5574-Houses_Devon.htm - 29k - Cached
AskOxford: premises
ASK THE EXPERTS BETTER WRITING WORLD OF WORGLOBAL ENGLISH FOREIGN LANGUAGES ... house or building, together
with its land and outbuildings, occupied by a ...www.askoxford.com/concise_oed/premises?view=uk - 30k



AllegroTrans
United Kingdom
Local time: 06:41
Specializes in field
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish
PRO pts in category: 414
Grading comment
As Tony didn't want the points here (although, as usually he earned them!) I am choosing the most suitable and pertinent answer for the context. Thanks to all contributors.

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  Mohamed Mehenoun
1 hr
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19 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 5/5
appurtenances


Explanation:
Merriam-Webster's Dictionary of Law - Cite This Source
Main Entry: ap·pur·te·nance
Pronunciation: &-'p&rt-&n-&ns
In light of the following, which implies that it includes both buildings and property rights, I would use only one English word in the plural: "APPURTENANCES ".
That would cover everything, buildings and rights together.
Yes, both French words collapse into one English one here, not uncommon in legal stuff.....
(it goes the other way too not uncommonly...)

Merriam-Webster's Dictionary of Law:
Etymology: Anglo-French apurtenance, alteration of Old French apartenance, from apartenant appurtenant
: property (as an outbuilding or fixture) or a property right (as a right of way) that is incidental to a principal property and that passes with the principal property upon sale or transfer

Michael Lotz
United States
Native speaker of: English
PRO pts in category: 239
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24 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 2/5Answerer confidence 2/5
appurtenances and appendages


Explanation:
... and it _is_ an overstatement for 'appurtenances'!

xvsy
Local time: 08:41
Native speaker of: Native in FrenchFrench
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1 hr   confidence: Answerer confidence 3/5Answerer confidence 3/5 peer agreement (net): +3
COMMENT ONLY, NFG


Explanation:
I'm not even going to propose an answer, as you've got plenty to choose from already! But I just wanted to add a little caveat, because this old chestnut keeps on cropping up.

It is important to take a much wider view of the FR word 'dépendances' than JUST 'outbuildings', and I have had this explained to me in great detail by a notaire friend who specializes in property transactions.

'dépendance' can mean almost anything that 'goes with' the property (dépend de...), very many of which we would not think of as an 'outbuilding' in EN.

For example, a laundry or utility room, often part of the main house would probably not be considered an outbuilding in EN; neither would a swimming pool, or various other outdoor amenities like a barbecue or a tennis court.

So it may be that 'appurtenances' on its own is indeed enough to cover both, but certainly, be very wary of using 'outbuildings' to translate 'dépendances' where the actual content is not known.

Having said that, it should also be noted that this is one of those standard phrases that has been used since time immemorial, and has almost lost the original significance, rather in the way that 'goods and chattels' or 'kith and kin' are used in English, without really thinking of the component parts.

Tony M
France
Local time: 07:41
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish
PRO pts in category: 317

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  Michael Lotz: agree completely with your comments
2 hrs
  -> Thanks, Michael!

agree  Assimina Vavoula: Me too... Kalimera, Tony//THANK GOD, I AM FINE. Thanks for asking. It's back-to-school time and I have a lot of issues to deal with.
8 hrs
  -> Yassou Assimina! Ti kaneis?

agree  silviantonia: Agree with the kit and caboodle of your comments
5 days
  -> Thanks, Silvia! ;-))
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3 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 3/5Answerer confidence 3/5
tous ses appartenances et dépendances
all its land and messuage


Explanation:
Exchange one 'modern' French couplet for an archaic Eng. term. In the UK, would be followed in a purchase deed, in unregd. conveyancing, by '..known as...' e.g. Little Lord Fauntleroy's Estate.




Example sentence(s):
  • to grant to the abbey of St. Agatha of Easby land and messuages. in Hudswell. .... Stephen de Harlthorpo holds all his land in BulforU ...

    Reference: http://ehr.oxfordjournals.org/cgi/reprint/XLIX/CXCIV/303.pdf
    Reference: http://deu.proz.com/kudoz/1915850
xxxAdrian MM.
Local time: 07:41
Specializes in field
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish
PRO pts in category: 348
Login to enter a peer comment (or grade)




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