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07:29 Jul 20, 2011
French to English translations [PRO] Art/Literary - Music
French term or phrase:binious
“Il l’enrubannait de flatteries et de sobriquets du meilleur cru, plutôt surprenants pour un descendant du pays des binious.”
The “pays des binious” is the Auvergne. I was working along the lines of the intention being to contrast the “floweriness” of the language he uses to flatter her, with the monotonous drone of the bagpipes. Do people from the Auvergne have a reputation for being a bit sober, dour and lacking in imagination?
Explanation: I would reject bagpipes. I don't ever recall Auvergne being known for its bagpipes, as is Bretagne, but I do play several "binious" myself in a trad folk group (flutes, clarinet...not pipes) since the word is a peasant/familiar word that tends to apply to the world of flutes and horns as well as bagpipes. The essential thing to carry over here seems to be the peasant/shepherd aspect of this gentleman's supposed birthplace. Safer with "the land of shepherd pipes", or "the land of piping shepherds," both words recalling Auvergne's heritage.
It seems like kind of a joke at the end of a sentence. It may not even refer explicitly to his coming from Auvergne for that matter. Maybe it is only a dig at his way of doing things. accidentally refferring to Brittany.
And that could be leading us all up the creek without a peddle.
Er, I think the way the phrase is turned, the reader is to be credited with the nouse of being able to get the gist of what the writer is implying. It is perfectly legitimate and sufficient to write : "... the land of the bagpipes".
Sorry, I meant someone else. I think "bagpipes" have to be included in the translation, since the author specifically refers to them and character's link with the Auvergne... it's a bit like saying that he was remarkably creative for someone from the land of such an uninspiring instrument ...
Ok therefore opposing country folk bagpipes to Parisian musette accordeon ?
In Jamie's proposal I don't see *surprenant* being translated by *superficial*
The “music” field was chosen simply because of “binious”. He is the owner of a “bal musette” establishment in Paris. In the 19th century, many of the Auvergnats who moved to Paris opened cafés and bars where people danced to the sound of “musettes de cour”. The style then evolved via Parisian and Italian accordion players. In terms of the above passage, the “plutôt surprenants” suggested the reference to “pays des binious” was perhaps a little derogatory (along the lines of Jamie's suggestion)
I agree Bourth, out of context it is difficult to fine tune. Biniou indicating folkloric music, what is the author/narrator/context? If in context there is no reference to music, it is a metaphore for the hills, the heartlands, the outback... I really don't think bagpipes are essential. Does Biniou mean that he should have been a more down do earth, basic, pratical sort of chap, rather than one to court...
Is that really so, or is the ref. to biniou the only mention of anything musical? Without fuller context, I do rather suspect this is an example of French "elegant variation" as Fowler calls it, simply a way of avoiding that repetition while - so they think - exhibiting the "depth" of their culture, in much the same was as we have Albion to avoid repeating "England", la langue de Shakespeare/Goethe/Cervantes, outre-Atlantique/Manche, le billet vert, l'Elysée/Matignon. Admittedly we DO refer to "Downing Street" or "Buckingham Palace" and the like, but we indulge in elegant (sic?) variation rather less than the French feel obliged to do, so I would be tempted to simply say "Auvergne" or "descendant of the people of the wild hills" (etc.)., very much as Laurette has suggested. C'était chouette.
... the Auvergnat takes off one jumper on August 15th (feast of the Assumption) and adds two at All Saints, so all grandpas are effectively balls of wool, used by Auvergnate grannies as pin-cushions.
My idea of an Auvergne striptease has always been that the audience would be asleep by the time the final umpteenth jumper is removed. Even then, the only cry would be "Remettez-le!" =)
Absolutely, Nikki. And there is nothing more galling than being told this by someone from Yorkshire! The Mecca of the tight fist and padlocked purse. In the words of Voltaire, shortly before his assassination during a gig in Barnsley, “Ouvrez vos portefeuilles, et vous serez libres!” Or was it Les Dawson, I forget which
Brilliant, Alison! Sacks of potatoes! The mind boggles at the criteria adopted for judging the annual "Miss Auvergne Beauty Contest". Particularly the "Spuds 'n' Swimwear" section ... Many thanks ...
It seems that they have that kind of stereotypes everywhere. The bagpipes in this case may also have to do with him being a virile man who does not usually abandone himself to frivolous courting practices but just picks a wife and marches off with her in a kind of army way (bagpipes being the instrument of the infantry). But I think a translation like 'the land of bagpipes' will do in all cases.
All around the world there are bagpipe-like intruments. Only the Scottish one got very popular, partly due to the Sir Walter Scott-Waverley-all things to do with Scotland craze (including Tartan and bagpipes).
It's where I live. The Auvergnat is (traditionally and stereotypically, of course!) one who chooses a wife more her capacity to carry sacks of potatoes, or for the fact that her family own a couple of good fields, than for prettiness, and is more taciturn than silver-tongued.
As others have said, the binou is the small, high-pitched Breton bagpipe. The pipes of the Massif Central, are more usually known as the cabrette.
Auvergne also has its pipes (like Nikki, my first thought was "Brittany" - lived there fore 25 years).
The Auvergnats do have a reputation for being dour and a bit tight-fisted with money. That's probably being as unfair to them as it is to the Scots, mind you.
The "biniou" is for me Breton. Having lived 21 years in Brittany, "biniou" is synonymous with Brittany for me and as soon as I saw "pay des binious", I thought, ah, Brittany!
OK, apart from these sudden bout of adoptive chauvism of my part, here is something where both appear :
Yes, Iread the original the same way you do, the idea of contrast., that the means of expression contrast with the dourness of someone from the land of bagpipes. ;-) (Don't ever come out with something along these lines at the Festival de Lorient and hope to get away with it!)
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countryfolk
Explanation: Binious refers directly to Brittany (as it is the Breton word for bagpipes), even though they used bagpipes in Auvergne.
My feeling is that he is opposing a form of "sophistication" that contrasts with his background in the "boondocks" as we'd say in the US.
Alexander Vialatte a famous Auvergnat was known for his curt definition, the reference below has to do with Auvergne.
Explanation: 'Land of bagpipes' may do, as I said in my discussion entry. You could also opt to call it 'land of binious' as the term is also used in English, but that requires a note. And in the end I don't think it needs to be secified just which type of bagpipes is referred to.
The phrase clearly refers to the sound as monotone and a bit 'nosey', but may also refer to his virile and direct nature as a man (a bit infantry-ish, go in, do your business and out again).
The fact that he comes from Auvergne, but is referred to as one descending from the 'pays des binious' could just indicate his somewhat 'Breton' nature, him having actual Breton ancestors or just the fact that he speaks a bit odd, maybe owing to his speaking French in an odd (occitan) accent?
There could be a number of reasons why the phrase was used, but I wouldn't generalise and do away with the bagpipes. The imiagery seems to be too suitable.
-------------------------------------------------- Note added at 5 hrs (2011-07-20 12:29:47 GMT) --------------------------------------------------
within the sound of the bagpipes / Auvergne bagpipes
Explanation: This is a play on an existing expression: in London we have an expression (which is widely known throughout UK also), which describes somebody born in a particular area of East London.
Maybe you could say "under the sound of the bagpipes" as well as an alternative, but "within" is more commonly used here.
-------------------------------------------------- Note added at 5 hrs (2011-07-20 12:54:51 GMT) --------------------------------------------------
So the complete phrase would read:
"..., especially surprising for somebody born under/within the sound of the Auvergne bagpipes"
-------------------------------------------------- Note added at 5 hrs (2011-07-20 12:56:56 GMT) --------------------------------------------------
Using "Auvergne" before bagpipes would also avoid risking any confusion that could be caused to the English reader in connection with Scottish bagpipes - which are more commonly known in UK than French bagpipes I presume.
LaraBarnett United Kingdom Local time: 07:01 Works in field Native speaker of: English
Explanation: This could be a possibility if you are looking to contrast the 'floweriness' of his language compared to the typical qualities associated with someone from that region.
'....rather superficial for a descendant from a country known for its bagpipes'
I think 'a country known for bagpipes' would illustrate the contrast well.
Explanation: I would reject bagpipes. I don't ever recall Auvergne being known for its bagpipes, as is Bretagne, but I do play several "binious" myself in a trad folk group (flutes, clarinet...not pipes) since the word is a peasant/familiar word that tends to apply to the world of flutes and horns as well as bagpipes. The essential thing to carry over here seems to be the peasant/shepherd aspect of this gentleman's supposed birthplace. Safer with "the land of shepherd pipes", or "the land of piping shepherds," both words recalling Auvergne's heritage.
Lynn Couty France Local time: 08:01 Works in field Native speaker of: English PRO pts in category: 4
The translation workplace 
peer agreement (net): +1
